LSD in combination with CBT-Like exercises to overcome anxieties?

[soul-explorer]

Hi,


I have been wondering about this for quite a while now -- Is LSD in combination with CBT (Cognitive behavioral therapy), facing your fears basically, a good idea?

I'm suffering from some social anxiety and a few other fears I would like to overcome. Noticed that small-medium dosages (25-100mcg) of LSD help me a lot with anxiety and inhibition in these situations. Things just seem to flow much more easily and I tend to be much more out of my head and in the moment.

While I'd be happy to just go ahead and do this like every 7-14days (or Microdose every 4th day or so), I wonder what the possible downsides/dangers could be. LSD acting as a crutch is one thing I could imagine, although my hope is that the insight gained will make these things easier while being sober too.


Grateful for anyone on here who has experience with this and/or can provide insights!

 

[Mindlusion]

Well I dont know anything about CBT, but to me it sounds similar to a daily 12 step program out of AA. Which of course, seeks out the same goal that CBT aims for, the changing of behaviors, feelings, and thought patterns. Its a slow process that requires daily practice and increasing awareness of what we do and how we react to life.

Any addict or alcoholic that has seriously worked this kind of program would tell you that 12-steps isn't just for addicts, they aren't guidelines to help you stop drinking, they are guidelines to a happy fulfilling living.

Bill Wilson (one of the co-founders of AA) actually advocated the use of LSD prior to working the 12 steps. To work an effective program you need to be willing to go any lengths. Not an easy place to reach.. Bill W advocated LSD because it led himself and others to a spiritual or mystical experience. Something powerful enough is felt, a shred of something new is witnessed, that they became willing enough to begin. Which then became the foundation of their own recovery and good living.

However, these kinds of experiences are not produced by LSD, or any other psychoactive, many people have them only circumstantially, no drugs required. Bill W did not suggest that people continue to take LSD, though. Once you've seen it you don't need to see it again.

Although, in my own experience with microdosing psychedelics (80-100mg psilocybin mushrooms, or 5-8ug LSD) they seemed to actually produce more moments during my everyday life, where I would become aware of some long ingrained thought pattern or whatever I just felt and reacted to. That's only the first step though of course, it only continues if I was willing, id write it down to do my best to change it. Nothing changes if nothing changes! It could of course be placebo... suggestion that I might be more aware so then I was... but if it works then who cares?

 

[Ufostrahlen]

Sounds like a logical thing to do.

LSD enhances suggestibility in healthy volunteers.


These results imply that the influence of suggestion is enhanced by LSD. Enhanced suggestibility under LSD may have implications for its use as an adjunct to psychotherapy, where suggestibility plays a major role. That cued imagery was unaffected by LSD implies that suggestions must be of a sufficient duration and level of detail to be enhanced by the drug. The results also imply that individuals with high trait conscientiousness are especially sensitive to the suggestibility-enhancing effects of LSD.

LSD enhances suggestibility in healthy volunteers - PubMed

These results imply that the influence of suggestion is enhanced by LSD. Enhanced suggestibility under LSD may have implications for its use as an adjunct to psychotherapy, where suggestibility plays a major role. That cued imagery was unaffected by LSD implies that suggestions must be of a...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Heightened suggestibility connected with self hypnosis = win?

Self-hypnosis training represents a rapid, cost-effective, nonaddictive and safe alternative to
medication for the treatment of anxiety-related conditions. Here we provide a review of the
experimental literature on the use of self-hypnosis in the treatment of anxiety and stress-related
disorders, including anxiety associated with cancer, surgery, burns and medical/dental procedures.
An overview of research is also provided with regard to self-hypnotic treatment of anxiety-related
disorders, such as tension headaches, migraines and irritable bowel syndrome. The tremendous
volume of research provides compelling evidence that hypnosis is an efficacious treatment for
state anxiety (e.g., prior to tests, surgery and medical procedures) and anxiety-related disorders,
such as headaches and irritable bowel syndrome.

Hypnosis in the treatment of anxiety- and stress-related disorders - PubMed

Self-hypnosis training represents a rapid, cost-effective, nonaddictive and safe alternative to medication for the treatment of anxiety-related conditions. Here we provide a review of the experimental literature on the use of self-hypnosis in the treatment of anxiety and stress-related...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I must warn you though, I tried to hypnotize myself under the influence of 100µg 1P-LSD, which resulted in a massive panic attack. I came (calmed) down after 3mg of Xanax. And I'm no noob, ~110x trips in a span of 17 years. Set and setting was quite optimal too.
Maybe the can of Dr. Pepper beforehand was the culprit... Suddenly I felt how all the parts of my brain hyperconnected which led to really bad paranoia, something I didn't experience with a cocaine/mushrooms combo when I was a stupid kid.

Obliguhl is the social anxiety expert afaik. He swears on Kava and Mescaline. And he pointed me to the self-hypnosis paper. Maybe shoot him a msg?

Oh, and this is the most scientific review (Leitlinie) regarding anxiety disorders, the master plan every doc in Germany follows (indication, medication, other forms of treatment):

AWMF Leitlinienregister

www.awmf.org

http://www.awmf.org/leitlinien/detail/ll/051-028/ll-ansicht/autor.html

Only 275 pages (jump start at p. 120) :thumb_up:

 

[obliguhl]

Obliguhl is the social anxiety expert afaik. He swears on Kava and Mescaline. And he pointed me to the self-hypnosis paper. Maybe shoot him a msg?

Too much honor there .. but mescaline in low doses is indeed very, very effective for me
I don't know if it would be sustainable though. I do believe what people know as "social anxiety" is a very prototypical term, encompassing many different problems. Are you afraid to be in the presence of people? Calming agents such as Kava might very well work. Personally, i'm more anxious to initiate contact or to respond "appropriatly" to people initiating first contact. So stimulants such as mescaline or even coffee - work best.

I must warn you though, I tried to hypnotize myself under the influence of 100µg 1P-LSD

Hypnosis under the Influence of Psychedelics is something i'm very interested in as the "heightend suggestibility" is def. there, don't you think? It is so much heightened, that even a single thought can change the entire trip.

There is Research being done on Cognitive behavioural Hypnotherapy and it has been show more effecacious than CBT alone see http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00207140601177897
So there is a good chance CBT with LSD might even work better, but who knows.

 

[Ufostrahlen]

I must warn you though, I tried to hypnotize myself under the influence of 100µg 1P-LSD

Hypnosis under the Influence of Psychedelics is something i'm very interested in as the "heightend suggestibility" is def. there, don't you think? It is so much heightened, that even a single thought can change the entire trip.

Yeah, the idea is certainly promising. However I doubt a full trip is even necessary. The 100µg were over-the-top and not manageable.
It was the last blot of a 10 strip, and the only bad trip I had with this batch. I really can recommend having Benzos at hand, this bad trip was so shitty.

At first I told me: c'mon, you're just having a panic attack, you're not new to psys, calm down, but the RC poisoning feeling was stronger. I could stand it maybe 15-30min, then I decided, if I die of RCs, at least I want to die peaceful. 3mg of Xanax, omnomnom, an hour later I was at baseline, not even cognitively impaired the least and quite happy that Benzos work so well.

Maybe start with 50µg or so. Haven't explored the idea further, I'm currently not in the mood for psys.