Kannamate said:
I never knew that nux vomica was the Strychnine tree. If some SWIM wanted to try with LSH would SWIM chew just one seed,or is even 1 seed potentially very dangerous?I read the seeds contain approximately 1.5% strychnine.
69ron said:
I would stay away from using nux vomica. The dose used is usually 500-1000 mg of seed powder. At 1.5% strychnine, 1000 mg of seed contain up to 15 mg. That seems very dangerous to me. From what I heard 5 mg has been fatal before, so I don’t see how even 500 mg of seed is safe because that could contain 7.5 mg of strychnine!
I think there’s not enough information about nux vomica seeds to even consider using them. I’m sure there’s a safe dose, but the 500-1000 mg dose I keep seeing on the web sounds very dangerous considering people have died from as little as 5 mg of strychnine.
We have a thread devoted to strychnine
here. I think more discussion on it is warranted.
SWIM tried 500 micrograms of strychnine a long time ago and it was very nice. But he gave up attempting to use the seeds because he could not find good consistent data on dosage. All the herbal dosage information I found on these nux vomica eeds seems to be within the danger zone.
So please stay away from using nux vomica unless you know the exact maximum safe dosage of seeds to use. It can easily kill you.
DO NOT ATTEMPT ANY OF WHAT I’M WRITING BELOW WITHOUT BEING ABSOLUTELY SURE YOU KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE DOING. NUX VOMICA CAN KILL YOU. SWIM IS AN EXPERIENCED PLANT EXTRACTOR AND TAKES ALL THE PROPER PRECAUTIONS TO ENSURE COMPLETE SAFETY WHEN EXTRACTING NUX VOMICA AND USING THE EXTRACT. HE’S RESEARCHED THE SUBJECT EVERYDAY FOR MANY MONTHS NOW AND KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT HE’S DOING. AN IMPROPERLY FORMULATED NUX VOMICA EXTRACT CAN KILL A PERSON. EVEN THE VERY ACT OF EXTRACTION OF NUX VOMICA CAN KILL A PERSON.
I want to revisit this. I find the subject of strychnine in combination with lysergamides to be fascinating. As most of you are aware, it’s a common myth that strychnine is present on a lot of blotter acid. This is generally not the case. Tests show this to be very rare. There have been a few verified criminal murder cases in which Alexander Shulgin talks about where real strychnine was found on blotter acid, but it’s usually found along with brucine, indicating that the blotter was made using an extract of nux vomica and LSD and not pure strychnine. But in general, strychnine is not found on blotter acid. The effects of cramping, muscle twitches, etc., that some LSD produces, is in fact caused by other lysergamides present as common LSD impurities and breakdown products.
SWIM has been experimenting with strychnos nux vomica. He’s made a 48 ounce extract of 1 seed weighing 951 mg. The strength of the extract is 550 micrograms of alkaloids per ml. Approximately 35-50% of that is strychnine and the rest is of course brucine. Now brucine is about 1/20 as active as strychnine, so in these tests we completely disregard the brucine content because it’s not active in the doses used. So the extract is roughly 192-275 micrograms of strychnine, and 275-357 micrograms of brucine per ml. I’ll assume the average amount based on potency studies which would be 243 micrograms of strychnine per ml. That’s a very small safe amount. Typical adult doses of strychnine are 1-3.2 mg taken three times a day. Anything above 5 mg would be considered toxic, but not really lethal for an adult. Lethal adult doses normally range from 30-120 mg but may be lower for some individuals.
THE EFFECTS OF NUX VOMICA
Ok, so now for the really interesting part. SWIM has done several strychnine tests so far, both with and without LSH. Keep in mind that his extract also contains brucine, so it’s not 100% pure strychnine. He’s used up to 1.5 ml of extract (which would contain approximately 364 micrograms of strychnine).
As expected, 1 ml is quite active, especially when taken sublingually. It’s an interesting experience and resembles LSD when taken sublingually. It is not psychedelic in the true meaning of the word, but is somewhat psychedelic and could easily be confused with a small stimulant dose of LSD.
1 ml taken sublingually produces effects in about 20 minutes and seems to peak after 60-90 minutes. The brucine present causes the mouth to get a little numb. The strychnine effects felt include pleasant tingling sensations in the body and mild stimulant effects almost identical to a small dose of LSD. The most interesting effect is the effect it has on the senses, which is very much like a small dose of LSD: your sense of awareness is heightened, sounds are richer, vision is more intense, clearer, special awareness is expanded.
The effect is so similar to a small dose of LSD that a person could be fooled into thinking it’s a small dose of LSD if told so. Aside from the mild alterations of visual and auditory perception, the stimulant effects, and pleasant bodily sensations, there are no actual psychedelic effects.
THE EFFECTS WITH LSH
This is a little more interesting. SWIM used 1.5 ml orally (not sublingually) with a sub-psychedelic dose of LSH extracted from 1 gram of heavenly blue morning glories. It made the normally inactive dose active. It somehow increased the potency. It made the trip feel very much like LSD. Even though the LSH dose was inactive on it’s own, in combination with the strychnine from nux vomica, it produced obvious visual effects and was very euphoric. The two go extremely well together.
SWIM will try this combination again, likely with a much larger dose of heavenly blue morning glories (that’s all he had right now) to see how the interaction plays out at doses where the LSH is active on it’s own.
NOTES IN REGARD TO LSD
SWIM has used pure strychnine in the past long ago. His nux vomica extract tastes almost entirely of strychnine even at the minute doses used. Strychnine is extremely bitter tasting even at doses as small as 50 micrograms (the smallest dose he’s used). Now what SWIM finds very interesting, and baffling, is that he recalls quite a bit of acid having that same taste, perhaps as much as 5% of the total acid he’s used in the past! What accounts for that? I’ve read many times that acid available on blotter that contains strychnine is less than 0.1%. How could 5% of the samples that SWIM has had taste like strychnine? The taste is very distinctive and not easily mistaken.
Why am I bringing this up? Well, many people complain their acid has strychnine in it, but their acid is tasteless. If your acid is tasteless or just sour, or medicinal, but not bitter, it cannot contain strychnine. Strychnine is extremely bitter and can very easily be tasted in the microgram range. Acid with strychnine in it, even as little as 50 micrograms of strychnine, will taste bitter, and the taste lingers in the mouth for several minutes.
