Is sodium bicarbonate ever a good idea?

[chiral]

So many teks reference sodium carbonate. Would there been any reason why baking soda could not be used to neutralize acids prior to extraction?
Some people have dry acids in their brew that concentrate. Thus, it makes sense that, before adding NaOH, one should neutralize prior to basifyin'. I'm sure there are people who have seen DCM boil when adding NaOH. I haven't.

I predict an added bonus of knowing when to stop... when the bubbles stop. YAY!

 

[endlessness]

are you talking about extraction, washing or brewing a psychedelic tea for drinking? Notice these are all very very different.

When teks talk about sodium carbonate they dont talk about using it for neutralization, they talk about using it or washing the non-polar solvent in the last part of the extraction, after NaOH was added, pulls were made and were separated.

'neutralize prior to basifying', why? when you basify what happens is the pH raises, so before it becomes a basic solution when adding NaOH it will neutralize anyways.. If you are affraid of temperature rising, add base slowly and stir well while doing it..

One can use very simple and food safe acetic acid (vinegar) as the acid, as everybody has access to it, and it does also evaporate if you reduce your brew.. I dont see a reason why using another acid. Even if so, as long as its not incredibly low pH for months, I dont think you can hurt your dmt in the acid step.

Also, you shouldnt have added the solvent (in your case you mention DCM) before basifying anyways, the solvent should be added AFTER basifying... Unless you are doing a defat, in which case you should also throw the solvent away before basifying

Last thing, of course this is personal choice but, why DCM? It seems to be carcinogenic and so on.. If one wants jungle spice, why not go for limonene (with maybe FASA after), and if one wants pure dmt, why not naphtha/hexane/heptane?

 

[Infundibulum]

So many teks reference sodium carbonate. Would there been any reason why baking soda could not be used to neutralize acids prior to extraction?
Some people have dry acids in their brew that concentrate. Thus, it makes sense that, before adding NaOH, one should neutralize prior to basifyin'. I'm sure there are people who have seen DCM boil when adding NaOH. I haven't.

I predict an added bonus of knowing when to stop... when the bubbles stop. YAY!

Yeah, both sodium carbonate and bicarbonate are good for neutralisign because you know when you've reached pH~7. But why neutralise acids when addition of any base will neutralise them anyway?

Addition of a base in an acidic solution will first titrate it and then basify it. There is no advantage in neutralising the solution prior to basifying!

 

[chiral]

DCM evaporates quickly, shows little health risk with plenty of ventilation and minimal exposure, and (!!!) you can be assured that when DMT melts, the DCM is long gone. pH of 9.5-10 is fine.

 

[69ron]

DCM is the choice of most professional chemists doing alkaloid extractions. The other solvents are usually used for cleanup steps such as crystallization. DCM has many advantages. It evaporates really fast, boils at an extremely low temperature, dissolves nearly all freebase alkaloids extremely well, and can be redistilled with very little energy. It's a fantastic solvent.

Naphtha is no healthier than DCM. Just as with DCM, naphtha is also suspected to cause cancer.

The only advantage naphtha or heptane has over DCM when it comes to DMT extraction is that they are more selective than DCM is. SWIM uses heptane, not naphtha, and only for freeze precipitation. He extracts DMT using DCM, and then purifies it using heptane. By doing it this way, you minimize solvent use, save energy, and get better yields. DCM can hold far more DMT than naphtha or heptane can.

SWIM also uses sodium carbonate to freebase DMT. He never uses sodium hydroxide EVER.

 

[chiral]

Werd yo. SWIM has a rad pH meter, so NaOH has never been a problem... sorta. Sodium Carbonate is nice. There's lots of Calcium Carbonate around, is that an effective substitute? People have seen precipitate with NaOH and calcium carbonate, although some calcium ascorbate was present.

There is quite a bit of tartaric acid present, as well. Something like 4g/100ml, granted it all made it's way through. An idiot decided to try it for a big job and she forgot the beauty of acids that disappear with heat.

Lots of sodium tartrate, which is so soluble it makes me pee.

 

[Infundibulum]

Werd yo. SWIM has a rad pH meter, so NaOH has never been a problem... sorta. Sodium Carbonate is nice. There's lots of Calcium Carbonate around, is that an effective substitute?

I have some hard time understanding what you want to do here.

Why NaOH should be a problem and how the pH meter solves that? Calcium carbonate is not substitute for sodium carbonate. The latter barely dissolves in water.

People have seen precipitate with NaOH and calcium carbonate, although some calcium ascorbate was present.

???

There is quite a bit of tartaric acid present, as well. Something like 4g/100ml, granted it all made it's way through. An idiot decided to try it for a big job and she forgot the beauty of acids that disappear with heat.

Lots of sodium tartrate, which is so soluble it makes me pee.

I'm totally missing you here. You sure you're sober?

 

[chiral]

Yes, I'm sober. The precipitate confuses me, I'm not sure what caused it. Looked like calcium something came out.
Imagine:
2lb mimosa
4.2l of extract with from 1.5 gallons with 60ml of 37% HCl and 2oz of tartartic acid (woops!)

That will become:
either 1 or 2 parts each of 700ml

There is concern about loosing fun stuff to too high of a concentration.

The rad pH tester allows freebasing at ph 10. More NaOH == (more hydroxides + possible damage to other spice alkaloids). As far as I'm concerned, that is.

Bear with me, fellas. I'm only finishing the 200 level of kitchen chemistry, but I'm a sharp cookie. Ask me about my modified nucerite hotplate someday. Works fine for solder reflow ;-)