How do bad experiences occur on DMT?

[Tsuchinoko]

I've not done DMT yet, but I know they say setting is vital, as well as how you feel going in to.

But as far as I am aware; when one is under the effects of DMT, no matter how intense the experience may be, the conscious mind stays intact.

If one can consciously let go, and simply observe what is occurring during the experience; and one's body is in a safe environment - in what way could bad experience occur, no matter how frightening they may be sensing is? Isn't it a matter of staying mentally quiescent?

And then there's experience integration, I suppose; which is a matter of coming to terms with what you may have experienced. Seems similar in principle.


I cannot speak from any sort of personal experience.

I'd appreciate enlightenment.

 

[Benny]

I dont know what is quiescent? But I use shrooms and have help from ally. I call the ally to help me and guide me. And protect me. I dont meditate but I dont need to. I feel when time is right. And then do it. So I think ally helps to set the time. So I know fear but tell myself I have help. I except fear and let go and tell I am in control, of my ego, not ego in control of me. Maybe for dmt different. I think know why do it is important. And laugh at fear is good too

 

[kyrolima]

I did have dark experiences.
The key to handling them for me is:
:arrow: keep calm
:arrow: be aware, that it will go away sooner or later
:!: it might be there for a reason
:!: understand the "topic" it is relating to and understand what this energy does to it

once it is understood they go away.

happy journeys!

 

[Tek]

Yes and no. DMT on the one hand is completely harmless, you're not ever going to die from doing it and you will ALWAYS come down no matter how big of a dose you do. On the other hand, when one smokes DMT you are propelled past being human, and thus any recollection that you ever had a human life or smoked this thing called DMT. The experience feels 100% real when it happens, and while it is happening you will be convinced that it's the only thing that has ever happened to you. Even if this only lasts 15 minutes, from your perspective, you've been there for an eternity.

There's no telling why some people trip badly, it's probably a personal thing. One thing I can say with certainty though is that it's a jungle in the DMT space, and you never know what you might bump into. Wherever that place is, the beings that reside there, whether by-products of your own mind or something else, are much more familiar with the dynamics and laws of that place than you are. Like a lost tourist, you might find a few jesters willing to take you for a strange ride just because that's what jesters like to do. And I'm not literally meaning jesters (although they are a common sight), but the 'beings' of hyperspace operate by their own laws and those rules are so alien as far as being a human is concerned (and considering in the middle of it you don't even know what 'human' is) that if you can't 'just go with it' then yeah, it can spiral into a bad trip.

Sometimes when it feels like your being callously probed by gelatinous anthropomorphic blobs, one starts to question whether certain beings in that place have malvolent intentions or not. However with the way that I look at it is it's a curiosity thing. We as humans might pick up an insect and squish it's wing by accident, but we were only curious to pick it up since it wandered into our home and we didn't mean to actually hurt it. I feel that's sort of the same with the beings from the DMT world. They like to play, and their games are funny, but its funny like a bugs bunny cartoon is funny where, you know, anvils are falling on your head and a rabbit gives you a stick of dynamite which blows up in your face. It's all fun and games, except when your the butt of all their jokes.

 

[3rdI]

Tsuchinoko, when you take DMT anything can happen, absolutely ANYTHING, good, bad, blissfull or terror laden.

The experience is not comprehendable or explainable or understandable, the only way to know how it could go wrong is to try it.
i have never had what i would call a really bad trip (i have been on fire, been incapacitated in a burning house, died and been dieing and several other things that other consider bad) but i have been to the peak of bliss and happyness so i know it could go the other way as well.

Give it a try, you might find out :twisted: :d :twisted:

 

[tele]

I have got some "tough/unpleasant" DMT journeys behind me, and most of them were due to smoking too often(about more than twice a week). These days I do my sessions 1-4 times a month and I rarely receive unpleasant journeys.
The unpleasant ones can easily be reflection also of one's own mind.

 

[Global]

Yes and no. DMT on the one hand is completely harmless, you're not ever going to die from doing it and you will ALWAYS come down no matter how big of a dose you do. On the other hand, when one smokes DMT you are propelled past being human, and thus any recollection that you ever had a human life or smoked this thing called DMT. The experience feels 100% real when it happens, and while it is happening you will be convinced that it's the only thing that has ever happened to you. Even if this only lasts 15 minutes, from your perspective, you've been there for an eternity.

I don't find this to always be the case. Even in a lot of my most profound breakthroughs, I'm still aware that I am in fact a human having a DMT experience. DMT seems to preserve my conscious mind a lot as opposed to salvia where I would probably agree with everything you say in that above paragraph. I never really bother to remember any memories from my regular life though if for no other reason than it would be a brilliant waste of time :lol: Also for me, even the "longer" breakthroughs can seem relatively short. My sense of time is more often than anything sped up and it seems to go by more quickly than normal. The only times that time has really slowed down so dramatically as to approach that eternal "reference point", was in my white light godhead experiences. Even other godhead experiences without the white light didn't result in time slowing down.

 

[Felnik]

It takes practice to not be afraid. It's so weird and bizarre at times as many said its difficult to describe. It's a soup of weirdness and mystery.

I,ve noticed that no matter how bad it gets there is a seed of the self that always remains fully intact. Once you connect to this strong part of yourself you can endure the toughest of journeys and come through ok.

Practice helps

 

[BananaForeskin]

How do bad experiences happen?

With vaped spice, usually you're bumbling along through hyperspace/pre-hyperspace, when suddenly a group of malign-looking entities attempt to gang up on you. You might just steer into some sort of black, slimy fractal pit of death.

Or you've smoked spice too much, ignored the warning signs that it's time to stop, and had your ass handed back to you on a plate. This experience is far more unpleasant than I make it sound.

 

[AlbertKLloyd]

In the study that is the subject of the Spirit Molecule book the sessions using high doses caused traumatic experiences consistently enough that the experiments were ended out of compassion.

I would suggest that being strapped to a table and injected with a large dose is very likely to result in a traumatic experience and there are people out there who do have psychedelic trip related PTSD.

With a good set and setting and with reasonable and not excessive doses it is very unlikely that someone would have a traumatic experience.

 

[Desire Meaningful Truth]

I'd say the most likely reasons for having bad experiences are:

1. Not having pure spice. The jungle spice can be somewhat uncomfortable to inhale in large doses (leading to a very uncomfortable visit to hyperspace that will set the tone of the trip.) Wash the spice and it'll be nice.

2. Not getting a proper dose. Half-way shenanigans can leave the user confused and bewildered. Try to find your safe-zone by increasing the dose ever so slightly.

3. Giant doses... can really fuck with your mind.........????????????????

4. Profit!

 

[Dethrone]

I am still new to the experience but I quickly realized one thing,you are going to have bad experiences.

They are as much a part of DMT as good experiences are.I think you should research ego death,as this aspect can
be one of the most confusing and scary parts during/after your journey.On my first trip I experienced this and Tek's
first paragraph describes it well.

I can say that feelings are amplified,when fear sets in all I can do is try to give in and hope I get the message so it will end.If I fight the fear or try to control/direct the trip it gets worse.

 

[Purges]

"To fathom hell or soar angelic, just take a pinch of psychedelic" - Humphry Osmond


Rings pretty true to me

 

[Tek]

I am still new to the experience but I quickly realized one thing,you are going to have bad experiences.

They are as much a part of DMT as good experiences are.I think you should research ego death,as this aspect can
be one of the most confusing and scary parts during/after your journey.On my first trip I experienced this and Tek's
first paragraph describes it well.

I can say that feelings are amplified,when fear sets in all I can do is try to give in and hope I get the message so it will end.If I fight the fear or try to control/direct the trip it gets worse.

I absolutely agree with what Dethrone says here. Look up as much as you can about the ego death experience, but even saying that it's kind of the same as reading up on the process of dying: no matter how much you know about it intellectually it doesn't really prepare you for the actual experience.

The best way to describe ego death is in the same way that astrophysicists describe the event horizon of a black hole. It's impossible to know anything about what's on the other side of the horizon until after you've crossed it, and going into something like that can be terrifying especially if your afraid of the unknown.

My worst trips have always come from not being able to let go during the ego death process. If I try to carry my humanity into hyperspace with me I feel like I'm carrying a 10 ton weight the entire experience and it can get pretty crazy, and not in the good way. It's also worth noting that, at least to me, ego death is a bitch and you never really get used to it. I've 'killed' myself (ego) dozens of times and been come back each time so I have proof that it's not actually dying, but every time it feels like 'oh shit! this is really it this time! I'm dead!! Woe is me!!'.

But then, after I'm through, I always wonder what the big deal was all about

 

[Guyomech]

I feel like my extensive experience with the "slower" psychedelics made my first DMT experiences a lot easier. Once you are familiar with ego death etc, you'll be less disoriented by the experience. If you've never taken any psychedelics first, though, you may find that your reality is so suddenly and thoroughly shattered that you may feel a bit traumatized. On the other hand, this shattering experience can be cleansing and invigorating.

You'll find a lot of entries here about preflight anxiety. Normal, healthy.

That said, my only really bad DMT trip was my fault: cold, sick, stressed... And WAY too high a dose. A lot of these issues are avoidable.

 

[obliguhl]

But as far as I am aware; when one is under the effects of DMT, no matter how intense the experience may be, the conscious mind stays intact.

That's a myth.

 

[The Day Tripper]

I did have dark experiences.
The key to handling them for me is:
:arrow: keep calm
:arrow: be aware, that it will go away sooner or later
:!: it might be there for a reason
:!: understand the "topic" it is relating to and understand what this energy does to it

once it is understood they go away.

happy journeys!

This.

Also know and come to terms with your fear. That's whats going to bring on bad trips. Its not trying to not be afraid going in to the experience, its knowing and being able to deal with the fear you WILL feel going into the trip. IMO a bad trip is a drug induced panic/anxiety attack. Sometimes its easy to shrug the fear off, other time's much harder.

There is no bad-trip proof psych, or one that keeps the conscious mind intact, dmt especially. The bad trip is not being able to deal with, or realize the power you have over the fear/uncertainty that always is a part of our psyche, with or without drugs.

Once you learn to come to terms and accept your "dark side, monster within, fear, etc.", it becomes much easier to stop fear from spiraling into a panic attack. Ann shulgin has said that much more eloquently than myself, but you get the idea.

Its not eliminating your fear, its becoming one with it, and separating the illusion that its a independent part of us. Once you see that its much easier to control and deal with it, just like any other emotion. And you realize how your mind has distorted and amplified that feeling. IE, its your mind playing tricks on you, the monster is not near as big or scary as its shadow when you finally turn around and stare at its face.

 

[Tsuchinoko]

I feel like my extensive experience with the "slower" psychedelics made my first DMT experiences a lot easier. Once you are familiar with ego death etc, you'll be less disoriented by the experience. If you've never taken any psychedelics first, though, you may find that your reality is so suddenly and thoroughly shattered that you may feel a bit traumatized. On the other hand, this shattering experience can be cleansing and invigorating.

You'll find a lot of entries here about preflight anxiety. Normal, healthy.

That said, my only really bad DMT trip was my fault: cold, sick, stressed... And WAY too high a dose. A lot of these issues are avoidable.

I've actually been trying to induce ego death in myself for a while. Though not by way of powerful entheogens such as DMT. I've done Ramana Maharshi's method of self-inquiry, and other methods utilizing something of a Socratic method.

I've seen what lies behind what we think to be the 'Self'. I see we are more than bodies and that there is a profoundly intimate and intrinsic connection between any one person and everything they perceive. There seems to be a void "behind" all of us. A vacuous "space" where things seem to manifest from (i.e. thoughts, ideas, etc)

And yet, my ego still remains. I get offended, or angry, or upset and still take some thing personally; even though a part of "me" knows plainly that it's silly to do so. I want to get rid of that phantom "Self". The ego which wants more. Needs more to be more.

There is anxiety and a sense of being scared, but I suppose that's egoic death throes.


I mean, I can't say I wouldn't want a gentle dissolution of the ego; but if it takes something intense, so be it... Well, let's be honest, I'm scared as hell of what lies on the other side, but I'm SO intrigued and I feel compelled.

 

[daedaloops]

Its not eliminating your fear, its becoming one with it, and separating the illusion that its a independent part of us. Once you see that its much easier to control and deal with it, just like any other emotion. And you realize how your mind has distorted and amplified that feeling. IE, its your mind playing tricks on you, the monster is not near as big or scary as its shadow when you finally turn around and stare at its face.

This is one of the best advices on dealing with bad trips, not just on DMT or psychedelics, but any sort of panic attacks. You shouldn't fight or try to hide the fear, just simply face it.

The way you put it reminded me instantly of this picture:

 

[McCoyBoy]

it can go wrong a couple ways. you could smoke way too much at once and freak majorly, be sure to start low and up your doses in small increments when you feel ready for more. smoking burnt dmt will do it for sure and you may vomit from it. i recommend cleaning your smoking device often.


a bad trip will happen eventually and when it does it is rather unique and still somewhat enjoyable. dmt rewards you when you switch from panic, fear, ect to calmness, acceptance. and boom your floating in love