EternalPeace
Rising Star
Ah, I thought I saw synthetic filter disks on top, so I was wondering why the extra layer.The Grateful One said:
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Grow log updates (Sclerotia) / "Best" Spore syringe storage
- Thread starter TGO
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EternalPeace
Rising Star
Synthetic filter disks, definitely. You'll see what I mean after you hold them in your hand. These things are built to last. Downside is that they are like $10 each, so buying enough to run multiple batches brings you into the $100s.
EternalPeace
Rising Star
EternalPeace
Rising Star
Cool, it worked. This is my second batch, Mexicana ATL7, monoculture isolated, G2Ged from master on 5/17/2015, so they are about three months old now! Wow, I didn't think they were that old yet. My babies are growing up so fast...
Picture 1: The drawer full of goodies. Note that after seeing how most of the stones were forming in the bottom of the first batch, I decided to do something no one had mentioned trying before--laying them on their side to increase the bottom surface area. Kind of like how RogerRabbit said that laying bags on their sides, keeping the grain about two inches thick, tended to produce the best results. I noticed while harvesting my first batch, that nothing grows in the thick middle area.
Picture 2: Tried to give you an inside view, to show how it's a big mass of white, which was unlike my first grow. It didn't get like this. (Was Mex A though, maybe that's why.) This happened very quickly, it spread itself like fluffernutter all over the place in about a week. Unfortunately, the camera could not see through the glass no matter how I tried to take this one. (It is quite clear in person, I can see down into it and see the hills and valleys, etc.)
Picture 3: Side view, showing the noticable stone formations towards the bottom, and the condensation hanging from the top. I try not to disturb them, and cause the water to run down onto the colonization, because I don't think they like direct contact with that much water. I open and close the drawer very slowly, lol.
Picture 4: Jar bottom view (not really the bottom). Note the stone formation to the middle left. Looks just like a walnut that got stuck in the jar.
There is some considerable darkening that stretches thinly towards the top, which I am wondering about. There is much more in other jars, but I didn't take close ups of those because it blocks the view inside. It's the same color as stone growth, but can't be, because it's very thin. Maybe it's a structure designed to funnel moisture from the top down to the colonization?
Picture 1: The drawer full of goodies. Note that after seeing how most of the stones were forming in the bottom of the first batch, I decided to do something no one had mentioned trying before--laying them on their side to increase the bottom surface area. Kind of like how RogerRabbit said that laying bags on their sides, keeping the grain about two inches thick, tended to produce the best results. I noticed while harvesting my first batch, that nothing grows in the thick middle area.
Picture 2: Tried to give you an inside view, to show how it's a big mass of white, which was unlike my first grow. It didn't get like this. (Was Mex A though, maybe that's why.) This happened very quickly, it spread itself like fluffernutter all over the place in about a week. Unfortunately, the camera could not see through the glass no matter how I tried to take this one. (It is quite clear in person, I can see down into it and see the hills and valleys, etc.)
Picture 3: Side view, showing the noticable stone formations towards the bottom, and the condensation hanging from the top. I try not to disturb them, and cause the water to run down onto the colonization, because I don't think they like direct contact with that much water. I open and close the drawer very slowly, lol.
Picture 4: Jar bottom view (not really the bottom). Note the stone formation to the middle left. Looks just like a walnut that got stuck in the jar.
There is some considerable darkening that stretches thinly towards the top, which I am wondering about. There is much more in other jars, but I didn't take close ups of those because it blocks the view inside. It's the same color as stone growth, but can't be, because it's very thin. Maybe it's a structure designed to funnel moisture from the top down to the colonization?
EternalPeace
Rising Star
These are three months old, which means that I *could* harvest them, but it would be rather premature. I'm going to let them sit for three more months at least.
TGO
Music is alive and in your soul. It can move you.
Awesome info, thank you!
So if I were to lay my jars on their sides, this would increase the surface area and, in theory, increase yield? That is pretty nifty!
So you let your jars sit for at least 6 months? How long can they go for? Eventually they will run out of space and substrate otherwise they could go for quite a while I'd imagine.
I was thinking I'd leave mine for at least 4 months because my girlfriend's birthday is in November and she has never had the pleasure of having a potent psilocin/psilocybin journey. I mean she has had mushrooms before but never anything decent. Once I tried my own homegrown, I never want to get them from anywhere else because it just isn't worth it. :d
But I may just wait a full 6 months. It doesn't really matter, I'm a patient fellow! And the reward and sense of accomplishment at the end of a grow is well worth the wait!!!
So if I were to lay my jars on their sides, this would increase the surface area and, in theory, increase yield? That is pretty nifty!
So you let your jars sit for at least 6 months? How long can they go for? Eventually they will run out of space and substrate otherwise they could go for quite a while I'd imagine.
I was thinking I'd leave mine for at least 4 months because my girlfriend's birthday is in November and she has never had the pleasure of having a potent psilocin/psilocybin journey. I mean she has had mushrooms before but never anything decent. Once I tried my own homegrown, I never want to get them from anywhere else because it just isn't worth it. :d
But I may just wait a full 6 months. It doesn't really matter, I'm a patient fellow! And the reward and sense of accomplishment at the end of a grow is well worth the wait!!!
EternalPeace
Rising Star
That's the theory, anyway.The Grateful One said:
Just figured I'd try it and see how it goes.I think that they can be harvested at the earliest at three months, are fully matured at six months, but can continue growing and becoming more potent for many months after that. I have heard numbers of nine months to a year should be OK. (I think that's from Violet's tek.)The Grateful One said:
Mine were finally harvested at eight months, and I'm pretty sure they were still growing at that point. There was definitely uneaten grain left in there. (The centers had plenty of unused grain. All the remains are sitting in a bucket as a side experiment right now.) That batch was multispore though, so maybe the slowness is why it was still going and not done.
That sounds wonderful! I *would* say to crack open only one of them, to allow the rest to continue growing, but I found out the hard way that this is not a good idea. The stones have random potency, or at least mine did. First trip underpowered, second trip overpowered... Had to harvest them all and grind them up to standardize the potency for proper dosing. (So far so good btw, I haven't written about that yet.)The Grateful One said:
I recommend being patient, at the very least so that you can standardize. But you can be brave and see how it goes, which would be adventurous.The Grateful One said:
TGO
Music is alive and in your soul. It can move you.
Okay, so I've turned 4 of my 9 jars on their side just to see what will happen in comparison to the upright jars...
By the way, thank you EternalPeace, for your contributions and interest in this. I'm looking to grow the amount of information found on the Nexus about mushrooms and truffles and everything in between from the perspective of the "average joe"...:lol: :lol: :lol:
By the way, thank you EternalPeace, for your contributions and interest in this. I'm looking to grow the amount of information found on the Nexus about mushrooms and truffles and everything in between from the perspective of the "average joe"...:lol: :lol: :lol:
EternalPeace
Rising Star
Nice experiment!The Grateful One said:Okay, so I've turned 4 of my 9 jars on their side just to see what will happen in comparison to the upright jars...
By the way, thank you EternalPeace, for your contributions and interest in this. I'm looking to grow the amount of information found on the Nexus about mushrooms and truffles and everything in between from the perspective of the "average joe"...:lol: :lol: :lol:
You are welcome!
EternalPeace
Rising Star
Here's my standardized product from the first batch. Drying in a pan with a rather musty mushroomy smell that *could* make you gag at how strong it is. You wouldn't want to put your nose close to that pan.
Came out to be 483 grams. Harvest average was about 50g per jar, rounding down. Kind of low I think, but plenty to play with while my next batch is growing.
According to the Shroomery calculator, I should be taking 3.26g to achieve a level 3. Tried that, didn't get me more than a feeling. Doubled it to 7g on another day, same thing. Apparently my first batch is very weak! I get the dreamy happy feeling, without nausea, and can go about my day uninhibited. It's actually quite fun. Looking for more though, so the next step will be 14g.
Came out to be 483 grams. Harvest average was about 50g per jar, rounding down. Kind of low I think, but plenty to play with while my next batch is growing.
According to the Shroomery calculator, I should be taking 3.26g to achieve a level 3. Tried that, didn't get me more than a feeling. Doubled it to 7g on another day, same thing. Apparently my first batch is very weak!
I get the dreamy happy feeling, without nausea, and can go about my day uninhibited. It's actually quite fun. Looking for more though, so the next step will be 14g.Attachments
TGO
Music is alive and in your soul. It can move you.
Interesting, sounds like a decent yield to me! I have a couple questions:
What are your thoughts on fresh vs. dried?
What, if any, are the potency variations between the two?
What is your preferred way to administer the standardized powder/product?
What are your thoughts on fresh vs. dried?
What, if any, are the potency variations between the two?
What is your preferred way to administer the standardized powder/product?
EternalPeace
Rising Star
I think a good yield is 100-150g per jar. Hopefully I get something like that next time.
Trying them fresh didn't work out, so I don't know for sure what fresh would be like. I'm chalking it up to a beginner mistake, possibly to try again some other time. I tried eating them fresh, just tossing wet nuggets into my mouth, nom nom nom swallow grimace, and they came riiiight back up shortly thereafter in a massively disgusting purge. You know the kind, where the purging itself is so disgusting that it makes you purge again even though you don't really need to anymore, and it becomes a vicious cycle, until you are in pain from dry heaving? ME NOT WANT EAT FRESH AFTER THAT. lol Possible contamination I am guessing? Or are they really that bad on your stomach when fresh?
I've always dried them in a food dehydrator after that, so that's mostly the experience I have.
Wet vs dry: Shouldn't be much difference in potency, assuming you are taking more fresh then dry to make up for the water weight difference (2/3 water when fresh), and assuming the preparation isn't destroying any of the desired alkaloids. It's the same psilocybin molecule in both.
Preferred method of administration is tea! I think the process might be a bit lossy, but it works to remove or greatly reduce the nausea problem. I'm going to try to koolaid idea next.
Trying them fresh didn't work out, so I don't know for sure what fresh would be like. I'm chalking it up to a beginner mistake, possibly to try again some other time. I tried eating them fresh, just tossing wet nuggets into my mouth, nom nom nom swallow grimace, and they came riiiight back up shortly thereafter in a massively disgusting purge. You know the kind, where the purging itself is so disgusting that it makes you purge again even though you don't really need to anymore, and it becomes a vicious cycle, until you are in pain from dry heaving? ME NOT WANT EAT FRESH AFTER THAT. lol Possible contamination I am guessing? Or are they really that bad on your stomach when fresh?
I've always dried them in a food dehydrator after that, so that's mostly the experience I have.
Wet vs dry: Shouldn't be much difference in potency, assuming you are taking more fresh then dry to make up for the water weight difference (2/3 water when fresh), and assuming the preparation isn't destroying any of the desired alkaloids. It's the same psilocybin molecule in both.
Preferred method of administration is tea! I think the process might be a bit lossy, but it works to remove or greatly reduce the nausea problem. I'm going to try to koolaid idea next.
TGO
Music is alive and in your soul. It can move you.
Ahh, okay!
So fresh are pretty disgusting then?
I'm not really a fan of any mushroom flavor (culinary or otherwise) and I was thinking of drying mine mainly for ease of storage.
Do you think, perhaps, that the dehydrator may have caused a loss in potency due to heat? Like you said, the tea method may result in overall potency decrease so it stands to reason that a dehydrator could do the same thing? When I was growing/fruiting cubes I would place the wet mushies at an angle on a screen and have a fan blow on them until they were cracker dry and they were very potent!
I have a dehydrator but I am a little skeptical on using it for drying truffles/mushrooms (it only has one setting and no temperature gauge so I have no idea what temp it operates at....the manual gave a general guideline but... ).
Have you worked with any other truffle producing species besides your Mexicana ATL7?
So fresh are pretty disgusting then?
I'm not really a fan of any mushroom flavor (culinary or otherwise) and I was thinking of drying mine mainly for ease of storage. Do you think, perhaps, that the dehydrator may have caused a loss in potency due to heat? Like you said, the tea method may result in overall potency decrease so it stands to reason that a dehydrator could do the same thing? When I was growing/fruiting cubes I would place the wet mushies at an angle on a screen and have a fan blow on them until they were cracker dry and they were very potent!
I have a dehydrator but I am a little skeptical on using it for drying truffles/mushrooms (it only has one setting and no temperature gauge so I have no idea what temp it operates at....the manual gave a general guideline but...
). Have you worked with any other truffle producing species besides your Mexicana ATL7?
EternalPeace
Rising Star
Fresh aren't as disgusting as cactus tea, but they sure aren't easy. They have a sour/tangy/sweet taste on top of the usual mushroom flavor. I'm not a fan of mushrooms either. The only time I eat them is when I'm doing this.
I'm thinking the dehydrator and the hot water are not causing a problem. The melting point of psilocybin is 173-176C, water boils at 100C, and I dehydrate at 35C (95F, lowest setting). Two problems that *can* cause potency loss:
(1) Inefficiency of tea process, leaving psilocybin in the mushroom material. Easily solvable by increasing the amount of mushroom material.
(2) Possible PH issue causing damage to psilocybin. Apparently it breaks down when exposed to a basic environment, which is why people recommend adding lemon juice to the tea.
Hmm, dehydrator with no thermostat? I suppose you could use a thermometer to estimate it's heat output.
Currently I have only growing and consumption experience with Mexicana A, my first try. My second try is with Mexicana ATL7, of which I have growing experience only so far. I tried to get Panaeolus Goliath isolated on agar, but it failed spectacularly. (That was some crazy looking red stuff, would have been cool to see it in jars.)
Honestly, I can't say how much real consumption experience I have with Mex A, since I can't be sure it grew right. My second batch is growing so differently that I suspect the first batch was flawed somehow.
I'm thinking the dehydrator and the hot water are not causing a problem. The melting point of psilocybin is 173-176C, water boils at 100C, and I dehydrate at 35C (95F, lowest setting). Two problems that *can* cause potency loss:
(1) Inefficiency of tea process, leaving psilocybin in the mushroom material. Easily solvable by increasing the amount of mushroom material.
(2) Possible PH issue causing damage to psilocybin. Apparently it breaks down when exposed to a basic environment, which is why people recommend adding lemon juice to the tea.
Hmm, dehydrator with no thermostat? I suppose you could use a thermometer to estimate it's heat output.
Currently I have only growing and consumption experience with Mexicana A, my first try. My second try is with Mexicana ATL7, of which I have growing experience only so far. I tried to get Panaeolus Goliath isolated on agar, but it failed spectacularly. (That was some crazy looking red stuff, would have been cool to see it in jars.)
Honestly, I can't say how much real consumption experience I have with Mex A, since I can't be sure it grew right. My second batch is growing so differently that I suspect the first batch was flawed somehow.
TGO
Music is alive and in your soul. It can move you.
Alright, that makes a lot of sense! Since my dehydrator is weird, I'll probably just go with fan drying. I don't know why there is no thermostat...you would think that would be a given with dehydrators. But what would I know? :lol:
I have really only grown Golden Teachers a handful of times before this so this will be my first experience with growing and enjoying truffles! On a similar note, I do have a syringe with Golden Teachers spores so I am debating whether or not to start those or to just wait til after the truffle situation!
Also, some people have taken their truffle forming species and put them in casings or fruiting chambers or what have you...I was thinking about trying this with a jar or two so I can compare the differences!
I have really only grown Golden Teachers a handful of times before this so this will be my first experience with growing and enjoying truffles! On a similar note, I do have a syringe with Golden Teachers spores so I am debating whether or not to start those or to just wait til after the truffle situation!
Also, some people have taken their truffle forming species and put them in casings or fruiting chambers or what have you...I was thinking about trying this with a jar or two so I can compare the differences!
TGO
Music is alive and in your soul. It can move you.
NOOOOOOOO! One jar is sick with a green mold... and another is showing signs of the same green mold. Threw those out. Down to 7 jars...
Oh well, nothing is perfect. One of the pieces of tape (perhaps a contam stuck to the tape) covering the tyvek holes came loose so that may have something to do with it. I thought I was very sterile while inoculating but obviously something got in. That is why I do many jars at once because I've lost some jars in the past.
The other jars appear to be fine with no signs of green mold. Here is a pic. Eww...
Oh well, nothing is perfect. One of the pieces of tape (perhaps a contam stuck to the tape) covering the tyvek holes came loose so that may have something to do with it. I thought I was very sterile while inoculating but obviously something got in. That is why I do many jars at once because I've lost some jars in the past.
The other jars appear to be fine with no signs of green mold. Here is a pic. Eww...
Attachments
EternalPeace
Rising Star
I guess it's not too important to regulate the temperature if you're just dehydrating simple foods. You can upgrade to a Nesco though, they aren't really very expensive. I recommend buying a ton of expansion trays for it though, if you're going to work with cactus at all.
I'd start the cubes on the side, kind of like hedging your investment. If I could, I would, but I can't do anything out in the open. Well, without getting complicated with the setup, which I'd rather not do. (Some elaborate ninja camouflaged deal, looks like way too much work, and would probably still stand out here anyway.)
Yes, fruiting my leftover substrate is the next step. Got it all planned out, how to do it from beginning to end. Just haven't gotten to that step yet. Currently my Mex A leftovers are sitting in a bucket, which I'm watching curiously to see what they do.
I'd start the cubes on the side, kind of like hedging your investment. If I could, I would, but I can't do anything out in the open. Well, without getting complicated with the setup, which I'd rather not do. (Some elaborate ninja camouflaged deal, looks like way too much work, and would probably still stand out here anyway.)
Yes, fruiting my leftover substrate is the next step. Got it all planned out, how to do it from beginning to end. Just haven't gotten to that step yet. Currently my Mex A leftovers are sitting in a bucket, which I'm watching curiously to see what they do.
EternalPeace
Rising Star
Yeah, I saw that when the page loaded and said "oh crap". Sorry you lost that jar to trich. Hopefully the rest are OK.