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Basic Chemistry

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acolon_5

acolon_5

The Great Namah
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There have been quite a few questions about basic chemistry.

For instance what is a salt, acid, or base are. Same goes for terms like pH, pKa, weak acids, weak bases, conjugate acid/bases, titration, polar and non polar solvent, oxidation, reduction etc. etc.

We have some very knowledgeable folks here that are willing to help answer your, your friends, your friends pets, and my questions on the subject.

Please keep this thread on basic chemistry. Synthesis discussions are not allowed!! Any posts relating to or hinting at synthesis, precursors or the like will be edited and the poster will be given a warning.
 
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my storage tank holds 20 lbs, i'll use a transfer tank that will hold about 5. my collection vessel is 3" O.D. x 12" , 0.065" wall thickness, with a 140 psi blow-off valve. all swagelok 1/4" fittings rated for 3000 psi , and needle valves rated for 6000 psi.
i'll only be operating at around 1500. I'll use a bath scale to weigh the cylinders.

co2 is relatively cheap, so i don't particularly care if i have to make trips to the welding supply shop.

the tricky part is going to be my implementation to the system, using an LC pump to inject ethanol. this isn't mentioned in any of the SFE blogs. i'm using a 1/16" O.D. to 1/4" NPT adapter, connected to a 1 psi check valve in 1/4" NPT cross.

I come from a background, academically and professionally, of method development (this is pure science). I'll also implement this in my hobbies.
 
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benzyme said:
my storage tank holds 20 lbs, i'll use a transfer tank that will hold about 5. my collection vessel is 3" O.D. x 12" , 0.065" wall thickness, with a 140 psi blow-off valve. all swagelok 1/4" fittings rated for 3000 psi , and needle valves rated for 6000 psi.
i'll only be operating at around 1500. I'll use a bath scale to weigh the cylinders.

co2 is relatively cheap, so i don't particularly care if i have to make trips to the welding supply shop.

the tricky part is going to be my implementation to the system, using an LC pump to inject ethanol. this isn't mentioned in any of the SFE blogs. i'm using a 1/16" O.D. to 1/4" NPT adapter, connected to a 1 psi check valve in 1/4" NPT cross.

I come from a background, academically and professionally, of method development (this is pure science). I'll also implement this in my hobbies.
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In my mind, using a transfer tank further reduces efficiency. Your supply pressure is limited to around 2800-3000psi, by adding an extra 5 lb tank into the line you're giving the gas more room to expand thus wasting more CO2 as overhead. Quick calculation leaves about 8.5 lb in the combined tanks at critical pressure, at which point that gas is useless for SFE. I know I'm probably being overly picky, but I'm looking at this from an engineering standpoint (which means efficiency is king).

Ethanol injection will be tricky. As I imagine your setup, if using a check valve rather than a machined mixer, the ethanol will have to be injected at a higher pressure the the CO2. This is well within the realm of many hplc pumps, but you haven't specified the pump so I just figured I'd mention that (though you probably thought of that already). A control valve on the CO2 inlet side of that union may also be useful for ensuring thorough mixture by partially disrupting the flow of CO2. It's probably best to mount the mixture union such that the ethanol inlet is slightly higher than the CO2 line (if not completely vertical, depends on the style of check valve).

Also, I see you haven't mentioned an extraction vessel as yet. Do you have one in mind? Or still searching? I can think of a fairly easy way to modify a small gas cylinder, although particular care must be taken with respect to the locking mechanism and associated seals. Otherwise one could manufacture one from appropriately sized stainless steel pipe (probably couldn't work a quick release into this, but the threaded seals could be more reliable, if a little tedious).
 
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perhaps you are being overly picky, unnecessary. overthinking it.
the transfer is done thermodynamically, to the separate tank, no pump, with the plant material. the final transfer is also done thermodynamically (heating pad with therm controller, monitored with either the 3000 or 5000 psi gauges), to a lower pressure/temp vessel (I did mention, a sanitary 304 stainless spool, 3" x 12", with tri-clamps and 1/4" NPT ports/fittings, viton gaskets), with a pressure release valve. the ethanol injection is done before the initial CO2 transfer.
the other thing you're not taking into consideration is the immense utility of subcritical CO2 extraction. it has properties altogether different than supercritical, as it is the fluid phase of carbon dioxide.

do all the calculations if you want, but it won't tell you anything without an actual experiment; otherwise it's just mental masturbation. I've certainly given this some thought, with a couple years of consideration and reading electronic textbooks. just recently started purchasing everything.
 
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I am familiar with the principles governing supercritical fluid extraction, but you were unclear about the arrangement of your particular setup. To me it sounded like you were proposing the use of the 5lb cylinder for gas transfer, but I now understand you intend to use it as your extraction vessel with the fitted stainless pipe acting as a fraction separator. And if the ethanol is injected before the introduction of CO2 (ie at 0 psig) then it shouldn't be overly complicated at all.

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My understanding was that you were attempting to build a homebrew version of something more akin to the above diagram (less the CO2 pump and cooling system, obviously). I think I now understand what you're putting together, which leads me to think you may be overthinking it. If I'm understanding your setup correctly, I could assemble something equally functional (albeit, slightly less elegant) with about $50 worth of brass fittings, a length of stainless pipe, and a few bits of old welding kit (gauges, reg, hoses and a small oxy tank), give me 2 hours in the workshop and a cylinder of CO2 and it should be ready to go. No calcs this time, cuz this is just a bit of bush engineering 😁
 
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ok, now we're on the same page.
the heating pad with a PID controller is the thermodynamic variable, the needle valves are the control variables, and a stainless PTFE-lined hose handles the transfer. swagelok full-flow quickconnects attach to both tanks.

this is the simple transfer setup i'm looking at now, but will have a handtight nut for the transfer tank (the smaller one) shortly.

what isn't shown is the cross assembly to introduce the entrainer solvent. i'll integrate this in after I figure out the handtight nut into the app, as this will allow for convenient transfer of the plant material into the smaller tank.
the pump being used will be a Harvard Apparatus syringe pump with a glass BD syringe, not a high pressure HPLC pump.
 
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JustCurious. said:
Anybody interested in making a basic chemistry guide with me :)

Would like to make a nice pdf with some pictures and reaction schemes if anyone is interested in contributing :)
Click to expand...

What did you have in mind? What I mean is, the basics are fairly well covered, what do you think needs to be added/improved upon?
 
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Simple enquiry here. various teks for Acacia list Ph at 3-5 or 4 for the acidification stage. My question is will going below this to say ph 3 affect the formation of dmt salts in this phase ?
thanks in advance
 
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Hey :)

I am about to try my hand at an ACRB extraction.

I'm buying a bunch of nice glassware second hand- it also comes with a Kartell Labware Autoclavable Pipette. I didn't have a glass pipette- it is something I need- and I wondered if it might work? I've read plastic isn't recommended for teks involving solvents, but I wondered if a chemists pipette would stand up to this?

"the robust structure of the body ensures high mechanical and chemical resistances, making them totally autoclavable at +121°C for 20 minutes"

Of course, I don't expect anyone here to be an expert in this... but if you are :thumb_up:

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If I can't use it then I'll just have to source another one... the rest of the glassware is still going to be awesome.
 
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That rubber thing you seek is called Pileus Ball, should not be too expensive to get! And you initial question was if these pipettes could be indeed used for an ACRB extraction?

And you say you will need a glass pipette - but at what step or for what actually? They are of course used where very precise dosage of liquids is crucial - I could only imagine this could be the case when applying concentrated hydrochloric acid to acidify the mixture - in any other cases you deliver very big volumes of any liquid, so I cant imagine what to do with them.

But in any case:

These pipettes are always used with disposable 1-way-use plastic attachments as their notch to pump up and deliver the liquids. And these are indeed not resistant against strong organic solvents like DMF or maybe THF? Not too sure, but at least they are totally resistant against any liquid that you would use in a regular TEK: (strongly) acidic water and hydrocarbons (Naphtha, Hexane, Heptane, ...). Therefore there is no restriction when doing regular root bark business and you could use both just right away.
The glass ware is of course not that accurate, but I think you would not even need any of these 2 for a regular TEK? Still I would go with the glassware, as it is a much sumpler mechanism and therefore more resistant to damage - unless you drop it - and also does not need constant supply of additional goods (that plastic tips of the mechanic pipettes) :thumb_up:
 
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If you want a pipette for pulling solvent from a rootbark extraction, I advise getting a volumetric pipette. They come in various sizes, grab a 25 or 50 ml, also the red rubber bulb for the end. Mine was around $20 with a couple bucks for the bulb, from Carolina Biological.
 
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I have an harmala extract by manske. I need to clean it of protein residues due to allergies.
I want to dissolve it in water and cook for 4 hours.
Is it worth adding citric acid, lemon juice or vinegar? How much vinegar can you drink safely?
The protein structure is quite stable, as the extract received 8 hours.
 
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monomind said:
A question if I may... :)
Both h2o and acetone are polar solvents, so why is freebase dmt soluble in one but not the other ?

Thanks
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because whereas water is completely polar (has a stronger dipole) and can only participate in hydrogen-bonding, acetone has an isopropyl backbone, which allows it to engage in VDW interactions, as well as hydrogen-bonding (with the oxygen).
 
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