First-time extractor from Australia looking for advice

[reun]

Greetings, this is my first post, and I hope it will be followed by many more.

I'm looking for advice, and I hope that you may be able to help. Mostly finding the right solvent, but I have a few other questions.

I'm planning to use the tek from this video (I'm not sure if this tek has a recognisable name). In short, the presenter mixes sodium hydroxide with water, adds MHRBs, then adds naphtha into the mix to separate out the DMT, before collecting the layer of DMT-infused naphtha. I have the MHRB, but here is where I'm struggling:

• The biggest problem -- VM&P Naphtha: in Australia, they call this "shellite", so I got some Diggers Shellite from a hardware store, but unfortunately, it failed the evaporation test. From what I understand other options include Zippo lighter fluid, n-heptane, xylene, limonene, toluene and a few rarer chemicals --apparently all of these have their own gotchas and I'm not sure if they are compatible with my desired technique. Some of these are available in hardware stores, others like n-heptane can only be obtained from a specialist lab, and I'd be worried about ordering it from there because of how suspicious it might look. If Zippo would work, it would be great, because I believe that it can be a drop-in replacement for naphtha for the tek in the video. My next move is to get Zippo and run an evap test on that.
• Sodium Hydroxide purity: I've found Diggers Caustic Soda which, according to the packaging is 98% sodium hydroxide and according to the product information sheet is ">99% sodium hydroxide". I'm not sure if this is something I need to worry about. From what I understand, Sodium Hydroxide may often be mixed with sodium carbonate, moisture and sodium chloride. Still, I wanted to double check that it is safe to use
• Vape cartridges: remarkably, it appears to be difficult to find a vape cartridge in Australia. The only suitable options I've found is BrandMyDispo which ships internationally, but if anyone has any better suggestions, then I'd love to hear from you. I was planning to pair it up with a Yocan KODO Pro 510 Thread Battery, which can be sourced easily, it seems.

So, in summary, first and foremost, I would really appreciate some advice on the solvent situation -- what is the right kind, where to get it, whether or not it will work with the tek from the video and whether there are any special disposal considerations*. Beyond that, I'd like a sense check on the caustic soda thing and vape cartridge recommendations.

Lastly, regarding disposal: I understand that if I have a mixture of distilled water with caustic soda and remnants of MHRB in a flask, I shouldn't just flush it down the drain, I understand that I need to dilute this mixture with vinegar to reach 1:1 ratio, and I need to do that slowly -- this should bring pH to neutral level and then I will be able to dispose of it. This isn't covered in the tek, so I had to do some digging on my own, and I'm not sure if I got that right, so if you have any recommendations on that, I'd love to hear about that too!

Thank you so much for reading and thank you in advance for your advice!

 

[Transform]

Lastly, regarding disposal: I understand that if I have a mixture of distilled water with caustic soda and remnants of MHRB in a flask, I shouldn't just flush it down the drain

Well, the sodium hydroxide is sold as a drain cleaner - but if you don't have fatty accumulations in your plugholes neutralisation could be considered polite.

Another option - if you have somewhere it can be left safely - is to spread the sludge out on a large tray and simply let the stuff dry out. Carbon dioxide from the air will neutralise excess alkalinity, plus naphtha residues will safely evaporate into "nature's dustbin", as your fellow countryman and most famous expletive-wielding garage chemist would put it.

Sodium hydroxide itself is never going to arrive at anything above 98% on delivery exactly on account of this propens«ty to absorb CO₂ and moisture from the air, unless you're willing to spend silly money on hermetically-sealed vials from a lab specialist. That, obviously, would be wholly superfluous for your use-case. Your main concern should be that it's free from, say, random metals contamination, and that it's reasonably fresh.

Owing to my location on the opposite side of the planet, I'm not well-versed in the current availability of hydrocarbon solvents in Australia. Zippo seems like it's worth a shot if it passes the evap test. Beyond that, you'd do well to get elbows deep in researching the various applications of unadulterated hydrocarbon solvents, along with all the diverse synonyms for naphtha.

One further option is switching up your initial approach entirely and checking out the only slightly experimental "TnT" vodka limetek, although the final piece in the jigsaw puzzle there would be working out how to turn it into acceptable cart juice - something I believe to be relatively easily achievable - if you were up for the challenge.

Entirely understandable if you'd prefer to stick with a more established method, of course!


Aand… welcome to the Nexus!

 

[MrAcuminata]

Greetings, this is my first post, and I hope it will be followed by many more.

I'm looking for advice, and I hope that you may be able to help. Mostly finding the right solvent, but I have a few other questions.

I'm planning to use the tek from this video (I'm not sure if this tek has a recognisable name). In short, the presenter mixes sodium hydroxide with water, adds MHRBs, then adds naphtha into the mix to separate out the DMT, before collecting the layer of DMT-infused naphtha. I have the MHRB, but here is where I'm struggling:

• The biggest problem -- VM&P Naphtha: in Australia, they call this "shellite", so I got some Diggers Shellite from a hardware store, but unfortunately, it failed the evaporation test. From what I understand other options include Zippo lighter fluid, n-heptane, xylene, limonene, toluene and a few rarer chemicals --apparently all of these have their own gotchas and I'm not sure if they are compatible with my desired technique. Some of these are available in hardware stores, others like n-heptane can only be obtained from a specialist lab, and I'd be worried about ordering it from there because of how suspicious it might look. If Zippo would work, it would be great, because I believe that it can be a drop-in replacement for naphtha for the tek in the video. My next move is to get Zippo and run an evap test on that.
• Sodium Hydroxide purity: I've found Diggers Caustic Soda which, according to the packaging is 98% sodium hydroxide and according to the product information sheet is ">99% sodium hydroxide". I'm not sure if this is something I need to worry about. From what I understand, Sodium Hydroxide may often be mixed with sodium carbonate, moisture and sodium chloride. Still, I wanted to double check that it is safe to use
• Vape cartridges: remarkably, it appears to be difficult to find a vape cartridge in Australia. The only suitable options I've found is BrandMyDispo which ships internationally, but if anyone has any better suggestions, then I'd love to hear from you. I was planning to pair it up with a Yocan KODO Pro 510 Thread Battery, which can be sourced easily, it seems.

So, in summary, first and foremost, I would really appreciate some advice on the solvent situation -- what is the right kind, where to get it, whether or not it will work with the tek from the video and whether there are any special disposal considerations*. Beyond that, I'd like a sense check on the caustic soda thing and vape cartridge recommendations.

Lastly, regarding disposal: I understand that if I have a mixture of distilled water with caustic soda and remnants of MHRB in a flask, I shouldn't just flush it down the drain, I understand that I need to dilute this mixture with vinegar to reach 1:1 ratio, and I need to do that slowly -- this should bring pH to neutral level and then I will be able to dispose of it. This isn't covered in the tek, so I had to do some digging on my own, and I'm not sure if I got that right, so if you have any recommendations on that, I'd love to hear about that too!

Thank you so much for reading and thank you in advance for your advice!

I have also recently popped my extraction cherry in Australia. Hardware Shellite is unfortunately not a good option these days, I've managed to achieve white crystals from using it but there is always solvent contamination left behind. I too am planning to try premium zippo fluid which should be available at most smoke shops, fingers crossed there. My current workaround is to simply use the crystals to make enhanced leaf using isopropyl alcohol and mullein leaves. This is arguably more viable to do in Australia anyway as vape setups here are so hard to come by, and my enhanced leaf produced a strong effect with only half a regular cone through a regular bong, smooth as butter a well. I expect a full breakthrough with a full cone. The other option is to do your final pulls using d-linonene, but since you cannot freeze precip with it, the final result will more than likely be goo form, which is safe and pure but hard to deal with for weighing and handling. You could take the risk of ordering lab heptane and using it for recrystallisation but i agree that's sus and wouldn't do it myself. I have also heard that specialist companies such as Sydney Solvents' versions of Shellite are still not of the required purity and fail evap tests. I plan to eventually make a trip and test this myself sometime soon.

 

[reun]

Well, the sodium hydroxide is sold as a drain cleaner - but if you don't have fatty accumulations in your plugholes neutralisation could be considered polite.

Another option - if you have somewhere it can be left safely - is to spread the sludge out on a large tray and simply let the stuff dry out. Carbon dioxide from the air will neutralise excess alkalinity, plus naphtha residues will safely evaporate into "nature's dustbin", as your fellow countryman and most famous expletive-wielding garage chemist would put it.

Sodium hydroxide itself is never going to arrive at anything above 98% on delivery exactly on account of this propens«ty to absorb CO₂ and moisture from the air, unless you're willing to spend silly money on hermetically-sealed vials from a lab specialist. That, obviously, would be wholly superfluous for your use-case. Your main concern should be that it's free from, say, random metals contamination, and that it's reasonably fresh.

Owing to my location on the opposite side of the planet, I'm not well-versed in the current availability of hydrocarbon solvents in Australia. Zippo seems like it's worth a shot if it passes the evap test. Beyond that, you'd do well to get elbows deep in researching the various applications of unadulterated hydrocarbon solvents, along with all the diverse synonyms for naphtha.

One further option is switching up your initial approach entirely and checking out the only slightly experimental "TnT" vodka limetek, although the final piece in the jigsaw puzzle there would be working out how to turn it into acceptable cart juice - something I believe to be relatively easily achievable - if you were up for the challenge.

Entirely understandable if you'd prefer to stick with a more established method, of course!


Aand… welcome to the Nexus!

Transform, thank you for your warm welcome and a thoughtful response!

I'm glad that I could at least handle the caustic soda problem as well as the waste disposal problem.

The solvent problem remains, though. I got some Zippo lighter fluid, ran an evaporation test on it, and it failed.

I've looked into other accessible solvents like xylene, toluene and d-limonene, which are seemingly used by some people, but from what I understand, they do not freeze-precipitate effectively, meaning that they can generate DMT fumurate that is suitable for pharmahuasca, but not the freebase DMT suitable for smoking. I thought that finding MHRB was going to be the biggest hurdle here, but it looks like finding a suitable solvent is the main problem.

It looks like I can buy heptane from a chemical supplier like WestLab, but I am seriously concerned that it may trigger some warning flags -- a regular household buying lab-grade hazardous chemicals like this would raise eyebrows.

I've hit a roadblock. If anyone has any recommendations, I'd love to hear from you, otherwise, I may post an update later

 

[blig-blug]

Do you have access to ethyl acetate? If so, I find HIELO - DMT-Nexus Wiki to be an easy and effective tek.

 

[reun]

Do you have access to ethyl acetate? If so, I find HIELO - DMT-Nexus Wiki to be an easy and effective tek.

Thank you for the suggestion! I understand this process could extract DMT salt e-juice, but it's not smokable like freebase DMT, right? I would love to find a tek that could get freebase DMT.

 

[blig-blug]

Thank you for the suggestion! I understand this process could extract DMT salt e-juice, but it's not smokable like freebase DMT, right? I would love to find a tek that could get freebase DMT.

It indeed would be for e-juice. With the right setup it's just as effective as smoking freebase, but I understand if you prefer another way.

Another option (again, not to smoke pure freebase) would be to extract doing CIELO, using d-limonene, or something similar. And then freebase the resulting salt in isopropyl alcohol or water. This would not result in DMT crystals but in (DMT freebase) goo, but that goo could be used to make changa or enhanced leaf (DMT-infused herbs).

Sorry about not being able to help in finding the right solvent, I'm in Spain so I have no clue of what's available in Australia.

 

[Animistic]

Aussie here. I've had the same issue with shellite, very thin white film on evaporation, which I only learned during an extraction Planning to back salt, use xylene to pull out the gunk and then base and use xylene, I'm hoping for something I can add to pg and vape.

Xylene is totally fine, it's not just for fumarate. It has a few drawbacks though. It stinks to high hell, you have to evaporate rather than freeze precip, it takes much longer to evaporate than shellite and it is less selective as a solvent than shellite, you'll likely end up with a goo as @blig-blug describes above. It will absolutely result in a smokable freebase result though.

 

[TransistorBass]

Dumb question - If it doesn't pass the Evap test is it considered bad for Freeze Precipitation - or - Is it considered bad only for full evaporation of the solvent due to the residue left behind?

 

[Animistic]

I found with my stuff that when I freeze precipitated it and left the residual shellite to evap.off that I got a thin film of white powder, then went back and evap tested it only to find it was in the solvent to begin with. It might be benign but I'm not taking chances.

 

[blig-blug]

Dumb question - If it doesn't pass the Evap test is it considered bad for Freeze Precipitation - or - Is it considered bad only for full evaporation of the solvent due to the residue left behind?

It's considered unsafe in general, as it means there's some non-volatile impurity that it's being left behind. Without being able to identify the impurity, it's a bad idea to use it because the impurity will be present in the end product and it may be dangerous.

 

[blig-blug]

Xylene is totally fine, it's not just for fumarate. It has a few drawbacks though. It stinks to high hell, you have to evaporate rather than freeze precip, it takes much longer to evaporate than shellite and it is less selective as a solvent than shellite, you'll likely end up with a goo as @blig-blug describes above. It will absolutely result in a smokable freebase result though.

True. In the same way, you can use ethyl acetate and follow CIELO up to the salting step, then evaporate the solvent. The drawback compared to xylene is that it will be necessary to evaporate much more solvent (more EA is required), on the positive side, EA has very low toxicity. Not saying doing it with EA is preferable, just pointing out that it's an option.

 

[Animistic]

True. In the same way, you can use ethyl acetate and follow CIELO up to the salting step, then evaporate the solvent. The drawback compared to xylene is that it will be necessary to evaporate much more solvent (more EA is required), on the positive side, EA has very low toxicity. Not saying doing it with EA is preferable, just pointing out that it's an option.

Honestly if EA was easier to get in Aus over the counter Id use it because of the toxicity.

 

[TransistorBass]

I found with my stuff that when I freeze precipitated it and left the residual shellite to evap.off that I got a thin film of white powder, then went back and evap tested it only to find it was in the solvent to begin with. It might be benign but I'm not taking chances.

It's considered unsafe in general, as it means there's some non-volatile impurity that it's being left behind. Without being able to identify the impurity, it's a bad idea to use it because the impurity will be present in the end product and it may be dangerous.

Not that I've ever done a Evaporation test on purpose, the stuff I've been using doesn't seem to leave a residue in the glass beaker that I use to measure it when left to dry.

 

[reun]

First, I'm glad to see people tuning into this discussion. Thank you all for your interest and willingness to help!

I have a few more options to try:

• There is a Reddit thread here talking about problems with Diggers shellite, but apparently they had better luck with Bosca (different brand)
• I've also found Sceneys quality shellite which is designed for art restoration -- chances are that it will be better
• It looks like there are some shady chemistry suppliers who are willing to sell product to residential addresses (most reputable ones demand a business registration number), so I could get n-heptane from a place like Lab Supply or Pure Science, but I am highly reluctant to do so. First, this is a dangerous good, and delivering it will require a specialised courier, so this operation might look quite dramatic. Additionally, I'm worried about triggering some alarms with this move

So, my plan is to buy Sceneys and hope for the best. If that doesn't work, I'll try Bosca. If that doesn't work, then I'd like to find some intel on whether anyone else managed to procure any goods from industrial chemistry labs and go from there.

 

[MrAcuminata]

Aussie here. I've had the same issue with shellite, very thin white film on evaporation, which I only learned during an extraction Planning to back salt, use xylene to pull out the gunk and then base and use xylene, I'm hoping for something I can add to pg and vape.

Xylene is totally fine, it's not just for fumarate. It has a few drawbacks though. It stinks to high hell, you have to evaporate rather than freeze precip, it takes much longer to evaporate than shellite and it is less selective as a solvent than shellite, you'll likely end up with a goo as @blig-blug describes above. It will absolutely result in a smokable freebase result though.

Are you using Diggers Xylene? I'm planning a batch tomorrow and have been using it for the first pulls of my tek, but I haven't actually evap tested it before because I'm doing a mini a/b after and those first pulls don't have to be clean. If it fails evap test (will do that tomorrow) then wouldn't slow evapping the final product with xylene be just as toxic as the shellite? Worse even? My current solution for the solvent crisis in Australia is to simply use the shellite-crystals to make enhanced leaf with isopropyl alcohol and mullein leaves. The other option is to do the final pulls after clean up steps with d-limonene to produce a safe and pure goo which can either be vaped or also used for leaf blends

 

[blig-blug]

have been using it for the first pulls of my tek, but I haven't actually evap tested it before because I'm doing a mini a/b after and those first pulls don't have to be clean

Are you sure? For all you know, the residue could still end up in the final solvent after the mini A/B. Without knowing what it is, one can't know that this is not the case. Unless I'm missing something.

Not that I've ever done a Evaporation test on purpose

It's a good idea to do it even if using the same product because purity between batches can vary, unless using analytical-grade material or something like that. It's quick and easy anyways, you only need a drop of product. Takes a few minutes.

First, this is a dangerous good, and delivering it will require a specialised courier, so this operation might look quite dramatic

I don't know if there are different regulations in Australia, but here in Spain it's delivered as any other package.

Don't worry much about brand names. What you need to find is a hydrocarbon product composed mostly of C6-C7. I'd go to a hardware store and read the labels of different lighter/camping fluids, paint thinners, etc. Once you have found what seems to be a suitable product, perform an evap test on it. This is likely to be easier than finding a specific suitable product online, by name.

wouldn't slow evapping the final product with xylene be just as toxic as the shellite? Worse even?

AFAIK xylene is more toxic, but I may be wrong.