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New acacia extraction tek: FIRST VERSION READY !! (end post)

Migrated topic.


..still lc..
Hi, welcome to my first post :D I'm aware of most of the various teks out there, but this one is a little different and i quite like the idea :) if can be applied to any extraction where the plant material is quite full of non-polar gunk Swim gave it a shot on the weekend and so far all signs look good, all liquids were kept and will later be checked for dmt that didn't come through, but swim thinks the vast majority has come across Acacia Obtusifolia bark is being used Anyway, the process: --------------------------- 1: Grind bark 2: Cook in pH 4 water three times. Combine and reduce 3: Basify to pH 14 and transfer to extraction vessel (while HOT) 4: Extract with shellite three times, combine pulls 5: Wash shellite pulls with fresh pH 4 water three times, combine polar layers 6: Basify to pH 14 and transfer to extraction vessel (heat with water bath) 7: Extract with Shellite three times, combine pulls 8: Evaporate or Freeze Precipitate (latter is preferred) So the basic idea is: 1: Prepare bark 2: Get everything out of the bark; DMT (salt as pH 4), Oils, colours, etc.. 3: Convert the DMT salt to DMT base (plant gunk is present) 4: Extract with shellite (DMT base and plant non-polars will come across) 5: Convert DMT base to a salt again. The DMT Salt will migrate into the polar layer leaving the plant non-polars behind in the shellite) 6: Convert the DMT salt to DMT base (plant gunk is no longer present) 7: Again, use Shellite to grab only the DMT base this time 8: Freeze precipitate What you think? A little extra work yes but if you enjoy doing extractions like swim does then it's more fun if anything :D Swim says it works, GOOD, at step 8 right now and some mighty white crystals are precipitating out. the shellite had no visible colour either. The only thing is at step 7 (shellite pulls from basic water) some emulsions occured. Swim has never come across emulsions in a DMT extraction EXCEPT when he defats first (this is a post-defat tech i guess). Man those fucking emulsions... what rubbish Until this tech he has always stopped at step four and freeze precipitated there, and got a heap of plant oils which suck.. but by redissolving in shellite -> decant -> again etc... it can be cleaned up.. blah blah What you think? An initial PDF version of this tech will be ready in a few days, that may give you a better idea of what's going on. Edit: I give acknowledgement to avalokita from the nook for his suggestions on this one 8)
well a quick update can't tell you yield because there are many solutions floating around that definitely have dmt in them (only extracted on the first acid cook and during evap in preparation for freeze precip a fair amount of dmt crashed out that will be later redissolved and freeze precipitated (happened because swim evapped too far down - solvent couldn't hold the dmt anymore) aaaaaaaanyway 2.4 grams of PURE WHITE dmt was recovered yes yes pics i know perhaps tomorrow :D
congrats man! hehe, i also followed this technique from the nook. you wouldnt happen to be sphinx? anyway, i used 1kg of this bark and i skipped the acid bit and just went straight to basifying the bark. whats the point in acidyfying if your doing all the washing/defatting on the final solvent pulls? anyways, i'm pretty sure i got the wrong bark, the finaly yeild was just like every other time ive done an extraction on this bark. a few tiny white specks of dmt, nothing more, not even enough for a dose. im gunna leave it for a full 3 days this time though, *crosses fingers* how much bark you use btw?
Hey pal Yep I am(was) Sphinx that's changed on SAB also the acid cook was done so the dmt migrates awway from the bark and into the solution. all the work can then be done purely on liquid WITHOUT chunks/powder of bark floating around everything making the whole thing that much harder (and messier) to work with particularly: when shaking up etc... bark powder will be floating all over the place.. yes you can let it settle but by the time it does your solution has cooled too much and you need to heat it up again furthermore, the method being using to separate the layers is siphoning the bottom away from the top. siphoning was chosen because.. well, i'll try to explain this again when separating the layers, you want to minimise the surface area where they meet when separating.. lol fuck imagine you are working out of a bottle with a diameter of 300mm. when sucking the top layer off you can't get it all, there is always about 5mm left.. so 5mm height x 300mm diameter is a lot of solvent remaining.. if you minimise that surface area (300mm) say down to 50mm (best done by tilting the jug on a corner and sucking away from there) then you will only have about 5mm heigh x 50mm diameter left behind.. make sense? ghetto separatory funnel would be the business, but i can never find the right attachments to make one (bunnings fails for the first time ever!!) but say if that did eventuate, clearly you'd need to be working on liquids only and not trying to run bark stuff through a little tap swim's given a.maidenii a shot too, and even though his technique was far from good, he should have still seen something come out, like you he didn't see hardly anything.. and he was working with 30yo specimens, BIG fellas a.obtusifolia is the one to go for 100% 😉
Hey Coschi Nice work - it looks like you've solved a lot of problems for the Acacia extractors out there. I've been wondering if that system would work but couldn't see the point trying it since my friend works with MHRB. He's got some desmanthus on the way though and I'll be sure to tell him about this if he finds that it needs a defat.
Cheers Noman [img:b6553f5316]http://www.wetdreams.ws/forum/images/cheers.gif[/img:b6553f5316] yeah MHRB people seem to have their shit sorted there's a lot of people working acacia that i know could be doing a whole lot better, i've seen spice from people with a few years behind them that is still yellow i swear the result of this looks like pharmaceutical grade goods :lol: Pretty sure it should work no worries on green plant material, good luck
haha yeah. having all that bark gunk throughout the mixture makes everything alot harder and messier. one thing that stuck out to me on the nook was that ava said you could re-use the solvent over and over up to 5 times or something, as long as it was washed with basified water, and i really liked that idea, not only would it make sure all the goodies were pulled out (extracting 15 times!) but also much more cost efficient than using fresh solvent over and over. ava said to wash the pulls with basified water before extracting into acidified water, then re-use the solvent. im gunna take a guess at why using fresh solvent is better. if one re-used the solvent and didnt wash with basified water, the fat would begin to build up and transfer into the acidified water? i am also guessing theres a portion of dmt lost in the basified water. so basically using fresh solvent for each pull makes the job easier [i:01a008e611]and[/i:01a008e611] more efficient? if one wanted to re-use his solvent do you reckon the basified water wash would be necessary, or could one just re-use it simply extracting into the acidified water everytime? do you know whether theres much loss of goodies when washed with basified water cause i remember the quickness of this wash was emphasised.
Hey guys the acacia teks sure take much more effort than the MHRB ones, its a damn shame that you cant get any MHRB in Aus. I have a couple of nice looking Mimosa hostilis each in a 25l pot they are both 2+ years old or so but once I start forming a relationship with the plants it gets harder and harder to take a life. Ill post some nice pics when the weather gets a bit better. Anyhow the longifolia should be in flower in the near future and I want to be sure there is a possibility of success. Unfortunately in WA the highest conc of spice in any of the local plant life runs at something like 0.3% so there will be a large longifolia tek on its way in a few months. I was thinking of using a 20l plastic drum as a digestion vessel. Coschi your tek looks good :)
fable, dead keen to hear how it works out for you on longifolia. i was thinking of trying it but decided not too after experimenting on maidenii (basically same reports). how much you planning on doing, theyre considered a weed in WA aren't they? i heard the council was digging them up and stuff, wouldn't be too hard to get root bark??? or maybe im thinking of victoria... good luck mate
Yep they are considered a weed in WA and i believe it is the bark and phyllodes that contain the goodness so I will be filling the boot of my car up with branches of weed prunings. Just trying to do my bit for the environment :D
I really don't mind the acacia bark at all :) personally i'd much prefer to go for a nice roadtrip and come back with a shitload of bark and work it than just order some powdered MHRB.. seems a little too demeaning to the whole cause... FYI i know someone who has found a high yield acacia obtus patch, typical he's around 1% yield (yes 10 grams from a kilo). next time i go hunt i'm going to look a little harder.. i wonder what would push the alkaloid content so high though? temp? moisture? picking time? silly, yep i hear ya man, does this look familiar? [img:1c92a940ba]http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/2325/img0281zq9lt9.jpg[/img:1c92a940ba] fuck that shit, i had to redissolve in warm shellite -> decant -> freeze precip and again another two times, not fun thinking about what ava said, i don't see the point of the base wash once you have your combined initial shellite extractions.. you'll end up freebasing the DMT and ... ?? i tried it on a small amount and the water didn't pick up any colour or texture (not that i could see), then i tried an acid wash and again the acid water didn't pick up any colour (but i know it got the dmt) and the shellite looked nasty as hell - great as that means all the shite was left behind plus, like i said, at the end of the process used above i freeze precipitated, decanted, and dried with a fan and not a single bit of oil or colour remained. i'd like to recrystalise this just to see how white those crystals.. or i could just smoke it :) crystals next time i dunno about reusing solvent, never thought about it, never tried Fable.. move :) lol nah i'm sure you've got some high content stuff over there. good luck with longifolia and for sure let us all know how it goes Anyway fellas [b:1c92a940ba]Here is the first draft of the tek:[/b:1c92a940ba] http://rapidshare.com/files/40880324/LexTek_v0.1.pdf.html
[quote:1bdc4befdc]silly, yep i hear ya man, does this look familiar?[/quote:1bdc4befdc] Hey man, yes very familiar. I get nice clean crystals but it takes work. I find that if I cant get it real clean using hot shellite (hot stuff seems to redissolve the oils as well) I use slightly warm shellite and this leaves the crap behind. It takes more shellite to dissolve the same amount but when you stir the DMT and oil mix in the bottom of your recrystalization dish you end up with a hard ball of crud in the bottom which you can pour the DMT/Shellite off easily. I might be wasting a tiny bit of DMT but I find the loss acceptable for the gains of nice crystals. I will put up some pics if someone can tell me how to do it. You can see them here http://picasaweb.google.com/sillysyban/DMT/photo#5083747938314409778 http://picasaweb.google.com/sillysyban/DMT/photo#5083748238962120514
Would vacuum filtration through some standard whatman filter papers help to remove the oily residue? I get the feeling that if the oil is in solution it might find the celluloce matrix of the filter more appealing than the shellite. It certainly would be an easy way of cleaning things up in the final stages. This is only conjecture at the moment.
[quote:9b3d5806ea="Fable"] I have a couple of nice looking Mimosa hostilis each in a 25l pot they are both 2+ years old or so but once I start forming a relationship with the plants it gets harder and harder to take a life. [/quote:9b3d5806ea] Hey Fable, I can dig where you're coming from on this one. I've read that with the right techniques, you can harvest (some of) the root bark without killing the plant. The basic idea is to have an above ground box with no bottom, just four plywood sides, one side of which you can open (one corner connected with hinges and the other end latched.) To harvest you can open the box and dig in from the side to the roots. there you only remove some of the roots and/or root bark. Of course you can use this method to easily harvest a lot of plant roots (killing them). More details on this in "Trout's Notes on Cultivation of Desmanthus for Rootbark Production" by the legendary Keeper Trout, available here: http://www.entheobiblica.com/03.115-MOKSHA-Trout-Notes-Desmanthus.htm -z
[quote:4fa1e32f86="sillysyban"] ...I use slightly warm shellite and this leaves the crap behind. It takes more shellite to dissolve the same amount but when you stir the DMT and oil mix in the bottom of your recrystalization dish you end up with a hard ball of crud in the bottom which you can pour the DMT/Shellite off easily. I might be wasting a tiny bit of DMT but I find the loss acceptable for the gains of nice crystals. [/quote:4fa1e32f86] Yep that's exactly what i did to that spoon's worth of oil i recovered about 0.7g more of spice so definitely it's worth it but like i said this new process gives pure white crystal right at freeze precipitate.. i guess i have to wonder how much was lost along the way, but as with any extraction following the 3x rule for each step i doubt it would be anymore than negligible I was speaking to some people recently, they say you can recrystallise about five times on the oil and turn it into a big red nugget which 'really fucks you up' ?? :-k I tried smoking a dab of that oil as it was, way to harsh to smoke.. i think i'll stick to my spice [quote:4fa1e32f86="undergrounder"] 3. And finally with this tek what is the point of the first heated acid wash if you're not going to defat straight away? The DMT seems to be extracted fine in the base wash in other teks so can't you leave that step out? [/quote:4fa1e32f86] Mostly so all the work is done on liquids and not liquid with a whole bunch of powdered bark floating around. Tried straight to base once with acacia bark, i find the whole thing (getting the bark in the vessel, heating enough, blah blah) to be a real fuck around, that's just me though some people may not have an issue with it It also shits me because i use a siphon to pull the bottom layer off, you can't do this with plant material sitting at the bottom The process would still work if you did straight to base, once you've got your combined shellite pulls just start from step 5
My pleasure I hope it helps as many people as possible :) By the way, if you're going to soak your bark in pH14 water overnight, [b:6d9a649501]make sure[/b:6d9a649501] to heat up the solution and the shellite before you extract Performing that initial extraction at room temp is no good To ensure you get every bit of precious spice you need to make that stuff pretty hot AND I'd advise against using glass bottles for any of the extractions High pH solutions have the tendency to degrade glass and turn it quite brittle, combine this with high pressures (like when you add hot shellite to your hot pH14 + bark) and you're setting yourself up for trouble :) good luck
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