Acacia confusa & Formosahuasca

[mindbody]

Thank you very much for posting here, exactlydivyn! I doubt there are many people who have as much experience as you with this plant!

On my part, I would recommend being careful with doses. In my experience, 1 tablespoon of ground root bark in combination with the rue can produce overwhelming journeys (and I am generally not easily scared when it comes to psychedelics). Relying on the vomiting reflex may not always work.

More news:

Acacia confusa in Xiamen: I haven't got a chance to return to Taiwan since April, but I am currently in Xiamen, a lovely and well-developed Chinese city right across the straight from Taiwan. Not surprisingly, Acacia confusa trees are seen here in abundance, including a park in the southern part of Xiamen, which is basically a group of hills overgrown with A. confusa forest, with the ground littered by millions of A. confusa seeds. There is also a large population on the historical car-free Gulang island. The trees look quite spectacular from a distance, as the spiky foliage gives them a robe of emerald fur.

Seed give-away: In Xiamen, I've collected a rather large number of seeds, and I am willing to give them away to a few interested people (say, 10 seeds per person). PM me if you are interested. (However, I cannot guarantee anything about germination rates, or even the identity of the tree, since I am not a professional botanist, though I am personally pretty confident that my identification is correct.)

Acacia vs. chaliponga: On another note, I've recently succeeded brewing chaliponga/rue based ayahuasca, and the experience was quite distinct from acacia: less visual, and much more warm/euphoric/friendly. The dose of chaliponga was small (around 5g), and I intend to experiment further, but my impression for the moment is that the sense of anxiety that often accompanies my acacia journeys must have some origin in the chemical make-up of the plant material. Still, acacia is very powerful and I believe it should be studied further with due care...

 

[exactlydivyn]

Thank you for having me here. this is a Beatiful Website. Great respect for all the knowledge of the people that post here.
I've had a lot of experience with this specific plant, but don't know much about chemical coumpound. I learned from this thread that there is another chemical in acacia...was it MNT or something? Is this what causes the hell parts of the trips?
Does anybody know what the effects of this other chemical are?
Really happy you guys are getting interested in this.
Need more experience with dosage. I don't have an optimal dosage yet.
I'm working with bark, not rootbark, and its as powerful as I dare make it now. I'll get rootbark next, try it, and see if i can help get an ideal recipe. Thanks for the advice, Mindbody.
When you described it as a robe of emerald fur, it sounds like you nailed the hammer on its head. Wonderful way of describing her. The leaves are thin, the size of our pinkie, the veins go from bottom to top, like feather trees.
z

 

[mindbody]

I learned from this thread that there is another chemical in acacia...was it NMT or something? Is this what causes the hell parts of the trips?

Wikipedia only says that NMT is not orally active by itself (not surprising, since neither is DMT), and its action in combination with MAOI is unknown:

N-Methyltryptamine - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

When you described it as a robe of emerald fur

That came to me very naturally in Xiamen. Some of the trees in a park looked much "fluffier" than all the others, from a distance. I thought they could be A. confusa, because of the elongated foliage, and that's what they've turned out to be upon closer examination!

 

[exactlydivyn]

Ya...
Dealing with unknown substances can be fun or dangerous. Perhaps the NMT is causing the negative parts of the trip??
I have had better experiences with the live bark, what I have taken directly from live trees from the base of the tree, on the upper roots.
Experiences were softer, less negativity, more life, less death.
So many times, I have felt that my aya teachings were conflicting. during the same trip, I will experience first death, then life, or the other way around. Some of the messages were extremely negative (like mother earth was doomed if I didn't do something right now, and then the would be very positive, like, mother has everthing under control, I don't need to do anything, just relax and trust.
It seems like its showing me two sides of the same coin, how it is this reality and the opposite reality at the same time.
I've learned to ignore the negative, and remember the positive. It would be nice to just get the positive though. But perhaps this is just the nature of the tree~
Z
Congrats on finding her!

 

[polytrip]

Ya...
Dealing with unknown substances can be fun or dangerous. Perhaps the NMT is causing the negative parts of the trip??
I have had better experiences with the live bark, what I have taken directly from live trees from the base of the tree, on the upper roots.
Experiences were softer, less negativity, more life, less death.
So many times, I have felt that my aya teachings were conflicting. during the same trip, I will experience first death, then life, or the other way around. Some of the messages were extremely negative (like mother earth was doomed if I didn't do something right now, and then the would be very positive, like, mother has everthing under control, I don't need to do anything, just relax and trust.
It seems like its showing me two sides of the same coin, how it is this reality and the opposite reality at the same time.
I've learned to ignore the negative, and remember the positive. It would be nice to just get the positive though. But perhaps this is just the nature of the tree~
Z
Congrats on finding her!

Beaocystin and norbeaocystine are the NMT analogues of psilocin and psilocybin. Mushrooms that are high in these two compounds often feel a bit more toxic, heavier and foggier, so NMT could indeed be responsible for the negative parts of it.

 

[mindbody]

Beaocystin and norbeaocystine are the NMT analogues of psilocin and psilocybin. Mushrooms that are high in these two compounds often feel a bit more toxic, heavier and foggier, so NMT could indeed be responsible for the negative parts of it.

Thanks for bringing up this interesting point, polytrip!

"Foggy" would not be my word to describe the acacia effect: it's very sharp, but harsh and uncontrollable. And yes, it does feel somewhat toxic, though there don't seem to be any negative after-effects after the trip is over.

An unrelated note on mushrooms: I've had a very difficult experience with P. cubensis a few days ago (which has never happened before), and it felt a lot like my difficult acacia trips. So perhaps there is a psychological aspect to it (at this point in my life, I have to be worried about some people who are close, and "letting go" has become more difficult in a psychedelic experience...).

 

[exactlydivyn]

I've never had the sharp out of control experience before, although I have led a few people through experiences such as these. They seem to be before experiencing "death" and rebirth. Like all the insanity and shit is getting squeezed out of you before you are sucked down into a singularity, disappear for a second, and come out the other side new. Letting Go definitely seemed what was required. I had one guy that had to go there from his first trip, but couldn't let go. He took it many times, and it kept getting worse and worse.
My negative experiences actually feel like polytrip describing the mushrooms, and come to think of it, the mushrooms in Taiwan have a similiar feel to them. My first negative experience of this kind was after doing these mushrooms the same day....
But it only happens with some people, or some of the time. Sometimes it is all positive.
One of the last times it sent me into this kind of energy, confusing, doubtful, toxic, I got angry, drank a bunch more, lay down on the bathroom floor and gave up. It was one of the best trips I ever had. sent me into my immortal Self, or brought my immortal self into me for about 6 hours.
I agree with Mindbody as well, there seems to be no negative after affects, besides a little disorientation for a few days after until you get grounded again and rebuild your ego.
Thanks for the info on shrooms and NMT. Very good to know.
Z

 

[mindbody]

Sprouting Acacia confusa:

I've attempted germinating A. confusa seeds many times with no success: the few that began sprouting were quickly killed by a fungus.

However, my luck changed for the better a few days ago: this time, all the seeds I've treated produced vigorous sprouts literally within a couple of days, and now I am in proud possession of 5 lively A. confusa seedlings. As usual, the seeds were soaked in hot-but-not-boiling water (to imitate a forest fire), and carefully scratched to let water penetrate inside. The seeds swelled and germinated very quickly as I said.

Note the presence of true leaves on the seedlings. These should disappear as the plant grows and become replaced by lancet-like enlarged leaf stalks (phyllodes).

As advertised previously, I am willing to share my seeds with interested individuals.

 

[rawmo]

hey there,

apologies if it has already been done but i haven't found it...

Has anyone got any figures on A. Confusa re DMT % for the following

a] Root bark
b] stem bark
c] stem bak premium

I found an asian stockist, but was hoping for some advice re % and what was best options to follow?

Cheers

 

[rawmo]

found this, but was also hoping for some extra advice (also qualitatively)


Acacia Confusa
rootbark 1.275%
stems 0.5% (mixed NMT)


NMT
root bark 1.575%

 

[trancenut]

Finding this acacia confusa post extremely enlightening. deeply appreciate the findings posted by everyone. have ordered some seeds with the view to growing/cultivating some beautiful life forms.

Has anyone carried out some relative mhrb extractions on this 'ac' ?

e.g. a/b, or just base, anologue extraxctions etc. sim ilar to those with mhrb.

would the n methyl tryptamine come out with the n,n, dimethyl tryptamine ?

would other 'stuff' - desireable or undesirable - come out with an extraction ?

is it possible to separate the 'undesirable' stuff from the dmt?

is there a conversion process available to convert 'other stuff' to 'desirable stuff' ?
e.g n methyl tryptamine to dmt ? (would something like methyline chloride work?)

Of course, this is purely theoretical for education purposes.

cheers, trancenut.

 

[polytrip]

I have just ordered some (50 grams) of shredded acacia confusa rootbark. I intend to try this formosahuasca stuff and i'm not gonna use it for extracting pure DMT.

I wonder what method of using it, people who've got experience with it would reccomend. (quantity's, boiling times, etc.)

Use of it is spreading so maybe there are some new insights on how bets to use the stuff?

 

[Tropical]

if you dont want pure anything a very easy acetone xtract works ok for jungle. not the best route, but very fast and easy.

 

[polytrip]

I have noticed a few differences between acacia confusa, mimosa and chacruna. I´d say that´s a positive thing, since it brings some more variety in the way you can experience ayahuasca.

Acacia confusa/formosahuasca comes, of all the admixture plants i know, the closest to vaporised DMT.
I don´t know why this is, but it seems to have a more untamed, wild nature. It´s not unpleasant or uncomfortable at all but, like vaporised DMT, it has a bit of a raging character. It´s sharper than mimosa or chacruna..... more edgy.

I cannot say for sure whether it also gives different types of visuals. Visuals are always a bit different in each individual ayahuasca experience anyway: sometimes they´re a bit more digital and sometimes they´re more organic, etc.
But from my limited experience with acacia confusa, i get the impression that formosahuasca visuals tend to be a bit brighter...a bit more tones of white light and a little less 'rainbowy'.

Besides that, i´ve also noticed a tingling sensation on the facial skin. Mimosa also does that for me sometimes, but i can´t recall ever to have had it with chacruna.

The differences are subtle. I don´t know whether they´re caused by the 'placebo-effect', having read about experiences with it beforehand.

But i´m quite positive about this plant. Not only can it replace mimosa or chacruna for people who don´t have acces to them, but (if it´s not a placebo-thing of me) it´s also very well worth a try for people experienced with mimosa and chacruna who would like to try something 'new'.

 

[jamie]

how much is needed for a dose?

 

[polytrip]

some aspects of the acacia-induced trance are quite overwhelming, even in smaller doses: there was a feeling of being controlled, or connected to something larger than "myself", a sense of myriads of tentacles probing my shoulders, etc. Bright hyper-kinetic "high-tech" colorful geometric visions

That comes very close to what i´ve experienced with it as well.

 

[polytrip]

how much is needed for a dose?

About three tablespoons/a handfull of shredded bark. (with caapi, that is)

 

[jamie]

wow..so alot more than mimosa..which makes confusa also alot more $$..but useful if you cant get other admixtures.

 

[polytrip]

wow..so alot more than mimosa..which makes confusa also alot more $$..but useful if you cant get other admixtures.

I always dose a bit high...also with mimosa. I´d say: the same amount as you´d normally take when you make a mimosa brew.

 

[jamie]

wait..polytrip do you have stembark or rootbark? I want to know becasue I wanted to grow some confusa but was unsure as to if it wsas worth it or not.