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Need a simple citric acid extraction of P. harmala

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User 18517

Rising Star
I bought 2 ounces of P. harmala seeds and 3 ounces of citric acid. Can anyone advise me as to a simple extraction? I did do some searching, but all I came across was overly casual advice involving either lemon juice or vinegar. I'd like some measurements. I hope to eventually do the more thorough extraction, but I can't, right now, due to finances.


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According to 69Ron, it's best to leave the citric acid out (unless trying to convert added DMT to the citrate salt). Seems like he's saying his method takes advantage of the fact that it is inadequate, and so there is a better ratio of harmalas to toxins. I would imagine a water infusion done at room temperature would be even better. Thoughts on ratio of seeds to water and soak time?


Why not give plain rue tea a try? Brew it exactly as you brew tea. Add hot water to 2-3 grams of ground rue seeds. Don't boil it and don’t add any acids or anything else. Let it steep for 15 minutes or so. Strain it, removing all the seed solids. Then add citric acid and freebase DMT. That's the method that produces the cleanest experience for SWIM. It's not as good if you boil the rue or add acid to the tea while brewing it. Boiling it or adding acid is a sure way to make inferior rue tea that causes more side effects. Brewed as plain tea, it’s much better than using caapi, in terms of side effects. The trip is different from caapi of course.
69ron
 
"overly casual" advice regarding lemon juice is probably sufficient.
its not rocket science, its just acidifying water.
if you use too little, it won't matter much, because some extract without any acid.
if you do too much, it won't matter much, you will just have to add more base (unless you are doing manske in which case it might cause an issue, but nothing that can't be fixed with base precip)

EDIT:
if you are planning to do an extraction, it would probably be best to boil and acidify, just to make sure you get all the actives, as you are going to be isolating and purifying the alkaloids anyways..

for tea though, acid is not needed, and even discouraged (though not for any reasons relating to "toxicity" )
 
According to another user, simplistic extractions are best done using only water. I edited the info into my first post as well as questions about the info.
 
I decided on the RHF Manske extraction (see below). 4-6 days (2x the soak which lasts 2-3 days) sounds excessive... Also can someone explain exactly how the siphoning off works?


This is extremely efficient and I understand is the technique used in the field to test for harmaline.

From "The Alkaloids" Vol II (p393), Mankse:

"The crushed seeds of Peganum Harmala are covered with three times their weight of water containing 30 g of acetic acid per liter of water [white vinegar is about 50g / l or 5 %]. The seeds swell as they absorb the liquid and form a thick dough which is pressed after 2-3 days. The pressed seeds are once more treated as above with twice their weight of dilute acetic acid and, after maceration, the liquid is again pressed out. To the combined liquors, sodium chloride [that's table salt, man] (100g. / liter of liquid) is added to transform the acetates of harmine and harmaline into the hydrochlorides which are insoluble in cold sodium chloride solutions and are precipitated during cooling. The supernatant liquid is siphoned off, the crystalline residue filtered with suction and redissolved in hot water.

Erowid Syrian Rue Vaults: Extraction 2 : Acetic Acid Extract (per Mankse)

A description of an extraction of harmala from Syrian Rue seeds using Acetic Acid
www.erowid.org
 
User 18517 said:
I decided on the RHF Manske extraction (see below). 4-6 days (2x the soak which lasts 2-3 days) sounds excessive... Also can someone explain exactly how the siphoning off works?
Erowid Syrian Rue Vaults: Extraction 2 : Acetic Acid Extract (per Mankse)
Click to expand...

The answer to your question is provided in the link you provided.:)

"Take rue, powder it, place it water with small amount of acetic acid (distilled vinager) bring to simmer, cool and strain, repeat at least once, on the last batch, add the strained water hot and dissolve a good quantity of non iodized salt into the water, place in fridge/freezer (watch it so it don't freeze and break your container) and cool down to really cold, brownish orange flakes will percipitate out, let set in fridge until flakes settle to bottom, pour off excess liquid, then filter the rest through a coffee filter, wash with cold salt water, dry and scrape off the powder.

So, depends on which container you have, pour or siphon. Siphon - Wikipedia
 
Thank you. I should have realized. :)

What exactly do those last two steps mean: "wash with cold salt water, dry and scrape off the powder." At that point, you're going to have flakes sitting on top of a coffee filter, right? They're saying to toss more cold salt water into the filter that is filled with flakes and let it drip through?
 
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