More importantly what about the girls at the water park?
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Sprouting morning glory first?
- Thread starter eLeSDee
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I'm planning to offer them a cup of aojiru - that'll help keep them at bay
So, I read through most of the transcript with Dennis McKenna featuring Matthew Stahl. It seems unlikely that this 'LSI' is pharmacologically active. He needs to isolate a pure compound and perform professional molecular evaluation in order to prove its existence. Then, determine its activity with carefully controlled studies. All of which could take, well, who knows how long! Experimentation is one thing, but to call his experiments the "Ancient LSA of Vedic SOMA Eleusis and so on and so forth.." I mean, c'mon, we need to verify these things. It just seems a bit cultish, as if he's leading everyone forward into thinking, "oh, well just read my book and you'll understand." No, that's not how science works.
Always a pleasure reading what Dennis has to say. At this point, assuming he has some capability to do so, Matthew has no choice but to proceed and continue speaking publicly, and eventually work with credentialed academics and chemists. Time for science to bust the door wide open! All he's got to lose are his Aojjiru jars.
Always a pleasure reading what Dennis has to say. At this point, assuming he has some capability to do so, Matthew has no choice but to proceed and continue speaking publicly, and eventually work with credentialed academics and chemists. Time for science to bust the door wide open! All he's got to lose are his Aojjiru jars.
Well, here it is:
While the hypothesis makes for a compelling assemblage of ethnobotanical and historical information, the first ten minutes of the podcast have been, for me, less than enthralling to listen to. Maybe it picks up later. 69ron namedrop is at 40:33, followed by some bull…stuff.
That, indeed, is and has been exactly the problem.
Dennis McKenna does call him out ever so gently later on: timestamp
and goes on to express some of the criticisms that chemists have been making.
I've had to listen in ten minute stints to keep the experience bearable. The level of self-promotion doesn't quite reach that of some more famous multi-billionaires, but there's a certain parallel in claiming to have invented stuff which already exists, in particular applying established chemical procedures to the production of THH from harmaline, and its subseqent isolation using ammonia: timestamp
and goes on to express some of the criticisms that chemists have been making.
I've had to listen in ten minute stints to keep the experience bearable. The level of self-promotion doesn't quite reach that of some more famous multi-billionaires, but there's a certain parallel in claiming to have invented stuff which already exists, in particular applying established chemical procedures to the production of THH from harmaline, and its subseqent isolation using ammonia: timestamp
I wish I'd thought of doing this before actually attempting to listen to the podcast, although Dennis McKenna is astoundingly gracious in his handling of an absolute crackpot.
It doesn’t seem like the theory soma=ergot has much support behind it. I mean I don’t believe it personally.
Also decanting cactus tea is not some new discovery. I thought everyone did that.
Well, I've sort of tried combining the idea in the OP of this thread, and the barley grass idea. I soaked 179 heavenly blues for 12 hours or so in about 50 mL water, then strained tiat off into an amber glass bottle which was kept closed and refrigerated while the seeds sprouted for a day.
The seeds were then soaked for another ~12 hours in 100 mL water and strained once more. Both the original soak and the second one showed some fluorescence with the "UV" spy pen. Both soaks along with some additional rinsing was combined in a glass with 10 g of powdered barley grass, 160 mg ascorbic acid and a teaspoon of kelp powder (just to make sure it would be somewhat revolting ), stirred thoroughly and left in the refrigerator for 30 minutes.
After this resting time, the contents of the glass was stirred once more and then consumed fairly promptly, rinsing the residue with further fresh water and drinping that as well to ensure that as much of the likely minimal dose as possible was got down the hatch.
After about half an hour, a bowl of muesli was eaten due to incipient hunger. About an hour after consumption of the 'mixed beverage' there was a mild stimulation with enhanced acuity of vision.
After a further hour there may have been a slight psychedelic edge to the mindspace, although that equally may have been on account of the lateness of the hour. Conclusion: ±/+ on the Shulgin scale. The enhanced visual acuity was unmistakable, probably worth trying with 300 M.G. seeds, or fewer if one were to crush them up for a more thorough extraction.
It seems possible to save the soaking water for consumption and then just plant the seeds - with this method there are currently 156 potential plants potted up and waiting for the weather to warm up a bit, sat in the corner of the conservatory. Ideally, each one of those will produce maybe a hundred or more further seeds (6 seeds per pod, 16 - 17 pods per plant seems wholly realistic). If even 100 plants survive, that could produce 10000 seeds. Then it will be possible to ascertain whether Stahl's claims regarding the barley grass method requiring HBWR rather than MG actually hold any water (he doesn't mention whether he'd tried any different batches or varieties of MG afaics, and the alkaloid profile of these plants will vary according to geographic region, etc).
The seeds were then soaked for another ~12 hours in 100 mL water and strained once more. Both the original soak and the second one showed some fluorescence with the "UV" spy pen. Both soaks along with some additional rinsing was combined in a glass with 10 g of powdered barley grass, 160 mg ascorbic acid and a teaspoon of kelp powder (just to make sure it would be somewhat revolting
), stirred thoroughly and left in the refrigerator for 30 minutes.After this resting time, the contents of the glass was stirred once more and then consumed fairly promptly, rinsing the residue with further fresh water and drinping that as well to ensure that as much of the likely minimal dose as possible was got down the hatch.
After about half an hour, a bowl of muesli was eaten due to incipient hunger. About an hour after consumption of the 'mixed beverage' there was a mild stimulation with enhanced acuity of vision.
After a further hour there may have been a slight psychedelic edge to the mindspace, although that equally may have been on account of the lateness of the hour. Conclusion: ±/+ on the Shulgin scale. The enhanced visual acuity was unmistakable, probably worth trying with 300 M.G. seeds, or fewer if one were to crush them up for a more thorough extraction.
It seems possible to save the soaking water for consumption and then just plant the seeds - with this method there are currently 156 potential plants potted up and waiting for the weather to warm up a bit, sat in the corner of the conservatory. Ideally, each one of those will produce maybe a hundred or more further seeds (6 seeds per pod, 16 - 17 pods per plant seems wholly realistic). If even 100 plants survive, that could produce 10000 seeds. Then it will be possible to ascertain whether Stahl's claims regarding the barley grass method requiring HBWR rather than MG actually hold any water (he doesn't mention whether he'd tried any different batches or varieties of MG afaics, and the alkaloid profile of these plants will vary according to geographic region, etc).
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Very interesting! Thank you for the report & details! Do you think adding the two rinses to the ascorbic acid & barley grass did anything extra at all or maybe all that was needed was the water?
I have lots of heavenly blues growing and plan to get HWBW seeds rolling too.
I am definitely going to be doing some experiments myself I have just been busy tripping my face off with PE and of course LSD.
I will probably do the same method but first I am just going to strain the seeds and as they start to crack open to germinate..maybe I could then pulverize all of that and stir,sit,stir, &strain...I think that ought to do the trick but if I really need ascorbic acid, then so it shall be done.
I am finally about to listen to that podcast today..I am way behind.
I have lots of heavenly blues growing and plan to get HWBW seeds rolling too.
I am definitely going to be doing some experiments myself I have just been busy tripping my face off with PE and of course LSD.
I will probably do the same method but first I am just going to strain the seeds and as they start to crack open to germinate..maybe I could then pulverize all of that and stir,sit,stir, &strain...I think that ought to do the trick but if I really need ascorbic acid, then so it shall be done.
I am finally about to listen to that podcast today..I am way behind.
It's simply my approach as a seasoned chemist, skinflint and erstwhile psychonaut, with a pinch of tongue-in-cheek "this individual molecule will be the one that tips the scales in fagour of enlightenment" kind of vibe
Every molecule counts at that low dose 
But sure, I still can't tell if it was just the effects of, say, hordenine from the barley grass - I'll repeat soon, minus the MG water.
This podcast episode had me intrigued, and as someone with nothing resembling even an inkling of chemistry knowledge, I got the book and gave the LSA preparation a shot. That was this morning. Following the instructions to a ‘t’ with 20 high quality HBWR seeds of the correct variety, I became ill and puked with a mild, short-lasting and semi-euphoric psychedelic experience. Nothing great. Certainly NOT like ALD-52 and mescaline combined, and hell, I’ve never even tried ALD-52.
Speaking of nausea, the book contains some of the most painfully atrocious writing I’ve ever seen printed on a page. Much of the content itself is bizarre, particularly the autobiographical parts. It’s a surreal trip all its own.
Sorry to be so critical - and perhaps my judgements are unwarranted - but I’m somewhat relieved to see here from you all many of my suspicions shared and possibly confirmed. Maybe somewhere in this big pile of strangeness there is some clue or hint to something else, but on the surface I can’t see it. I’ll allow plenty of space for anomalies and misunderstandings on my part.
Speaking of nausea, the book contains some of the most painfully atrocious writing I’ve ever seen printed on a page. Much of the content itself is bizarre, particularly the autobiographical parts. It’s a surreal trip all its own.
Sorry to be so critical - and perhaps my judgements are unwarranted - but I’m somewhat relieved to see here from you all many of my suspicions shared and possibly confirmed. Maybe somewhere in this big pile of strangeness there is some clue or hint to something else, but on the surface I can’t see it. I’ll allow plenty of space for anomalies and misunderstandings on my part.
I'm both sorry and tragically unsurprised to hear that it worked out for you this way. My condolences go out to you, also, that you chose to endure an entire book of his tortu(r)ous ramblings, and I can only congratulate you for having survived the process.
Had Mr Stahl not repeatedly fallen foul of our forum rules, he may have been in a position to receive some meaningful editorial feedback. Alas, I fear he was ultimately more interested in monetisation and self-aggrandisement - a.k.a. the grift.
Have you considered asking for a refund?
Thanks Transform. All is well.
I didn’t read the book cover-to-cover. I skipped around and quickly got the point. Maybe I’ll send it back to Amazon, bent spine and all.
You’re probably right - he was in a rush to gain something. In the audio interview, he repeatedly responds to acknowledgements of his “findings” with a self-satisfied “thank you.” Just the sound of it says a lot.
Too good to be true. But again, all is well.
I didn’t read the book cover-to-cover. I skipped around and quickly got the point. Maybe I’ll send it back to Amazon, bent spine and all.
You’re probably right - he was in a rush to gain something. In the audio interview, he repeatedly responds to acknowledgements of his “findings” with a self-satisfied “thank you.” Just the sound of it says a lot.
Too good to be true. But again, all is well.
Glad to hear it, although I have to confess there was a large element of tongue-in-cheek to my replies, mostly as an outlet for the resigned disappointment and frustration routinely experienced in addressing Stahl's outlandish claims.
I'm still growing a load of morning glories anyhow. The flowers will be beautiful, and anything beyond that is just a bonus.
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