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How do I report a sketchy ayahuasca retreat

A

Ayamistake

Rising Star
Hi. There is a sketchy Ayahuasca retreat in the US. It’s private so they allow only by invitation. I’m curious, how would one go about reporting this retreat since this illegal? Before you jump at me. I am very well much pro towards responsible use of psychedelics. But these people have zero safety protocols, they don’t screen very well and I have reports of at least 10 people having to go to a psychiatrist afterwards due to severe mental issues that they didn’t have before including extreme suicidal ideation. One of them mentioned they mix datura in the brew. Well, whatever that retreat is it’s very dangerous and they are not affiliated with any of the two churches that are allowed to serve ayahuasca in the US. I’d like to know what I can do. They are still operating despite multiple people reporting terrible experience with them. They just brush it off and tell them to comeback. (No thanks, not worth 800$). Thank you
 
Do they make you sign a bunch of papers before hand? Because if you signed a bunch of waivers, there’s nothing you can do.

Actually, you could go onto websites that review these types of retreats. Yelp or that equivalent. Then just leave them bad reviews on that.
 
This is very odd and should be reported to the police. If their brew actually contains DMT then it is illegal manufacturing and distribution of a Schedule I substance, which is.. illegal. I'm confused and surprised at how the authorities wouldn't already have become involved in this, especially considering that if it's a retreat they would need to be held to some sort of legal standards as a business entity.

You'd have to mention where and what this retreat is if you wanted any specific advice. I'm sure these '10 people who developed severe mental issues' from this retreat would be willing to take legal action. This doesn't seem difficult considering you've described malpractice, fraud, distribution of illicit substances, and liability for personal injury.

This gives me the feeling that the full situation wasn't completely described here.. Until you provide more context, it just sounds like this should be reported to the cops
 
GenesisCorrupted said:
Do they make you sign a bunch of papers before hand? Because if you signed a bunch of waivers, there’s nothing you can do.

Actually, you could go onto websites that review these types of retreats. Yelp or that equivalent. Then just leave them bad reviews on that.
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No waiver. Thing is. They are private. They aren’t listed anywhere at all.
 
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FlagellaStink said:
This is very odd and should be reported to the police. If their brew actually contains DMT then it is illegal manufacturing and distribution of a Schedule I substance, which is.. illegal. I'm confused and surprised at how the authorities wouldn't already have become involved in this, especially considering that if it's a retreat they would need to be held to some sort of legal standards as a business entity.

You'd have to mention where and what this retreat is if you wanted any specific advice. I'm sure these '10 people who developed severe mental issues' from this retreat would be willing to take legal action. This doesn't seem difficult considering you've described malpractice, fraud, distribution of illicit substances, and liability for personal injury.

This gives me the feeling that the full situation wasn't completely described here.. Until you provide more context, it just sounds like this should be reported to the cops
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No waivers.
 
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I'm hesitant to recommend contacting authorities and add more fuel to the fire for prohibition of plant medicines.

That said, there does need to be accountability and bad actors need to be named and shamed and prevented from causing further harm.

I don't have links offhand, but there are sites that review retreats and you could post warnings on social media and various forums. You could also consider contacting ICEERS or similar organizations to help put the word out.
 
'Retreats' I don't think fall under religious practice. UDV and Daime is recognized in the states and legal when adhering to certain regulations and restrictions. I'm not sure on the exact laws in the states regarding this but here in Brasil as long as for religious use and not for money the practice is open. Sale online is starting to get to relaxed and people are clearly selling for profit without much regard for the laws.

Here the only plants legally allowed for daime is caapi and psychotria viridis any other variation or plants even if for the same purpose or usage is not considered 'legal' but as long as you keep it in religious context and do not sell the dried material it should be fine. As far as any other 'drugs' besides being dangerous mixing with maoi is also considered illegal.

I share this info since the church here are the ones that went to US supreme court to have religious officially recognized I think in 2006? maybe later? Importing and exporting large material still falls under scrutiny. They should be reported IMO since there is an unsafe practice and they are presenting themselves as a 'safe retreat' breaking the law for profit. Retreats are usually overseas because of vague laws or legality.

Charging price of material and labor is one thing 800 dollars is clearly for profit
 
Is the only sketchy thing they are doing selling access to The Medicine? Or are other sketchy things going on? One such group is known to be a cult and its leaders are shady AF.
 
Mitakuye Oyasin said:
Is the only sketchy thing they are doing selling access to The Medicine? Or are other sketchy things going on? One such group is known to be a cult and its leaders are shady AF.
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There is definitely a cult like vibe there that’s for sure. And well, they don’t tell people of possible contraindications and they don’t screen people well nor help them at all during the ceremony if someone is having a bad time
 
dreamer042 said:
I'm hesitant to recommend contacting authorities and add more fuel to the fire for prohibition of plant medicines.

That said, there does need to be accountability and bad actors need to be named and shamed and prevented from causing further harm.

I don't have links offhand, but there are sites that review retreats and you could post warnings on social media and various forums. You could also consider contacting ICEERS or similar organizations to help put the word out.
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The problem is they aren’t listed on any of those sites. They are private and only by invitation and they ask you to never name them to someone else at all.
 
I would say, just move on there’s nothing you can solve by getting the authority’s involved. If they keep on giving people a bad time they will be out of practice before you know it. No need to get people into trouble with the law.
 
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Varallo said:
I would say, just move on there’s nothing you can solve by getting the authority’s involved. If they keep on giving people a bad time they will be out of practice before you know it. No need to get people into trouble with the law.
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Well these people threaten people with legal issues when they write about them or complain. These aren’t exactly your good samaritans
 
Transform said:
Sounds a bit too similar to those "psilomethoxin" grifters. Litigation shouldn't be an alternative to competence.
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I myself when I told them I have issues they told me to pay for another ceremony to heal all issues that came up. Like sorry no I’m not going there so you can fuck me up even more. And as it turned out after visiting a psychedelics informed psychiatrist, my problems wouldn’t be solved by taking more of aya. Anyway, I’m gonna do what I can, it’s hard though because they aren’t listed anywhere publicly where you can leave a review. It’s all by word of mouth
 
Varallo said:
I would say, just move on there’s nothing you can solve by getting the authority’s involved. If they keep on giving people a bad time they will be out of practice before you know it. No need to get people into trouble with the law.
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They have been operating for at least 5-6 years. I am not planning on getting the law involved yet, at least I see no point until more people come out to talk about them.
 
Transform said:
Sounds a bit too similar to those "psilomethoxin" grifters. Litigation shouldn't be an alternative to competence.
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Actually; now that I remember. So when I complained about them on Reddit, someone messaged me asking to meet up for coffee to discuss the ceremony. They sent me a picture of themselves which was a hot lady( of course). After I called them out they proceeded to delete all messages in the chat
 
This is starting to look like a witch hunt, with no evidence of anything based on hearsay from anonymous people on the internet?

I mean it might be true but I don’t see any proof of anything. People who have a bad experience don’t necessarily have permanent mental health issues from the Aya, sure it can be challenging but this sounds like rhetoric.

I think allot of these retreats are there to make money, there is almost nothing altruistic about it. It’s a service that some do well and some don’t.

Then this:
The Cosmic Punisher said:
People are not only suffering permanent mental health damage from this horse manure,
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Proof ? They very well could have had some issues before.

Alma dos mortos said:
disguised as a "church" poisoning people
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Let’s take a step back, is drinking Aya really like drinking a poison?

Alma dos mortos said:
only see winning in sending them a nice SWAT team into their headquarters
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How is this winning

Alma dos mortos said:
The _WRONG_ way is charging 800 USD without proper supervision, training or a licence for a "trip" that leaves people traumatized
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Lots of retreats charge for there ceremony, and much more than that. Maybe people should take agency on their behalf and just not do this.

Alma dos mortos said:
If this would happen in the jungle with the native tribes, people would gang up on the "mestre" and send him to the other side. Permanently.
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I’m not sure why this is relevant, but any suggestions that this might warrant the killing of another human being is just ridiculous, how would this ever be a solution?
 
I understand this is a difficult subject to discuss in an emotionally-detached way, but before the exchanges in this thread become unsavory, let's do our best to be civil and respectful of each other's perspectives. I think there are valid points on both Varallo and Alma's sides, and I think an all-out response to this situation based entirely on one or the other will miss the mark.

If we agree that one of our core values as a community is the education of people about psychedelics and their safe use, we also agree that we have a certain responsibility to not be bystanders when such malevolent practices may be at play. With that being said, I think Varallo has a point when he says we shouldn't blindly trust reddit posts and screenshots, but if possible, we should actively seek communication with the potential victims of this establishment, obtain first-hand confirmation from them that the shady practices we're discussing here are real, and only then it makes sense to start acting in any way that makes sense.

Of course I agree with Alma that stuff like this should not be allowed, and that ruining people's lives should be a punishable crime. But we have to be more dilligent and approach this situation from an intellectual standpoint instead of a purely emotional, reactionary one.
 
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