Two SHE questions I'd like opinions on

[fourthripley]

I'm not venturing an opinion here on the validity of the experiment, I have an open mind and half intended to participate a little;had a spice and pennyroyal spliff prepared but circumstances prevented me, like a lot of folks it seems...
Question 1: assuming such things are possible, what is the wisdom of performing randomly constructed magickal rituals, focussing on glyphs etc. under the influence of powerful hallucinogens? From what I have read over the years, combining magick and druqs can be- for some- a shortcut to geting very messed up indeed, psychologically certainly but maybe- if one believes in these things- on other levels as well. What thinks people?
Question 2: re: 'meeting up in hyperspace'. If one accepts the 'shamanic hypotheses' that places reached in trance or whatever are genuine autonomous spaces, what of consciously journeying and manipulating these? Classical 'shamans'- not very keen on the word and its over and misusage really- train and acclimatse themselves over years to negotiate these spaces or realms; is it possible to take a bunch of druqs and 'wish' yourself to a possible spot? Dunno, seems a little like getting into a car with no lessons or knowledge and wishing yourself to a destination while simply firing up the engine? Or am I being difficult?
Hope I don't come across as horrid and confrontational, just think these 2 points might be interesting to have debated

 

[acolon_5]

I'm not venturing an opinion here on the validity of the experiment, I have an open mind and half intended to participate a little;had a spice and pennyroyal spliff prepared but circumstances prevented me, like a lot of folks it seems...
Question 1: assuming such things are possible, what is the wisdom of performing randomly constructed magickal rituals, focussing on glyphs etc. under the influence of powerful hallucinogens? From what I have read over the years, combining magick and druqs can be- for some- a shortcut to geting very messed up indeed, psychologically certainly but maybe- if one believes in these things- on other levels as well. What thinks people?
Question 2: re: 'meeting up in hyperspace'. If one accepts the 'shamanic hypotheses' that places reached in trance or whatever are genuine autonomous spaces, what of consciously journeying and manipulating these? Classical 'shamans'- not very keen on the word and its over and misusage really- train and acclimatse themselves over years to negotiate these spaces or realms; is it possible to take a bunch of druqs and 'wish' yourself to a possible spot? Dunno, seems a little like getting into a car with no lessons or knowledge and wishing yourself to a destination while simply firing up the engine? Or am I being difficult?
Hope I don't come across as horrid and confrontational, just think these 2 points might be interesting to have debated

You bring up some good points.

I agree with you that the word "shaman" is misused quite a bit. It refers to a medicine man from Siberia, not currandero's from South Ameria, or Ayahuscerro's that heal with ayahuasca and other plants.

1) If S.H.E. was geared toward magickal exercises I believe that it could be a bad combo indeed. My understanding is that SHE is not concerned about magick at all.

It is more like researching and documenting the unknown. Much more like a scientist than a "shaman"

2) consciously journeying in these spaces is what we do every time we smoke spice....doing it together to see what happens is not, imo is not that much more dangerous. How many ayahausca ceremonies do you think happens in a day? Hundreds of participants? Thousands a day?

I think you are being a little difficult. I honor you opinion though, and if you feel it is too much of a risk to your well being, please do not feel any pressure to participate.

Many people take up the path of ayahuasca without proper training and turn out quite fine. I'm not saying this is the right or wrong way to approach this, it is a very personal choice, I'm just saying that the dangers you seem concerned about, I believe would have manifested themselves somewhere before.

 

[fourthripley]

Acolon_5, nope I don't have any concerns at all really, and I'm quite comfy to play... Just playing devils advocate really

 

[acolon_5]

Acolon_5, nope I don't have any concerns at all really, and I'm quite comfy to play... Just playing devils advocate really

Gotcha

Yeah, I think we are pretty safe, but we really know so little about DMT where it takes us, what happens to us while we are there, etc...

I'd like to hear others opinions on this as well.

 

[tryptographer]

is it possible to take a bunch of druqs and 'wish' yourself to a possible spot? Dunno, seems a little like getting into a car with no lessons or knowledge and wishing yourself to a destination while simply firing up the engine? Or am I being difficult?
Hope I don't come across as horrid and confrontational, just think these 2 points might be interesting to have debated

Yeah, you certainly have a point here. You get SO much more out of it if you do it with total dedication and trust, and have the patience to work at it for years.

Maybe, if the intention is to exchange real information, out-of-body training without drugs is more promising. (see "My Big Toe" by Tom Campbell, there's a fascinating interview with him on Youtube)

 

[Frogbutt]

is it possible to take a bunch of druqs and 'wish' yourself to a possible spot? Dunno, seems a little like getting into a car with no lessons or knowledge and wishing yourself to a destination while simply firing up the engine? Or am I being difficult?
Hope I don't come across as horrid and confrontational, just think these 2 points might be interesting to have debated

Yeah, you certainly have a point here. You get SO much more out of it if you do it with total dedication and trust, and have the patience to work at it for years.

Maybe, if the intention is to exchange real information, out-of-body training without drugs is more promising. (see "My Big Toe" by Tom Campbell, there's a fascinating interview with him on Youtube)

I don't know anything about magic but I feel that thats really just a word for knowledge and the use of that knowledge alot like science. So call it magic or scince or insanity its all relative. Anything can be dangerous if done with the wrong intention but that is the beauty of the SHE event. There are thousands of people drinking Aya, shrooming, lsd'ing... at the same moment all the time but how many of those are trips based on fear or just to get fucked up or escape or watch a movie or play video games or or or? How many people get lost in their trips? never learn anything from that first dip into their own mind or get so scared they never do it again? "Most" Ayas trips I have read/heard about were people trying to over come a problem or something hence the term medicine they needed healing. Its why I took it in the first place no shame in that but "I" have move on. So yea drugs may be a short cut and a scary one at times but not all short cuts are bad just quicker. With the SHE event we have people from all over they net taking a drug they have most likely made for themselves and smoking/drinking it at the same moment based on one similar intention of expanding our understanding and hopefully having a good time while doing it I'm sure we have all had our bad times and places and trips but it seems an observation that most that frequent these type of boards are the ones that learned something from those first trips and have not gotten lost or given into fear. I think your simile is perfect we are getting in or out "with no lessons or knowledge" but thats the point to gain that knowledge possibly create lessons for others. Anyways who knows if its a good idea a bad idea or the worlds worst idea ... its still an idea and maybe thats all it takes.