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Psychedelics and the Liver
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Godsmacker
Rising Star
In short: it depends on the drug used.
Each and every drug is metabolized differently than other drugs. Some are metabolized by the liver by CYP450 enzymes, others are metabolized in other parts of the body by different enzymes, some break down naturally into other drugs, etc. Even one single drug can be broken down in a multitude of ways. Regarding psychedelics as a whole, this question cannot be definitely answered. Which psychedelic(s) in particular are you concerned about and what form are they dosed in (i.e. are they dosed as pure refined chemicals or are they administered via a natural medium such as a mushroom or tea made directly from natural products)? Ultimately your question rests on these pretenses: the kind of drug used and the medium it is administered in. If the drug is metabolized hepatically (in liver) the next question should be which enzymes and are those enzyme levels/functioning impaired by the presence of hep c?
Also, another thing to think of would be how advanced/controlled is the Hepatitis C? How well does their liver currently function? Are they seeing a Dr. for treatment of Hep C, and if so, is it well controlled and which medications are they currently taking? Some meds for Hep C may interfere with metabolic processes so keep that in mind as well. Also, a fairly well functioning liver with Hep C would be better able to metabolize drugs than a dysfunctional liver on its last leg. Yet again, this issue is a product of the circumstances surrounding it. Also, are there any kinds of drugs their doctor has specifically told them NOT to take since they have Hep C (certain kinds of drugs are metabolized via certain liver enzymes-if their Dr. told them which kinds of drugs not to take in particular it could be a sign that certain enzymes which also metabolize certain psychs may not be functioning normally and hence it wouldn't be safe to consume drug XYZ).
We cannot tell you for sure if it would be safe unless we knew which psychedelic in particular you were concerned with, the medium/ROA it was administered in and through, which meds the patient is currently taking for hep c, and how well their liver is currently functioning under current conditions.
I would be happy to answer any and all questions you may have; corpus callosum would also be a good person to PM with specifics as well.
Wishing you well,
-God
Each and every drug is metabolized differently than other drugs. Some are metabolized by the liver by CYP450 enzymes, others are metabolized in other parts of the body by different enzymes, some break down naturally into other drugs, etc. Even one single drug can be broken down in a multitude of ways. Regarding psychedelics as a whole, this question cannot be definitely answered. Which psychedelic(s) in particular are you concerned about and what form are they dosed in (i.e. are they dosed as pure refined chemicals or are they administered via a natural medium such as a mushroom or tea made directly from natural products)? Ultimately your question rests on these pretenses: the kind of drug used and the medium it is administered in. If the drug is metabolized hepatically (in liver) the next question should be which enzymes and are those enzyme levels/functioning impaired by the presence of hep c?
Also, another thing to think of would be how advanced/controlled is the Hepatitis C? How well does their liver currently function? Are they seeing a Dr. for treatment of Hep C, and if so, is it well controlled and which medications are they currently taking? Some meds for Hep C may interfere with metabolic processes so keep that in mind as well. Also, a fairly well functioning liver with Hep C would be better able to metabolize drugs than a dysfunctional liver on its last leg. Yet again, this issue is a product of the circumstances surrounding it. Also, are there any kinds of drugs their doctor has specifically told them NOT to take since they have Hep C (certain kinds of drugs are metabolized via certain liver enzymes-if their Dr. told them which kinds of drugs not to take in particular it could be a sign that certain enzymes which also metabolize certain psychs may not be functioning normally and hence it wouldn't be safe to consume drug XYZ).
We cannot tell you for sure if it would be safe unless we knew which psychedelic in particular you were concerned with, the medium/ROA it was administered in and through, which meds the patient is currently taking for hep c, and how well their liver is currently functioning under current conditions.
I would be happy to answer any and all questions you may have; corpus callosum would also be a good person to PM with specifics as well.
Wishing you well,
-God
For the sake of having the information available for someone searching in the future, can you give me more on specific psychedelics?
My primary interest would be in mushrooms in natural form, aya analouges particularly extracted DMT converted back to salt with either rue brew, extracted harmaline/THH (salted) or caapi brew, and lysergamides, including ETH-LAD, 1P-LSD, and LSD.
Currently there is no doctor treating the Hep C, so no medications to control it. It is probably safe to assume some liver impairment (more than 20 years with the virus, most of which time the liver would have been stressed without Hep C) but is asymptomatic except insomnia.
My primary interest would be in mushrooms in natural form, aya analouges particularly extracted DMT converted back to salt with either rue brew, extracted harmaline/THH (salted) or caapi brew, and lysergamides, including ETH-LAD, 1P-LSD, and LSD.
Currently there is no doctor treating the Hep C, so no medications to control it. It is probably safe to assume some liver impairment (more than 20 years with the virus, most of which time the liver would have been stressed without Hep C) but is asymptomatic except insomnia.
Godsmacker
Rising Star
This study is an good reference regarding the metabolic pathways concerning IndoleAlkylAmines (IAAs) including psilocybin, harmine, DMT, 5-MeO DMT, 5-MeO DIPT, etc. and lysergamides. I would highly recommend combing through it if you'd like to know more about how these drugs are metabolised-some silly sentiments are expressed along the way but the facts are worth their weight in gold. I have no clue how the LSD analogues are metabolized, but if the pharmacokinetics of ergotamine can be of any remote reference, I would think that lysergamides may be metabolized by some subset of CYP3A enzymes.
Unfortunately, I don't think it would be possible to accurately assess the presence of hep c and scope of liver function/damage unless a biopsy and bloodwork was done and interpreted by a Dr experienced with treating and diagnosing this disease. Also, the current drugs used to treat hep c have a very high cure rate as well. I can ramble on all I want about CYP-this and cytochrome-that, but at the end of the day I do not know what is going on inside his body and am in no such position or place to obtain that information and do not currently have the medicinal know-how needed to interpret that information. Until it is known how his liver is currently holding up, it would not be possible to say in confidence whether or not he may incur an adverse effect from psychedelic use. Has he used psychedelics during those 20-odd years he had hep c? If so, did he experience any adverse effects at those times? Also, if cirrhosis (scarring) of the liver is present, he should take caution and see a doctor as soon as possible-that can be fatal. My hunch would say that, given that he is still living after 20 years of infection and abuse, psychedelic use wouldn't incur any adverse metabolic mishaps (they aren't very hepatotoxic and their metabolism doesn't put much strain on liver functioning, however I'm not sure how Hep C changes levels/functioning of Cytochrome CYP-450 enzymes). However, that intuition isn't to be taken for granted or for medical advice. The only way to know for sure would be via bioassay, which can be risky, especially if one does not know have any data on their liver functioning and blood work before hand. The best advice I can offer him is to see a doctor concerning this issue in order to get a good idea as to how well he's holding up. I hope that the uncertainty lifts like a pre-dawn fog with the first rays of sunshine, burning this fear of the unknown to a crisp along with any uncertainty tied to it. Until then, it would probably be best to play it safe until more concrete and current data has been collected.
All the best,
-God
Unfortunately, I don't think it would be possible to accurately assess the presence of hep c and scope of liver function/damage unless a biopsy and bloodwork was done and interpreted by a Dr experienced with treating and diagnosing this disease. Also, the current drugs used to treat hep c have a very high cure rate as well. I can ramble on all I want about CYP-this and cytochrome-that, but at the end of the day I do not know what is going on inside his body and am in no such position or place to obtain that information and do not currently have the medicinal know-how needed to interpret that information. Until it is known how his liver is currently holding up, it would not be possible to say in confidence whether or not he may incur an adverse effect from psychedelic use. Has he used psychedelics during those 20-odd years he had hep c? If so, did he experience any adverse effects at those times? Also, if cirrhosis (scarring) of the liver is present, he should take caution and see a doctor as soon as possible-that can be fatal. My hunch would say that, given that he is still living after 20 years of infection and abuse, psychedelic use wouldn't incur any adverse metabolic mishaps (they aren't very hepatotoxic and their metabolism doesn't put much strain on liver functioning, however I'm not sure how Hep C changes levels/functioning of Cytochrome CYP-450 enzymes). However, that intuition isn't to be taken for granted or for medical advice. The only way to know for sure would be via bioassay, which can be risky, especially if one does not know have any data on their liver functioning and blood work before hand. The best advice I can offer him is to see a doctor concerning this issue in order to get a good idea as to how well he's holding up. I hope that the uncertainty lifts like a pre-dawn fog with the first rays of sunshine, burning this fear of the unknown to a crisp along with any uncertainty tied to it. Until then, it would probably be best to play it safe until more concrete and current data has been collected.
All the best,
-God
Thanks Godsmacker.
Right now he doesn't have health insurance, but the plan is to work on that (Obamacare or something) then get to a specialist to begin looking at options. It's terrifying. Like he said, he did everything he could to kill himself short of trying to commit suicide for 20+ years, and now that he really wants to live, he has to face the fact that he might have killed himself.
Has anyone here been through the treatments for Hep C? It's our understanding that it's akin to going through chemo as far as how it feels and treats the body.
Right now he doesn't have health insurance, but the plan is to work on that (Obamacare or something) then get to a specialist to begin looking at options. It's terrifying. Like he said, he did everything he could to kill himself short of trying to commit suicide for 20+ years, and now that he really wants to live, he has to face the fact that he might have killed himself.
Has anyone here been through the treatments for Hep C? It's our understanding that it's akin to going through chemo as far as how it feels and treats the body.
We found that there is a very affordable ayurvedic hepaprotective herbal medicine/supplement called LIV52 - it may be helpful with Hepatitis A, B, or other liver ailments, sluggish liver and even substance related liver abuse.
Anyway...
Please note, we do not recommend that you take LIV52 without first consulting an ayurvedic practitioner or another qualified medical practitioner. Neither should it be taken with other drugs (MAOI...etc) without investigating further..
Anyway...
They did not mention C....:| ..but it may still be good for the liver and help it better deal with toxins....etc?LIV52 said:
Please note, we do not recommend that you take LIV52 without first consulting an ayurvedic practitioner or another qualified medical practitioner. Neither should it be taken with other drugs (MAOI...etc) without investigating further..
Also interesting: in Chinese herbal system (not TCM) ACRB and ACTB are used as a liver tonic and this is probably attributed to the presence of gallic acid? Not sure, or it maybe a combination of stuff.
There is also a paper about it : Anti-hepatitis C virus activity of Acacia confusa extract via suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 - PubMed (thx notsure)
It claims anti hepatitis C activity of acacia confusa extract
If we had the choice between MHRB and ACRB we'd brew our haoma from the latter (and skip the egg yolk part).
We like it when it tastes like Kinnnngg Tut's mummyfried balls....
Another thing is: there is a new very costly allopathic drug called Sofosbuvir
It seems to be very effective ???
It costs between $84,000 to $168,000 for a course of treatment (12 weeks) and as a result, it is only given to select patients (with advancing cirrhosis - signs of death).
The 12 week course would prolly cost about $300 or less in India once it is available. This is good to know, just in case...(no suggestions made)
There is also a paper about it : Anti-hepatitis C virus activity of Acacia confusa extract via suppressing cyclooxygenase-2 - PubMed (thx notsure)
It claims anti hepatitis C activity of acacia confusa extract
If we had the choice between MHRB and ACRB we'd brew our haoma from the latter (and skip the egg yolk part).
We like it when it tastes like Kinnnngg Tut's mummyfried balls....
Another thing is: there is a new very costly allopathic drug called Sofosbuvir
It seems to be very effective ???
It costs between $84,000 to $168,000 for a course of treatment (12 weeks) and as a result, it is only given to select patients (with advancing cirrhosis - signs of death).
wikipedia said:
The 12 week course would prolly cost about $300 or less in India once it is available. This is good to know, just in case...(no suggestions made)
Oh wow! That's all good stuff, Intezam.
I'll hit notsure up to see if he knows anything more about the ACRB thing. We're buds.
And way to go, India- it pisses me off to no end that life-saving medications are available but desire for profit lets people die instead.
Thank you so much for all your help. It really means a lot that you're helping us out here.
I'll hit notsure up to see if he knows anything more about the ACRB thing. We're buds.
And way to go, India- it pisses me off to no end that life-saving medications are available but desire for profit lets people die instead.
Thank you so much for all your help. It really means a lot that you're helping us out here.
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