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The best alternative to gassing mesc hcl - a tek
- Thread starter Phlux-
- Start date
Can you give light to some numbers Phlux? Was the mescaline yield as expected from the amount of starting material used? any more or less than a usual limo extraction?
And how much hcl was addeed, or is this not so important in this case?
And how much hcl was addeed, or is this not so important in this case?
Original face - " Pure mescaline, mmmm, I wonder if the precipitation would occur if the anhydrous acetone-HCl were added to an anhydrous solution of mescaline freebase in toluene? "
It works perfectly in tolulene - thats what was originally used - and i had a friend try it with xylene - works great too.
Read the original thread.
no idea on the numbers - i went by feel - but the original thread gives a few.
i decanted the clear solution then filtered the last bit to collect the mesc.
I totally prefer working with mesc hcl over acetate.
Where i live its hot and humid and i dont have a food dehydrator so i basically cant get the acetate salts nice, dry and clean.
I also dont really like the effects of the acetate salts.
Hcl salts are hard, dry and xtally - u can grow nice xtals if u want - easy to clean - and the fx are impo - the best.
Another form i like the effects of is citrate but its not easy to grow nice pure citrate xtals.
Has anyone tried a monotartrate salt of mesc - as in titrating back a bitartrate salt ?
Surely that would give good purity - and iv never tried tartrate salts of mesc b4 so it would be an interesting new experience.
It works perfectly in tolulene - thats what was originally used - and i had a friend try it with xylene - works great too.
Read the original thread.
no idea on the numbers - i went by feel - but the original thread gives a few.
i decanted the clear solution then filtered the last bit to collect the mesc.
I totally prefer working with mesc hcl over acetate.
Where i live its hot and humid and i dont have a food dehydrator so i basically cant get the acetate salts nice, dry and clean.
I also dont really like the effects of the acetate salts.
Hcl salts are hard, dry and xtally - u can grow nice xtals if u want - easy to clean - and the fx are impo - the best.
Another form i like the effects of is citrate but its not easy to grow nice pure citrate xtals.
Has anyone tried a monotartrate salt of mesc - as in titrating back a bitartrate salt ?
Surely that would give good purity - and iv never tried tartrate salts of mesc b4 so it would be an interesting new experience.
Espiridion
--who.??..ME??--
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
This will probably be an easy question for the chemistry-minded folks out there. Is it possible to obtain acetic acid-saturated acetone or limonene by way of mixing vinegar and one of the solvents and adding copious amounts of anhydrous magnesium sulfate? If so, that would be a neat way to use this tek and avoid having to evaporate vinegar / HCL water pulls while maintaining the food-safe aspect.
Touche Guevara, pure acetic acid is called glacial acetic acid. It can be found in food grade form. But it doesn't work like you would think. Adding pure acetic acid to limonene or xylene will not precipitate mescaline acetate. I'm not sure why, but many have tried it (including SWIM) and it doesn't work until water is added. Maybe if you wait a few weeks it might precipitate after a while.
You might as well give up on that idea. Unless you leave some water in it, it won’t work like you're thinking.
You might as well give up on that idea. Unless you leave some water in it, it won’t work like you're thinking.
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
Ahh, well. Thanks for the response!
WOW, SWIM just tried the tek, he is almost doubting that it is mescaline. He taste tasted and it doesn't have much taste at all, isn't mescaline supposed to be bitter?
Anyway he followed the tek completely and came out with this (a tiny amount, only added about 15 drops of the anhydrous HASA)
is it mescaline? IS IT REALLY THAT EASY?
SWIM is doubting himself,
He just made some quick resin ,
mixed some lime in with it and some water,
mixed it about 5 times and left it overnight.
Dried it over ~40-50C bath then added xylene.
Mixed a couple times over 30 minutes, poured off and filter the xylene
Added the AHASA
Collected with dropper.
Evaporated.
Easier than baking a cake!
Anyway he followed the tek completely and came out with this (a tiny amount, only added about 15 drops of the anhydrous HASA)
is it mescaline? IS IT REALLY THAT EASY?
SWIM is doubting himself,
He just made some quick resin ,
mixed some lime in with it and some water,
mixed it about 5 times and left it overnight.
Dried it over ~40-50C bath then added xylene.
Mixed a couple times over 30 minutes, poured off and filter the xylene
Added the AHASA
Collected with dropper.
Evaporated.
Easier than baking a cake!
This technique has some potential flaws.
For once, SWIM doubts whether HCl is very soluble in acetone. SWIM does not see how HCl can dissolve in acetone. Does anyone have any examples of this actually happening (e.g. officially verified)?
For another, the HCl/water-in-acetone and dried with MgSO4 mixture may hold a good amount of magnesium sulfate dissolved. Magnesium sulfate is soluble in water. It is possible that an amount of magnesium sulfate is what actually precipitates out of the limonene when the treated acetone is added.
People (esp you the chemical experts!) should learn how to do proper control experiments in these cases, otherwise one cannot be very certain of what is happening. An appropriate control in this case is the utilisation of acetone in which some water (an amount equivalent to the one present in the added HCl) has been added and then dried with magnesium sulfate. This is a negative control (e.g. has no HCl) and should cause no precipitation when added into a limo pull from cactus.
This is how you make real science people.
Also, Phlux, did you try your precipitates? Are they actually mescaline? They look like magnesium sulfate in your pictures but looks can be deceiving. Are they bitter at all???
For once, SWIM doubts whether HCl is very soluble in acetone. SWIM does not see how HCl can dissolve in acetone. Does anyone have any examples of this actually happening (e.g. officially verified)?
For another, the HCl/water-in-acetone and dried with MgSO4 mixture may hold a good amount of magnesium sulfate dissolved. Magnesium sulfate is soluble in water. It is possible that an amount of magnesium sulfate is what actually precipitates out of the limonene when the treated acetone is added.
People (esp you the chemical experts!) should learn how to do proper control experiments in these cases, otherwise one cannot be very certain of what is happening. An appropriate control in this case is the utilisation of acetone in which some water (an amount equivalent to the one present in the added HCl) has been added and then dried with magnesium sulfate. This is a negative control (e.g. has no HCl) and should cause no precipitation when added into a limo pull from cactus.
This is how you make real science people.
Also, Phlux, did you try your precipitates? Are they actually mescaline? They look like magnesium sulfate in your pictures but looks can be deceiving. Are they bitter at all???
SWIM is quite sure that HCl did absorb, the mix smells strongly of it.
The second pull was slightly off-white and horribly bitter (SWIM exclaimed "that's why the brew tastes like that" ) and even though a max of 20mg he guesses was licked (of the second pull), he has a slight head-change and tracers!
Though there may be some MgSO4 contamination, it seems that it does pull pure or nearly pure mescaline HCl and it also much easier to evaporate.
Question then remains: is there a simple way to separate the epsom salts from the mescaline? Would this work? Phlux's Quick Mescaline Hcl Recrystallization tek. or maybe something even simpler?
The second pull was slightly off-white and horribly bitter (SWIM exclaimed "that's why the brew tastes like that" ) and even though a max of 20mg he guesses was licked (of the second pull), he has a slight head-change and tracers!
Though there may be some MgSO4 contamination, it seems that it does pull pure or nearly pure mescaline HCl and it also much easier to evaporate.
Question then remains: is there a simple way to separate the epsom salts from the mescaline? Would this work? Phlux's Quick Mescaline Hcl Recrystallization tek. or maybe something even simpler?
So SWIM was working with the substance and he thinks it is largely mescaline. It seemed to only yield about 1.2% off of the first pull of xylene and wouldn't precipitate after that.
However upon some deep pondering he thought of a very simple alternative method that he thinks works better and is much easier to prepare.
He basically made the anhydrous hydrochloric acid saturated acetone without drying it. Since HCl is so damn concentrated the 2-3% water content dissolves nearly no impurities (mescaline is barely off white)
SWIM added about 15 drops of the HCl-Acetone mix to a new fresh pull of xylene to make sure there was no MgSO4 contamination lingering and it yeilded ~10mg of barely off white powder that was bitter-sour and a little chemical tasting, that's what mescaline hcl tastes like right?
SWIM is now going to complete the rest of the extraction which should yield a gram or more
However upon some deep pondering he thought of a very simple alternative method that he thinks works better and is much easier to prepare.
He basically made the anhydrous hydrochloric acid saturated acetone without drying it. Since HCl is so damn concentrated the 2-3% water content dissolves nearly no impurities (mescaline is barely off white)
SWIM added about 15 drops of the HCl-Acetone mix to a new fresh pull of xylene to make sure there was no MgSO4 contamination lingering and it yeilded ~10mg of barely off white powder that was bitter-sour and a little chemical tasting, that's what mescaline hcl tastes like right?
SWIM is now going to complete the rest of the extraction which should yield a gram or more
inf - i dosed off the precip stuff - it was incredible - the original tek was created by lorax - many ppl have had great success with it - read the links from the original post.
q21 - most hcl is around 67% water - this proceedure needs to remain anhydrous.
if the solution is dried and then filtered there is no way ur dessicant can come across.
q21 - most hcl is around 67% water - this proceedure needs to remain anhydrous.
if the solution is dried and then filtered there is no way ur dessicant can come across.
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
Any thoughts as to a good use for the limo/acetone mix that one would be left with? Unless there's a way to separate the acetone, perhaps by distillation, it seems that this tek would be somewhat wasteful.
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