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Trying to improve Acacia information
- Thread starter nen888
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Auxin
Esteemed member
A. urophylla appears in a old paper where a guy adventured through WA testing every plant he could identify using HgCl2/KI and estimating relative alkaloid precipitation. The two acacias to rank a 'strongly positive' alkaloid presence were urophylla and burkittii.acacian said:
I could find no paper saying what alks they were.
[Among 'moderately strong' Leguminosae were A. acuminata, farnesiana, subaerulea, and xiphophylla. Numerous grasses were noted, including P. aquatica, some Convolulaceae were noted for the lysergic enthusiasts. Fun paper.]
Distribution of alkaloids in some Western Australian plants
Economic Botany
December 1971, Volume 25, Issue 4, pp 366-380
Auxin said:
Yep. Here it is
..yeah that is a great paper, which i think got mentioned aeons ago in the thread..shows what a reagent kit and a bit of imagination can achieve..
thanks Auxin..that's a good info post..
and thank you Vodsel for finding it..great to see you in the thread..
thanks Auxin..that's a good info post..
and thank you Vodsel for finding it..great to see you in the thread..
^^..ok, i remember..(actually i consulted the index ) Acacia xiphophylla (& paper) was on page 39 here..boy how things get embedded deep in the catacombs of the thread..! thanks again for the reminder Auxin..
Acacia urophylla is an interesting looking species morphologically ..very distinctive phyllodes..more of a shrub than a tree usually..
pictured below..endemic to s.w. W.A...
) Acacia xiphophylla (& paper) was on page 39 here..boy how things get embedded deep in the catacombs of the thread..! thanks again for the reminder Auxin..Acacia urophylla is an interesting looking species morphologically ..very distinctive phyllodes..more of a shrub than a tree usually..
pictured below..endemic to s.w. W.A...
Attachments
..happy end-of-the-world anniversary,
and now for christmas..
Exodus 25:10
The Ark (of the Covenant)
25:10-20pp -- Ex 37:1-9
10 "Have them make a chest of Acacia wood -- two and a half cubits long, a cubit and a half wide, and a cubit and a half high."
be well all..
below, the holy Shittah (Faidherbia. (prev. Acacia) albida) in the Valley of Elah,
and on the road to Bethlehem..
and now for christmas..
Exodus 25:10
The Ark (of the Covenant)
25:10-20pp -- Ex 37:1-9
10 "Have them make a chest of Acacia wood -- two and a half cubits long, a cubit and a half wide, and a cubit and a half high."
be well all..
below, the holy Shittah (Faidherbia. (prev. Acacia) albida) in the Valley of Elah,
and on the road to Bethlehem..
Attachments
Seldom
Wiradjuri
i feel i've taken a lot from this 'nexus' of activity without contributing very much at all, so with this in mind, i offer the following:
through my own experience, i consider 'ayahuasca' analogues to of inestimably greaty value for spiritual focus than smoked tryptamines. Smoking is a safer method for experimental activities, and should be given preference for acid-base 'research' in unknown plants. (i put 'research' in '' because the majority of what people are looking into here has already been professionally documented by academics whose work is not publically available - if you don't believe me ask nen about the extent of biochemical and chemotaxonomical research which is not publically available)
One important point is that the recipe that follows utilises only dried, young phyllodes. You're looking for the little ones.
Ingredients:
> 20gs of acacia obtusifolia phyllode (20g is regarded as a threshold dose)
> Half lime
> whites of 2 eggs
> 4g of Syrian Rue (or as much as is known to produce full inhibition of MAO)
Method:
1) boil phyllodes for around 45 minutes with 1/2 a lime, evenly distributed, between 3 boils. You need only a bit, but please keep in mind, boiling phyllodes in a mildy acidic solution chemically decomposes cyanogenic glycosides, which are potentially harmful. Do not skip acidification.
2) seperate yolk from white, and gently fold egg whites through solution.
3) prepare Syrian rue using methods described elsewhere
4) Drink acacia brew around 30 minutes after consumption of syrian rue
This method is an entry point to working with acacia obtusifolia. The above described process will result in a brew that will hurt you. You will vomit, hard. There is no other way with this plant. Never, ever use acacia obtusifolia bark to brew an ayahuasca analog. If you want to experiment yourself, go for it, it won't kill you, but you will not keep it down, and the pooing and spewing that will result will really hurt. Don't take my word for it, ask people who know. Do not brew bark.
PEace and good vibes,
Seldom
through my own experience, i consider 'ayahuasca' analogues to of inestimably greaty value for spiritual focus than smoked tryptamines. Smoking is a safer method for experimental activities, and should be given preference for acid-base 'research' in unknown plants. (i put 'research' in '' because the majority of what people are looking into here has already been professionally documented by academics whose work is not publically available - if you don't believe me ask nen about the extent of biochemical and chemotaxonomical research which is not publically available)
One important point is that the recipe that follows utilises only dried, young phyllodes. You're looking for the little ones.
Ingredients:
> 20gs of acacia obtusifolia phyllode (20g is regarded as a threshold dose)
> Half lime
> whites of 2 eggs
> 4g of Syrian Rue (or as much as is known to produce full inhibition of MAO)
Method:
1) boil phyllodes for around 45 minutes with 1/2 a lime, evenly distributed, between 3 boils. You need only a bit, but please keep in mind, boiling phyllodes in a mildy acidic solution chemically decomposes cyanogenic glycosides, which are potentially harmful. Do not skip acidification.
2) seperate yolk from white, and gently fold egg whites through solution.
3) prepare Syrian rue using methods described elsewhere
4) Drink acacia brew around 30 minutes after consumption of syrian rue
This method is an entry point to working with acacia obtusifolia. The above described process will result in a brew that will hurt you. You will vomit, hard. There is no other way with this plant. Never, ever use acacia obtusifolia bark to brew an ayahuasca analog. If you want to experiment yourself, go for it, it won't kill you, but you will not keep it down, and the pooing and spewing that will result will really hurt. Don't take my word for it, ask people who know. Do not brew bark.
PEace and good vibes,
Seldom
^..thanks Seldom..the thing about A. obtusifolia is there are, in my study of it, around four sub-types [see p.48 here]..the 'type' form will be ok..other forms are more closely related to A. longifolia and, with additional alkaloids, are not entry-level plants..they can be very heavy..other. forms are lower alkaloid..
in the end one really has to know their tree with this one..
also, in the wild this species is the most abused, so please..it only takes a couple of years to grow those phyllodes in cultivation (if you're loving the plant up with nitrogen and water..and love)
for general exploration of this kind i would probably recommend the narrow-phyllode form of A. acuminata, as it is pretty much 99% dmt (in terms of alkaloids at least)
[see the Acacia Analyis Thread]
as for unpublished academic research, you're absolutely correct Seldom..as mentioned a while back (and also mentioned by the Acacia Study Group of the Society for Growing Australian Plants) there exists an un-published paper showing the presence of DMT in 151 species of acacia...i have verified this..but cannot name the source..
..for much of the past year i've been sitting back waiting to see what 'researchers' will bring to the thread..by a year ago this was the largest list of confirmed active species publicly available..enough to get the seeker started..but certainly there are more than listed here to date..
the other thing i've been pondering, and will gradually be getting more public about, is spiritual approaches to these plants..
this is subjective, and i don't advocate any single belief system, however in my opinion and experience, to go further than intermittent experimentation with these plant teachers, to really integrate them into one's life requires some kind of focus and discipline..
yes, dmt is now almost a mainstream concept, but the consumption of acacia phyllodes with their host of other compounds is not, and, like many of the entheogenic plants used in south america other than ayahuasca, may never be..
i think Acacia confusa has started to give people an idea now of the extra scope of experience these trees can produce..beyond simply what McKenna or Strassman were describing..
the cultural and spiritual history of the Acacia, as mentioned in the thread, and which is part of my ongoing research, shows that these plants have been revered and respected in a way that few plants are..
this is more than dmt..
i wish all appreciators of the acacia a fruitful and insightful new year..
in the end one really has to know their tree with this one..
also, in the wild this species is the most abused, so please..it only takes a couple of years to grow those phyllodes in cultivation (if you're loving the plant up with nitrogen and water..and love)
for general exploration of this kind i would probably recommend the narrow-phyllode form of A. acuminata, as it is pretty much 99% dmt (in terms of alkaloids at least)
[see the Acacia Analyis Thread]
as for unpublished academic research, you're absolutely correct Seldom..as mentioned a while back (and also mentioned by the Acacia Study Group of the Society for Growing Australian Plants) there exists an un-published paper showing the presence of DMT in 151 species of acacia...i have verified this..but cannot name the source..
..for much of the past year i've been sitting back waiting to see what 'researchers' will bring to the thread..by a year ago this was the largest list of confirmed active species publicly available..enough to get the seeker started..but certainly there are more than listed here to date..
the other thing i've been pondering, and will gradually be getting more public about, is spiritual approaches to these plants..
this is subjective, and i don't advocate any single belief system, however in my opinion and experience, to go further than intermittent experimentation with these plant teachers, to really integrate them into one's life requires some kind of focus and discipline..
yes, dmt is now almost a mainstream concept, but the consumption of acacia phyllodes with their host of other compounds is not, and, like many of the entheogenic plants used in south america other than ayahuasca, may never be..
i think Acacia confusa has started to give people an idea now of the extra scope of experience these trees can produce..beyond simply what McKenna or Strassman were describing..
the cultural and spiritual history of the Acacia, as mentioned in the thread, and which is part of my ongoing research, shows that these plants have been revered and respected in a way that few plants are..
this is more than dmt..
i wish all appreciators of the acacia a fruitful and insightful new year..
hi Shroomite and thanks..Acacia flavescens was briefly mentioned on p.19 [see photo in post #374]..but i've never been able to find any kind of reference, verification or info on the wikipedia 'strongly psychoactive' claim..Shroomite said:
it contains the flavonoid Melanoxetin [Clark-Lewis & Dainis, Aus. Journal of Chemistry 1967] which is also found in Acacia confusa and has been shown to have strong anti-inflammatory action [Jyh-Horng Wu et al. "Effect of Phytocompounds from the Heartwood of Acacia confusa on Inflammatory Mediator Production" J. Agric. Food Chem. 2008]..i can find no other published chemistry studies of A. flavescens..so the psychoactive claim remains unknown ..
TheTherapist!
Rising Star
Hi I'm trying to ID this Accacia from my back garden. I'm hoping someone will pick it straight away. I'm in the North West of WA. :?
Thanks guys...
Thanks guys...
as has been said before no i.d requests in this thread.. there is a separate thread for that and this is for information only..the thread gets too cluttered otherwise.. your tree by the way looks like acacia glaucoptera but seems too large
TheTherapist!
Rising Star
Thanks Accacian and sorry about posting in the wrong thread.
Have reposted in correct area...
Cheers!
Have reposted in correct area...
Cheers!
Hey fellow Acacian's!
We'll, I'm on holidays in Kuala Lumpur at the moment, and have already spotted acacias in the street I am staying.
1) Acacia auriculiformis
I've only just hooked up for internet today, (and up to pg 50 of this thread so far - what a journey!)
I'll post the pics I've taken of them when I get back in Sydney at eom
I wanted to extend my gratitude to the likes of nen, acacain/brickie, phyllode, etc - you guys have really inspired me to get into the field of research of acacias. Would love to contribute to the scientific community for our understanding of the world we live in.
My acuminata and oxycedrus seeds arrived whilst I was away. Can't wait to get back home
Thanks everyone again
--Shadow
We'll, I'm on holidays in Kuala Lumpur at the moment, and have already spotted acacias in the street I am staying.
1) Acacia auriculiformis
I've only just hooked up for internet today, (and up to pg 50 of this thread so far - what a journey!)
I'll post the pics I've taken of them when I get back in Sydney at eom
I wanted to extend my gratitude to the likes of nen, acacain/brickie, phyllode, etc - you guys have really inspired me to get into the field of research of acacias. Would love to contribute to the scientific community for our understanding of the world we live in.
My acuminata and oxycedrus seeds arrived whilst I was away. Can't wait to get back home
Thanks everyone again
--Shadow
thanks shadow this thread has been an important catalyst for my plant inspired journey over the past few years- i'm heaps grateful to all involved, especially its humble creator, nen..
sounds like you've come across some interesting specimens over look forward to the photos!
and good luck with the seeds too I hope they grow well.. i've just been up in nsw since christmas and was saddened to come home to 12 of my 16 seedlings dead.. there was a pretty hectic heat wave down here for a couple days and they didnt cope well without close human care... fortunately my largest and healthiest longissima survived, but unfortunately both my acuminatas, all 7 of my caroleae and most of the other longissimas didn't survive the weather. acacias need a lot of care when they are young.. mine were in beautiful condition before i went upstate and they died in the two week span I was gone.. when you get seeds going germinate lots of them as a lot of them will likely die before maturing enough to survive variable weather
happy new years to all by the way
this thread has been an important catalyst for my plant inspired journey over the past few years- i'm heaps grateful to all involved, especially its humble creator, nen.. sounds like you've come across some interesting specimens over look forward to the photos!
and good luck with the seeds too I hope they grow well.. i've just been up in nsw since christmas and was saddened to come home to 12 of my 16 seedlings dead.. there was a pretty hectic heat wave down here for a couple days and they didnt cope well without close human care... fortunately my largest and healthiest longissima survived, but unfortunately both my acuminatas, all 7 of my caroleae and most of the other longissimas didn't survive the weather. acacias need a lot of care when they are young.. mine were in beautiful condition before i went upstate and they died in the two week span I was gone.. when you get seeds going germinate lots of them as a lot of them will likely die before maturing enough to survive variable weather
happy new years to all by the way
Sorry to hear that acacain.
Yeah, I think by the time I get back to NSW at eom, it will be too late to plant straight into soil, will have to spend the first year under lights I think. Probably will also start up some Phalaris aquatica too, 3+ years is a long time
On a side note, I would love to experiment later down the track with cross breeding acimanata and oxycedrus. Is this something that would be generally endorsed, or is it recommended not to play with these things? I'm not concerned how hard it might be (I love a challenge), but I will refrain if people would have any moral objections with this. Anyone done this before?
I'm keen to start analysing the a leprosa "scarlet blaze" when I get back. Not just re-agent, but GCMS or TLC. They seem to be everywhere around where I live. In fact, this was I thought the most prominent wattle before I started my learning journey. From what I understand, the one and only mother tree die in VIC a few years ago, and all the ones around here were originally from cuttings or grafts from the mother?
I will first hand attest to the value that nen and u guys have brought by raising awareness and making the information available about the acacias. You have added an acacain warrior to your ranks here!
--Shadow
Yeah, I think by the time I get back to NSW at eom, it will be too late to plant straight into soil, will have to spend the first year under lights I think. Probably will also start up some Phalaris aquatica too, 3+ years is a long time
On a side note, I would love to experiment later down the track with cross breeding acimanata and oxycedrus. Is this something that would be generally endorsed, or is it recommended not to play with these things? I'm not concerned how hard it might be (I love a challenge), but I will refrain if people would have any moral objections with this. Anyone done this before?
I'm keen to start analysing the a leprosa "scarlet blaze" when I get back. Not just re-agent, but GCMS or TLC. They seem to be everywhere around where I live. In fact, this was I thought the most prominent wattle before I started my learning journey. From what I understand, the one and only mother tree die in VIC a few years ago, and all the ones around here were originally from cuttings or grafts from the mother?
I will first hand attest to the value that nen and u guys have brought by raising awareness and making the information available about the acacias. You have added an acacain warrior to your ranks here!
--Shadow
Actually, after looking at leprosa, it's not the classic "red wattle" I'm referring to. (Finding myself reviewing dumb posts as I learn more - sorry)
The wattle bush I'm thinking of has quite large rod shaped red flowers (approximately 3cm in diameter), and they seem to be everywhere I look on Nth'n beaches... Do you know the one I'm talking about?
The wattle bush I'm thinking of has quite large rod shaped red flowers (approximately 3cm in diameter), and they seem to be everywhere I look on Nth'n beaches... Do you know the one I'm talking about?
DreaMTripper
Rising Star
Are you sure they arent bottlebrush or hakea,? Which look very similar to acacia.