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A skeptic disappears down the rabbit hole.

Migrated topic.
upwaysidedown

upwaysidedown

Rising Star
Hi Nexus,

I have been lurking as a non member here for probably a few months now.

To share my wider story: I became a little depressed in the Summer of this year, I found I had been lacking direction or meaning for some time. Its easy to get lost in the day to day, and despite have a great job and family and fairly good health (basically nothing to complain about compared to 99% of the population) something was missing.

This is the rabbit hole I went down:

I am a scientist by education, and so I tend to be analytical about everything (this matches nicely with my Briggs Myers personality type).

The rational approach was to find myself again. I spent time looking into things that used to interest me as a child, oddly this was stuff I always wanted to know more about - old folklore, this is where most people I know would start to consider me a nutter as I started to realise that this old folklore stuff sounded really like modern alien abduction. So I sought out others who had made the same connection - which brought me to learning of neo-platonism and the works of Carl Jung.

This all gave me the spark I needed, reality had gained a number of potential new dimensions. I sought a way to explore this. DMT started cropping up in my research - the state of mind related to these Daimonic experiences, and to ancient religions all pointed to shamanism as a doorway.

This is obviously now much later in the story, and as many will probably know - I have no answers, but something deep inside which transcends the question, and sort of an instinctual guide which I am learning to listen to.

I am making space for my/the subconscious to talk to me - dreams are really important, I have probably had more direct sense from these - if there are answers, the ones I need right now are not outside of myself. Hinduism makes far more sense to me now, Buddhism also - but the direct route to enlightenment does not feel like my goal, there is far more beauty in this reality and nearby realities to experience and explore first.

I look forward to contributing back here, as I have gained so much from reading all of your posts - and felt reassured that I am in the right place, surrounded by such a bunch of well adjusted individuals. I can understand why though as I am going through such adjustment myself :)
 
Welcome Upwaysidedown!
Speaking from personal experience psychedelics gave me the answers to what I was looking for, though I never knew what it was, I feel now that I have found it and I wish you the same luck friend.
Have you tried DMT yet and if so what was it like for you?
:)
 
I was trying to not be so explicit in my post JD, but I would say I am not sure what I have found.

Some odd things have happened, such as returning from my first journey with what I thought were nonsense words (although spelled to me clearly letter for letter), and turned out to be translatable in Indonesian. I think these were given as a sign that there is more there than is just in me, rather than as specific messages and done with humour.

Although I do not speak or understand Indonesian consciously, I have heard it spoken but the phrase was an odd one - so take from this what you will.

My first and second journeys were 2 weeks apart. Both are adequately described by my first words at the time - the first was just "Wow", and the second was "Ah, I remember now!" I'm thinking a few may relate to that.

I think my mission at the moment is to get my bearings in navigating what seems to be a thoroughly abstract environment, and develop my attitude to it. Should I be anthropomorphising what I see/feel, should I be focusing on the feeling, or should I learn to move within this space or as friends have done (who take it less seriously) create things there. Or just stop thinking all together...

Then if I am going on a Journey with no real definite reason or objective, why am I doing it?

Maybe I already found it, but I'm still looking.

It seems this is all subjective journeys, but I realise that some guidance from the wise can help me focus my thoughts (even if I choose not to follow it).

BTW for a bit of background, as of last Summer the only drugs I had ever taken without medical reasons were alcohol and caffeine - so you can imagine how this is a big shift for me and one I need to get my head around.
 
Sorry Upwaysidedown, I think you will find that you are more than safe sharing here.:roll:

Some odd things have happened, such as returning from my first journey with what I thought were nonsense words (although spelled to me clearly letter for letter), and turned out to be translatable in Indonesian. I think these were given as a sign that there is more there than is just in me, rather than as specific messages and done with humour.
Click to expand...

What you take from your experience can only be real for you and you alone but I believe you. I have been thinking about something which I call 'foreign intelligence'. Since hyperspace can question everything you have previously thought unquestionable, I needed to define what was real and what wasn't, I myself 'cogito, ergo sum', yet I needed a basis for everyone else. So I thought of foreign intelligence e.g. I myself have no idea how a clock really works, you could show me how to build a clock and everything will work in a logical intelligent way. The same applies to hyperspace that you can take from it something that is so far removed from your psyche that there is, whatever that may be, something intelligent out there, vague though as that is.

Should I be anthropomorphising what I see/feel, should I be focusing on the feeling, or should I learn to move within this space or as friends have done (who take it less seriously) create things there. Or just stop thinking all together...

Then if I am going on a Journey with no real definite reason or objective, why am I doing it?

Maybe I already found it, but I'm still looking.
Click to expand...

I am by no means an expert but one thing that I read here again and again is respect the spice. For me it is not, and should not be a thing for recreational purposes, ever. By the sound of things you feel that way too.
You're right maybe you found it, maybe you do not want to acknowledge what it is?
In any case, I believe your journey is far from over, buddhists believe that enlightenment is only for the Buddha, therefore it is an unattainable goal yet it is still a thing worth seeking.

Hehe, I assumed that you were a little new to drugs, you have a good rational mind and I wish you all the best on your journey friend.
:)
 
Welcome. You seem to have a level head and a genuine, searching nature. This is a good place from which to begin. My advice would be to try and suspend as much expectation as possible, and give up on the idea of navigating. The further you go, the weirder it gets, and the deeper the need for surrender.

For me at least the experience seems to have an agenda all its own. Other than staying open to whatever transpires, I find that my objectives are generally pointless and can only interfere.

In my experience, psychedelics really don't supply me with any answers. They're much more effective at raising questions and opening me up to previously unconsidered perspectives. Then the work becomes what do I do with that back here on terra firma - and that work can be done over a lifetime.
 
Uncle Knucles said:
In my experience, psychedelics really don't supply me with any answers. They're much more effective at raising questions and opening me up to previously unconsidered perspectives. Then the work becomes what do I do with that back here on terra firma - and that work can be done over a lifetime.
Click to expand...


Scientist here. Agreed on the more questions than answers point. And yeah, it only gets weirder. That said, real scientists should be more than a little intrigued by these topics and reject prohibition for authoritarian reasons.

Welcome!
 
Thank you all for the encouragement and great welcome!

I hope I can contribute as much as I can gain advice. I do have a few things to add on consumption - particularly for non-smokers. I splashed out recently on a desktop vaporiser, and I have not looked back - no smell or taste of burnt plastic, clear lungs afterwards and more efficient. And far less messing about on the way in.

I definitely respect the spice, but it calls me - and is this addiction or a mission? A great afterglow for about 7 days after a journey, where I find desire (in the Buddhist sense) is reduced and a feeling of great mindfulness and contentment sits with me. After 7 days it starts to leave me and after 2 weeks the call to return is strong.

There are lessons and development in the interval, although they do not always seem directly related. Could I be doing this without it? Sometimes they are direct though so I must cling on to those, I got called "Sausage Breath" by an morphing floating entity that gently lowered me out of the journey (whilst turning into a custard cream biscuit) - and this has been re-inforced by other things afterwards about reducing my meat consumption.

Gah! It just leaves you realising you really don't know what you thought you knew, and you don't even know if you knew or if you know that you don't know, or even if its just that you don't know that you do know. But perhaps that is the point, there is no Truth: In every truth there is a lie, and in every lie there is a truth.

I always tried to get myself to question everything, and now I find it hard to not question every thought I have. I congratulate all of you who live in this space, its definitely not the easy path - I can see the comfort in blindly (and IMHO stupidly) following a faith and sticking to a "Truth", but you may as well be dead.

JD - I think you are right, the journey is never over. How much needs spice to continue it I don't know, I should continue that I think until I feel no progress.

Art - yes, I'm trying to remove any expectations, I've gained more value by not even having an agenda other that "just show me what I need to know", although I struggle with not imagining this is somehow recreational. It feels though that I am being trained, taught to remember and understand hyperspace - but down this route perhaps leads the paranoid delusions (of grandeur as well as the more common sense of the term). Top yogic principle: accept no gifts. I will listen though to what they show.

waitwhatwhere - Science has no place in the subjective, it can't because scientific method is inherently objective. Modern society worships the science that gives us all this technology, and gets confused that the objective is all there is. Science is just the most powerful magic we have.
 
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