Plan for Extraction (DMT Fumarate from ACRB)

[Poads]

Hello everyone. I have been doing a few ACRB extractions, and my results have been sub-par to say the least. I've been doing the exact same thing as when I was able to obtain MHRB. But my results from ACRB haven't been as successful. My experiences certainly make me trip, but my visuals are extremely lacking, and overall I'm disappointed.

I believe that the cause of this is the high NMT content of ACRB. It is my understanding that MHRB contains little to no NMT, so those trips have been alot more profound. I've created a plan that will hopefully result in nearly pure DMT fumarate. I want you guys to tell me what you think. I'm terrible at chemistry, so please excuse my lack of "lingo". I treat these processes like baking a cake. Please tell me anything about this method that would fail.

1. Nothing new here, I will start by simmering powdered ACRB in a water/vinegar mixture for about 2 hours, separate the liquid from the sludge, and basify the liquid using lye. Everything in this step I have done many times before.

2. Instead of using naphtha as a solvent like I have done in the past, I will use HEPTANE. It is my understanding that DMT is soluble in Heptane, but not NMT. This is the step I am most concerned with. It's okay if I get some NMT, but I want to keep the NMT content as low as possible, as I feel that is what is causing my disappointing trips. I will mix heptane into the basified liquid, wait for separation, pull the heptane layer, and put in the freezer for 2-3 days.

3. I will separate the DMT from the heptane using coffee filters. I should have reasonably pure DMT freebase. I will dissolve the DMT freebase into XYLENE.

4. I will add a mixture of acetone and fumaric acid to the xylene mixture. A cloud should form. I will wait several hours, possibly overnight for the cloud to disappear. After that I should be able to pour of the liquid and scrape REASONABLY PURE DMT FUMARATE from the bottom of the container.

Please read through my plan, and tell me any flaws that I have. Thank you for your time.

Edit: I'm pretty sure I put this in the wrong section, feel free to move it to a more appropriate area. I'm still a "new member" (even though I've been here for like 2 years) so I cannot post everywhere, and it's very confusing for me to figure out exactly where to post things.

 

[Poads]

Note: I already posted this in the "collaborative research project" section. I'm pretty sure that is the wrong area, so I took the liberty of reposting it here. Feel free to delete the other post.

Hello everyone. I have been doing a few ACRB extractions, and my results have been sub-par to say the least. I've been doing the exact same thing as when I was able to obtain MHRB. But my results from ACRB haven't been as successful. My experiences certainly make me trip, but my visuals are extremely lacking, and overall I'm disappointed.

I believe that the cause of this is the high NMT content of ACRB. It is my understanding that MHRB contains little to no NMT, so those trips have been alot more profound. I've created a plan that will hopefully result in nearly pure DMT fumarate. I want you guys to tell me what you think. I'm terrible at chemistry, so please excuse my lack of "lingo". I treat these processes like baking a cake. Please tell me anything about this method that would fail.

1. Nothing new here, I will start by simmering powdered ACRB in a water/vinegar mixture for about 2 hours, separate the liquid from the sludge, and basify the liquid using lye. Everything in this step I have done many times before.

2. Instead of using naphtha as a solvent like I have done in the past, I will use HEPTANE. It is my understanding that DMT is soluble in Heptane, but not NMT. This is the step I am most concerned with. It's okay if I get some NMT, but I want to keep the NMT content as low as possible, as I feel that is what is causing my disappointing trips. I will mix heptane into the basified liquid, wait for separation, pull the heptane layer, and put in the freezer for 2-3 days.

3. I will separate the DMT from the heptane using coffee filters. I should have reasonably pure DMT freebase. I will dissolve the DMT freebase into XYLENE.

4. I will add a mixture of acetone and fumaric acid to the xylene mixture. A cloud should form. I will wait several hours, possibly overnight for the cloud to disappear. After that I should be able to pour of the liquid and scrape REASONABLY PURE DMT FUMARATE from the bottom of the container.

Please read through my plan, and tell me any flaws that I have. Thank you for your time.

 

[MultiDimensionalTherapy]

-

 

[Poads]

My research also shows that using dry ice could be a way to separate DMT from NMT. Can someone explain how to do this in VERY simple terms for a complete chemistry noob? It is my understanding that the dry ice would be added before putting the solvent containing a DMT/NMT mixture into the freezer to free-precipitate. What exactly would I do?

I'm also assuming that my heptane idea won't properly separate DMT and NMT, on the grounds that the idea is too simple, and someone would have most likely thought of it already if it were viable.

 

[cyb]

My research also shows that using dry ice could be a way to separate DMT from NMT. Can someone explain how to do this in VERY simple terms for a complete chemistry noob? It is my understanding that the dry ice would be added before putting the solvent containing a DMT/NMT mixture into the freezer to free-precipitate. What exactly would I do?

See Here ... Dry ice to precipitate NMT carbanate out of NP solvent for ACRB extract

 

[IANS]

I'm thinking the source material you're working with could well be low quality. When swim dose the basic A/B, filter, pull with naptha the result is almost always pure white crystals. There is normally a thin layer of a clear oily substance along with it but nothing major.

One thing swim dose is wash the naptha, do your pull into a clean jar, add about a cup of cold distilled water and give it a good shake. This will cause the naptha to cloud up right before your eyes and some of the unwanted crap will fall out into the water. And oh, if you really want purer.. after you wash the naptha you can watch it in your crystallization dish, at the first sign of crystals forming you can dump it off into yet another crystallization dish. That will leave most of the oily stuff behind.

But like I said, it seems like you know the routine well, and the source material your working with seems like it may well be lowend.


I consider the NMT in ACRB a major bonus, but I guess thats a different discussion.

 

[sarek]

This is based on the assumption that heptane will pull out DMT but not NMT. I believe I'm the one who floated this idea to you, but I do not have the knowledge or experience to say that this is the case. It was conjecture, based on heptane commonly being used for recrystallization because of its increased selectivity for DMT when compared to naphtha. I just thought I should tell you that I was merely throwing some ideas out there and you shouldn't necessarily take what I said as fact.

Again, what I said about heptane not dissolving NMT is based on no real evidence and is entirely conjecture, coming from somebody without any real education in chemistry.

Also, the use of Xylene seems unnecessary. It's nasty stuff so I prefer not to use it, but that's just personal preference.

Something you could change, and which would potentially give you some more information in regard to NMT's solubility in heptane, is to use naphtha for your original pulls, which in theory would pull out DMT and NMT, then freeze precipitate, then dissolve your product in heptane. If what I said is correct (it's probably not), then you would see some of your product dissolve into the heptane and some get left behind, which would presumably be mostly DMT in the heptane and mostly NMT that's left behind. Ideally you would use the absolute minimum amount of heptane to dissolve the suspected amount of DMT, and it would be at room temperature or colder.

This is probably wishful thinking though, and in all likelihood the NMT will probably dissolve in the heptane just as easily as the DMT. Maybe somebody here with some actual chemistry knowledge could clear this up. I don't want it to seem like I am spreading conjecture as fact.

 

[IANS]

I am also wondering:

3. I will separate the DMT from the heptane using coffee filters. I should have reasonably pure DMT freebase. I will dissolve the DMT freebase into XYLENE.

4. I will add a mixture of acetone and fumaric acid to the xylene mixture. A cloud should form. I will wait several hours, possibly overnight for the cloud to disappear. After that I should be able to pour of the liquid and scrape REASONABLY PURE DMT FUMARATE from the bottom of the container.

Shouldn't you just dissolve the DMT freebase in the acetone? Dissolving it in xylene first then adding acetone and fumaric acid is something ive never heard about.

 

[sarek]

Both will work. The common FASA approach is to add your fumaric acid saturated acetone to your NPS right after doing the pulls, as opposed to freeze precipitating first.

The advantage of dissolving the DMT into something like Xylene instead of directly into the acetone (though, like I said, Xylene is kind of overkill at this stage, and you'd be better off using Naphtha or Heptane) is that it is less likely to dissolve any impurities that your product might still have, similar to a re-crystallization step. Acetone will dissolve just about anything.

 

[IANS]

Both will work. The common FASA approach is to add your fumaric acid saturated acetone to your NPS right after doing the pulls, as opposed to freeze precipitating first.

The advantage of dissolving the DMT into something like Xylene instead of directly into the acetone (though, like I said, Xylene is kind of overkill at this stage, and you'd be better off using Naphtha or Heptane) is that it is less likely to dissolve any impurities that your product might still have, similar to a re-crystallization step. Acetone will dissolve just about anything.

Think Im getting lazy on the chemistry end. Its was a great deal of fun at first, but now its like work and not alot of fun anymore lol.


Thanks for the knowledge its much appreciated!

 

[Poads]

Yeah like I said, I'm not too keen on chemistry.

The reason for the xylene was because in all my FASA extractions I used xylene. For the record, I used xylene for FASA/fumarate and naphtha for freebase. I didn't know that I could simply dissolve the DMT in acetone. I've actually never converted from freebase to fumarate before. I always went straight to fumarate, so this process is somewhat new to me. Like I said, I treat this more like baking a cake, my knowledge of chemistry is practically zero.

CYB, thank you for the link, I will be sure to check it out sometime. That could be the answer I'm looking for.

IANS, I like your theory that the material itself could be to blame. For the record, I've only used 2 online sources to obtain the barks, one for MHRB and another one for ACRB. I won't name the sources because it's against the rules, but let's just say that my MHRB source is defunct, and it was used by many people. When I did my MHRB extractions, I was always highly satisfied with the result, especially when the MHRB came from Brazil as opposed to Mexico (but that's another topic).

With ACRB I just haven't been as satisfied. And it's not just me, my friends that I've shared it with have also agreed. I've done both freebase and fumarate extractions with ACRB, and once I got past the small learning curve, I've ended up with a perfect white product 100% of the time. If it were just fumarate extractions that were poor, I could blame fumaric acid being in my final product. But my freebase extractions are also a let down, and I obviously don't use fumaric acid in those. It's the exact same process that I used for MHRB, and those were highly successful.

I always assumed my product was perfect because it was completely white. I figured the more white it was, the better it was (that sounds racist...), but I guess that theory is wrong.

No discussion of sourcing. Please read The Attitude

 

[Poads]

Huh? Why I am I getting called out for sourcing? I didn't name my sources.

 

[cyb]

Huh? Why I am I getting called out for sourcing? I didn't name my sources.

It appears that you got called out because,
There is no discussion of sourcing and procuring...you discussed it.
The rules are very clear on this. :!:

Below is an example of 'Discussing Sourcing and Procuring of illegal substances'...if you write it down on a public forum for all to see and respond to, it's a discussion...Period.

I've only used 2 online sources to obtain the barks, one for MHRB and another one for ACRB.

but let's just say that my MHRB source is defunct

 

[Poads]

That seems a little strict considering I didn't mention my sources by name.

But if those are the rules, then fine. Arguing won't get me anywhere.

 

[cyb]

That seems a little strict considering I didn't mention my sources by name.

Poads
It's not just mentioning Sources...but discussing Sourcing too.

A subtle but necessary language nuance.

Have a look at This [IMPORTANT] No buying/selling/procuring, why? thread for further explanation.

Also Here Bye bye MHRB sourcing talk, we will remember you

 

[IANS]

I must have misunderstood the rules as well (Sorry for that).