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Storage of Bufotenin Freebase

Migrated topic.

Bert

Rising Star
I know this isn't the right subforum, but it's one of the few I have the ability to post in, so I'll post it here.

I've read that bufotenin freebase oxidizes relatively quickly to bufotenin N-oxide in open air. I think it was 69ron who suggested that such oxidation could be responsible for the strong negative effects and lack of psychedelic activity (especially visual) when it was used by researchers in the 50s and 60s. Some of the unpleasant effects are likely from bufotenin itself, from reports I've read, and the clinical setting and subjects (many of whom were involuntary) were also likely to blame.

Two ideas immediately come to mind for its storage: a vacuum-sealed container or storage in a nitrogen gas environment. Both have their own pros and cons. Vacuum-sealing is unlikely to be complete unless high-quality professional equipment is used, so there would likely be some oxygen present with which the freebase could react; it would, however, allow samples to be taken from the container and re-sealed without too much trouble. With nitrogen gas, opening and resealing the container would be a bit of a pain since some would escape, and it would have to be refilled. However, with some pressure behind it, N2 can be used to basically completely replace the oxygen in a container.

A third alternative would be to store the bufotenin as a salt and freebase with sodium carbonate or some other weak base when needed, but it would be rather impractical for situations other than infrequent use.

Any other ideas? Has anybody heard of any other methods or people's experiences in this matter?
 
store it in solution... dispersed in a solvent like (non-petroleum) Ether... it doesn't even matter if its soluble in the solvent .. but if it is.. the jar must be completely airtight and should be filled to the brim with the liquid... it will keep for ages that way .. if you have a salt of a similar alkaloid it can also be stored that way .. it will just settle at the bottom of the jar.. protected by a sheild of oxygen free liquid.

Much easier than the nitrogen setup i'd sa.

Peace and godspeed!
 
Spiceman said:
store it in solution... dispersed in a solvent like (non-petroleum) Ether... it doesn't even matter if its soluble in the solvent .. but if it is.. the jar must be completely airtight and should be filled to the brim with the liquid... it will keep for ages that way .. if you have a salt of a similar alkaloid it can also be stored that way .. it will just settle at the bottom of the jar.. protected by a sheild of oxygen free liquid.

Much easier than the nitrogen setup i'd sa.

Peace and godspeed!

I've thought about that possibility (but in something it's soluble in), but that's rather comparable to storing it as a salt.

Protecting it with a solvent in which it won't dissolve is an interesting idea, provided it's a solvent that will evaporate easily (which ether is, but it's not exactly commonly available).

Edit: BTW, theoretically propane gas could also be used without pressure since it's denser than oxygen, but it wouldn't smell so nice!
 
fractal enchantment said:
I havent noticed a breakdown at all..mine doesnt usually last longer than a month though ever..I dont extract all my seeds at once

How pure was it to begin with? What sort of environment was it stored in?
 
Auto parts store, starting fluid... read the labels until you find a good one that contains di-ethyl ether only or in combo with heptane, make sure it lists no petroleum distilates.. spray a little and see if its yellow or clear.. if clear and meets the above criteria its good...

empty the contents of your cans into like a 2 liter soda bottle... mix with equal portion of water and shake for a while... remove water... smell that nasty junk..

now you have clean suitable ether ... godspeed!
 
Spiceman said:
Auto parts store, starting fluid... read the labels until you find a good one that contains di-ethyl ether only or in combo with heptane, make sure it lists no petroleum distilates.. spray a little and see if its yellow or clear.. if clear and meets the above criteria its good...

empty the contents of your cans into like a 2 liter soda bottle... mix with equal portion of water and shake for a while... remove water... smell that nasty junk..

now you have clean suitable ether ... godspeed!

I've heard of this method before, but I'm skeptical and Erowid backs me up. Sounds like that cure is worse than the disease.

 
Starting Fluid Good Stuff
Fractional distillation is the way to go and can be done in garage/kitchen but you will have to do some research because i will not post it here. Its a relativey simple procedure that is very dangerous. Like they say if you can swim in water 4feet deep you can swim in water 100 feet deep.

Learning to swim was one of the best decisions i have ever made. I dont care how deep it is I am a SWIMER and when i get tired i can float on my back indefinitely.

Peace
MV
 
Absolutely MV ... swim agrees with you and does the same.. however swim used diethyl ether cleaned with water for the first ten years of his spice explorations.... 100's of extractions and it always worked great if he used a clean brand and stuck to the aforementioned rules before buying and then washing before use. Always a gem... and its much easier to convince someone to mix someone with equal parts water and shake than it is to learn to do and purchase equip for fractal dist. lol ... i agree wholeheartedly tho.

As long as it evaps clean its OK.... you can always wash off the residue with something like clean acetone anyways.. there is nothing to fear using auto grade ether if its checked well enough first, and cleaned with water.

BTW- that water thing works for all otc solvents like xylene, naptha , etc... If you doubt the need for such a process anyone, just try it one time... remove the water and look/smell it...

arent ya glad that didn't wind up in your spice?!?!

That was just one dude from erowid giving his opinion... my opinion is that most of the starting fluid out there is nasty but a couple of brands are ok and are petroleum distillate free from the factory because they are fractionally disttlled there. Its all about choice man... take a mirror in with with you .. spray a lil on it and blow.. observe color of liquid .. and residue's if any.. make your choice. Gunk brand Thrust is GRDE A TOP NOTCH and requires no cleaning at all. Godspeed!
 
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