Can you make Changa orally active?

[CaesarOfMex]

I have heard that if you take freebase dmt and you soak it citric acid (or anything else acid for that matter) that it becomes dmt citrate and therefore is a lot more orally active.

Well I was wondering if was possible to do the same thing with changa that is 50% dmt and 50% maoi... would it make sense if I soak about 300 mg of it in lime juice so I can have a genuine ayahuasca experience?

Sorry about the noob question... I tried finding this answer on the internet, but to no avail. Thanks for the input!

 

[concombres]

I have heard that if you take freebase dmt and you soak it citric acid (or anything else acid for that matter) that it becomes dmt citrate and therefore is a lot more orally active.

Well I was wondering if was possible to do the same thing with changa that is 50% dmt and 50% maoi... would it make sense if I soak about 300 mg of it in lime juice so I can have a genuine ayahuasca experience?

Sorry about the noob question... I tried finding this answer on the internet, but to no avail. Thanks for the input!

Not a great idea. Best to just smoke changa. The ratio of harmalas to DMT is not right for oral use. You`d need to eat nearly the whole gram for propper MAO inhibition which would also mean eating a ridiculous dose of DMT & probably lead to an experience that is far beyond anywhere you would ever want to go.

 

[CaesarOfMex]

Not a great idea. Best to just smoke changa. The ratio of harmalas to DMT is not right for oral use. You`d need to eat nearly the whole gram for propper MAO inhibition which would also mean eating a ridiculous dose of DMT & probably lead to an experience that is far beyond anywhere you would ever want to go.

Not even if it's 50% maoi? I've heard that a decent dose of oral dmt is about 150mg freebase, so it would end up being 150mg for dmt and 150mg for MAOI in a 300mg dose. I'm guessing you have to have higher MAOI concentration?



If changa won't do it, what would be a good alternative for maoi that never fails? I've tried finding moclobemide but can't since I live in the US. . . I'm just trying to find something that I'm 100% won't fail me. Thank you.

 

[concombres]

Not a great idea. Best to just smoke changa. The ratio of harmalas to DMT is not right for oral use. You`d need to eat nearly the whole gram for propper MAO inhibition which would also mean eating a ridiculous dose of DMT & probably lead to an experience that is far beyond anywhere you would ever want to go.

Not even if it's 50% maoi? I've heard that a decent dose of oral dmt is about 150mg freebase, so it would end up being 150mg for dmt and 150mg for MAOI in a 300mg dose. I'm guessing you have to have higher MAOI concentration?



If changa won't do it, what would be a good alternative for maoi that never fails? I've tried finding moclobemide but can't since I live in the US. . . I'm just trying to find something that I'm 100% won't fail me. Thank you.

1:1 dmt/harmalas seems a bit overkill for oral dosage to me. Changa may work orally but there will probably be some actives stuck in the plant matter if you extract with water & eating the plant matter may cause a sort of time release effect, slowly breaking down the plant matter & actives trapped in it.

You do understand that a 1:1 dmt/harmala blend is heavier than you are thinking right? For 150mg DMT & 150mg harmalas you also have to factor in the weight of the herbs the actives have been infused onto.
If the herbs weighed 1g before infusion, 1g of DMT is added & 1g of harmalas for a 1:1:1 ratio. Meaning the total weight is now 3g & the plant matter is composed of 1/3 inactive plant, 1/3 dmt & 1/3 harmalas. For a 300mg dose that is about 100mg of everything involved evenly.

Now, if you do not have experience with oral DMT or harmalas & know how your body & mind respond, 100mg DMT may be a whole lot with sufficient enzyme inhibition.

I would suggest you try working with vine or rue. Purified alkaloids are easier to work with IMO because they allow for much more accurate & precise control of dosage.
Once you get a feel for harmalas add in some DMT slowly until you find the level of effects you are looking for.

Ideally, with harmalas you want to find the threshold of effects & go a bit over that. Once your balance is effected & motion trails start, generally around 200mg of rue alks or 250-300mg for vine alks, you can be fairly confident your MAO enzymes at inhibited enough that DMT should be orally active.
For safety`s sake it is probably best not to start with 100mg DMT with oral harmalas. 50mg would probably be a better place but some have reported strong effects with 25-30mg DMT with full inhibition.

 

[CaesarOfMex]

Not a great idea. Best to just smoke changa. The ratio of harmalas to DMT is not right for oral use. You`d need to eat nearly the whole gram for propper MAO inhibition which would also mean eating a ridiculous dose of DMT & probably lead to an experience that is far beyond anywhere you would ever want to go.

Not even if it's 50% maoi? I've heard that a decent dose of oral dmt is about 150mg freebase, so it would end up being 150mg for dmt and 150mg for MAOI in a 300mg dose. I'm guessing you have to have higher MAOI concentration?



If changa won't do it, what would be a good alternative for maoi that never fails? I've tried finding moclobemide but can't since I live in the US. . . I'm just trying to find something that I'm 100% won't fail me. Thank you.

1:1 dmt/harmalas seems a bit overkill for oral dosage to me. Changa may work orally but there will probably be some actives stuck in the plant matter if you extract with water & eating the plant matter may cause a sort of time release effect, slowly breaking down the plant matter & actives trapped in it.

You do understand that a 1:1 dmt/harmala blend is heavier than you are thinking right? For 150mg DMT & 150mg harmalas you also have to factor in the weight of the herbs the actives have been infused onto.
If the herbs weighed 1g before infusion, 1g of DMT is added & 1g of harmalas for a 1:1:1 ratio. Meaning the total weight is now 3g & the plant matter is composed of 1/3 inactive plant, 1/3 dmt & 1/3 harmalas. For a 300mg dose that is about 100mg of everything involved evenly.

Now, if you do not have experience with oral DMT or harmalas & know how your body & mind respond, 100mg DMT may be a whole lot with sufficient enzyme inhibition.

I would suggest you try working with vine or rue. Purified alkaloids are easier to work with IMO because they allow for much more accurate & precise control of dosage.
Once you get a feel for harmalas add in some DMT slowly until you find the level of effects you are looking for.

Ideally, with harmalas you want to find the threshold of effects & go a bit over that. Once your balance is effected & motion trails start, generally around 200mg of rue alks or 250-300mg for vine alks, you can be fairly confident your MAO enzymes at inhibited enough that DMT should be orally active.
For safety`s sake it is probably best not to start with 100mg DMT with oral harmalas. 50mg would probably be a better place but some have reported strong effects with 25-30mg DMT with full inhibition.

You're absolutely right about working independently with harmaline/harmine/harmalas... it does bring extra security in what you're actually consuming.

Don't know if it makes any difference in the right DMT freebase starting dosage for me, but I've consumed pharma with 180mg of DMT fumarate, and it honestly was the best, most clean, teaching, and mind-blowing (positive) experience of my life, just a few months after a trip of the same magnitude that involved 150mg dmt fumarate.

Thankfully, I kept on doing my research after I posted this noob question, and I think I've found the answer! I discovered harmaline is 100% legal in the US, and there are great, legit sellers selling it in HCl and freebase form on eBay for dirt cheap!

I now just got to decide which form is best for me. . . I haven't found many experiences with harmaline HCl.. . because most of them have been "sublingual". . . but I'm guessing it's the way to go with pharmahuasca. . . the only thing I haven't ascertained is the actualy DOSAGE of Harmaline HCl for a good pharma trip... some people say 150mg. . . others 200mg. . . and others even 300mg. . . If I could recall the dosage and form (fb, HCl) that was used for my 2 pharma trips I would definitely go for the same format.

Once I get the dosage down, all I have to do is start experimenting with converting DMT freebase to DMT citrate!!! I can't believe I paid upwards of $75 USD for a pharma trip (which by no means was a waste of money, but I think I could've paid a little less). . . but the more you know!
I would certainly appreciate it if someone can link me to a good, informational website on this matter, and tell me a wise, educated starting dosage I should go with using dmt freebase, based on my previous experiences.

Thanks!

EDIT: concombres, I just re-read your reply and found the dosage for the extract I'm considering: 200mg for harmaline HCl from Syrian Rue seeds. Would you mind sharing an informational website to confirm this? Thanks.

 

[concombres]

With harmalas it is a preference thing once you get what dose works for you figured out.
Some like more harmalas & others like less of a harmala imprint on the experience.

I like a bit higher dosage of harmalas because you can use less DMT & the harmalas have a nice effect on the experience. 250-300mg full spectrum rue extract is generally where I settle & activates 60-70mg DMT fumarate or 4-5g of either ACRB or MHRB brew fairly consistantly for me.

You can toy around with your harmala dosage & find what you like. Usually less harmalas means using more DMT & vice versa.
You can also play around with different harmalas & mixing in different ratios to further tune the experience to your personal wants/needs.

I would also advise you to learn to extract your own harmalas. Once you get the hang of things you can produce enough harmalas from a reliatively small amount of rue for hundreds of experiences.

Freebase will work but fumarate or another DMT salt seems to work best orally. You can just take your DMT & dissolve in a shot of fruit juice & it works well to convert to salt.

There is no informational website confirming the dosages mentioned aside from this one. What I mentioned here is knowledge learned both from personal experience & from years of reading & researching on the forums here.