Daring first-timers personal advisery

[Blackandblue]

I won't do ketamine because I get addicted to things easily
I won't do salvia because it seems to be outcompeted in every way by dmt
i won't do shrooms because they are outcompeted by dmt, apparently
i won't do oral dmt because it seems to be outcompeted by n-n-dmt (i refer to this as just dmt)
i won't do lsd because it's apparently superficial compared to shrooms
i won't do weed/x/the rest because they aren't for the kind or degree of thing i'm looking for

- - -

SWIM has 0 experience, other than with once/rare use of soft/safe non psychadelics:

-an RC that did nothing (probably smoked it wrong), weed that did barely anything (waste of time, thought it was stupid), a couple of psychostimulants (which swim fucking loved but they weren't enlightening or meaningful, just useful to get stuff done and turn my mood around), alcohol (very rarely, but I'm a quitted (for now) binge drinker, smokes and cigars.

- - -

SWIM has a very open mind and have cleared up all SWIMS preconcieved notions of what it will be (apart from the elf bit, it's hard to stop thinking about entity contact and SWIM don't want to adulterate my trip - but try not thinking about Flaming Rhinos...yeah.

- - -

Setting: Alone at home OR at university in safe, anonymous place (vapour genie will leave no evidence incase I black out and somebody finds me, investigates my pipe?) OR with dangerous drug dealer who would do it with me for the first time and is interested in psycha but only does lsd and shrooms low doses OR with my unrequited love - and she knows it (we're comfortably friends though *but so much frustration want!*)

Which do you suggest of the above?

What do you think/advise about below?

SWIM plans to smoke 50mg (bit more than needed for a very strong trip apparently, because I don't smoke I suck at taking in smoke and pressume it will be enough for me to break through but not black out) and then smoke up again a couple of weeks from then (to inter and extrapolate from the experience to determine whether its worthwhile exploring more)

- - -

So, assuming SWIM doesn't find what SWIMS looking for in DMT, do you think SWIM doesn't have enough background and should try other stuff like psilocybin and more DMT, or combos like adding changa, or maybe this isn't for me?

- - -

One additional random question. Just to make sure I've understood: Hyperspace = result of breaking through = possible entity contact = level 5(+?) experience

 

[Guyomech]

First of all, try to stop thinking about flaming rhinos.

The term "hyperspace" applies literally to space that allows for expression in more than the usual three dimensions. You will find it impossibly hard to imagine this while sober, but even a sub breakthrough DMT dose will show you all kinds of extra dimension. Entity contact is not an assured thing, and in fact I don't think everyone is wired for this kind of experience.

I believe that I've been able to gain a lot from my DMT experiences precisely because of my extensive experimentation with LSD and shrooms beforehand. So I didn't have to have my whole damned reality shattered at once. But if you really feel that it's best for you to just dive in like that, no problem- but you may have more trouble remembering, processing and integrating your experiences. Also, you can gain a lot of profound insights from sub breakthrough experiences, so I really don't think you need to pressure yourself to that extent.

Good call on avoiding the K... I had some wonderful experiences with it but really got freaked out by the craving that came the evenings after each of them. I'm not comfortable walking that kind of tightrope.

Good luck... And read, read, read! You've come to the right place.

 

[tango]

I won't do ketamine because I get addicted to things easily
I won't do salvia because it seems to be outcompeted in every way by dmt
i won't do shrooms because they are outcompeted by dmt, apparently
i won't do oral dmt because it seems to be outcompeted by n-n-dmt (i refer to this as just dmt)
i won't do lsd because it's apparently superficial compared to shrooms
i won't do weed/x/the rest because they aren't for the kind or degree of thing i'm looking for

The above compounds are not competing with each other - how did you come up with such ideas?
What's "the kind of degree of thing you're looking for"? It seems to me that you just built some sort of fantasy... Sort of like the guy who's never stolen a pencil and one day decides he wants to go steal the gold reserve from the feds, because anything else would be a unworthy of his abilities.

 

[obliguhl]

I won't do salvia because it seems to be outcompeted in every way by dmt
i won't do shrooms because they are outcompeted by dmt, apparently
i won't do oral dmt because it seems to be outcompeted by n-n-dmt (i refer to this as just dmt)

This could not be more false. And even if, it wouldn't lead to the conclusion, that DMT is the way to go. Also, the university is a horrible place to smoke DMT and also with a "dangerous dealer". It does not seem that you have thought this through. You've got a lot more reading and planning to do, if you want to have a safe and fruitful experience.

 

[Whatisreal]

I don't understand the disregard for other psychs either... Think about the role that dosage plays and please understand that mushrooms, lsd, etc. could all potentially have what you're looking for. Either way though, I experienced dmt for the first time with only one acid trip under my belt and weed smoking so i know it has potential to be a great first trip.

 

[Kasura]

If you're going to dive into this, don't buy it. Extract it yourself.

And try to turn around that mindset about other psychedelics. They have so much to teach.

 

[thelastdinosaur]

All I saw was this:

I wont do this because someone told me it sucked
or this because someone told me it sucked
or this because someone told me it sucked
or this because someone told me it sucked

Followed almost directly by this:

But SWIM has a very open mind


So as someone who has tried everything you are presumed to be against, I will side with everyone else in saying

"Thou shalt not knock it before thou hast tried it."


And regarding your additional question:

Breaking through to Hyperspace and possibly Intities =
Hard work + patience + respect + love for thy self

 

[Bill Cipher]

OP - Can you please try to avoid speaking in absolutes about things you've never experienced?

You sound a lot like my six year old when I asked her to try brusselsprouts for the first time. The truth is that until you've eaten a brusselsprout, you really don't know shit about what one tastes like, and in the same way that I assume she would probably alienate everyone over at the brusselsprout-nexus by logging on and attempting to wow them with her unfounded insights, you're not going to make a lot of friends here until you've rethought your delivery.

And for what it's worth - I think you're going to end up hurting yourself. You know not what you're getting yourself into.

 

[Blackandblue]

Haha, all these posts have given me so much perspective.
Each has quite radically changed my approach to making a decision with how I introduce psychedelics to my life!
Thanks especially to the early posts so much! I love this community and you're all wonderful.

My resolutions/thought updates:

' But if you really feel that it's best for you to just dive in like that, no problem- but you may have more trouble remembering, processing and integrating your experiences. Also, you can gain a lot of profound insights from sub breakthrough experiences, so I really don't think you need to pressure yourself to that extent.'

SWIM might go start with small doses of shrooms and maybe mdma and work through steady increases of doses for a little while. SWIM has no reliable connection to LSD and doesn't trust his chemistry abilities (I failed university first year chemistry! )

' read, read, read! You've come to the right place.'

Yessir

'The above compounds are not competing with each other - how did you come up with such ideas?'

It was born out of an assumption I have made from little experience! From reading trip reports I had that impression, and because of the characterising in that book of the dead. I know better now.

'It seems to me that you just built some sort of fantasy... Sort of like the guy who's never stolen a pencil and one day decides he wants to go steal the gold reserve from the feds, because anything else would be a unworthy of his abilities.'

Sounds like an excellent analogy. I love hearing this kind of stuff because I'm starting to reflect on my general approach to life which is pretty much this kind of pencil fearing bank robber outlook

'This could not be more false. And even if, it wouldn't lead to the conclusion, that DMT is the way to go'

Out of lingering curiosity, hypothetically based on my previous misunderstanding, what would be? I just want to metaanalyse my research process to better understand for next time, that's why I'm asking


'If you're going to dive into this, don't buy it. Extract it yourself.'

that's the plan

'All I saw was this:I wont do this because someone told me it suckedor this because someone told me it suckedor this because someone told me it suckedor this because someone told me it sucked'

I'm sorry I miscommunicated. No, those are my conclusions that I posted, not the evidence. I have heard overwhelming favour for each thing, apart from Ketamine. I had just thought about them in the wrong way (heirachically). 'Followed almost directly by this:But SWIM has a very open mind' Open mind, poor brain - I can only try

'OP - Can you please try to avoid speaking in absolutes about things you've never experienced? '

Sorry if I have offended anyone. i was not speaking in absolutes about things. I was speaking in absolutes about my approach to those things. I wasn't trying to characterise those things, just what they could mean for me, personally. In the realm of action and inaction there is only absolutes. Do or do not do.


' The truth is that until you've eaten a brusselsprout, you really don't know shit about what one tastes like'

There are studies on different approaches to learning that suggest that different people are predisposed to learning in different ways. Some are strongly empirical and strongly avoid generalisations while some are theorists who verify as a last step. It doesn't mean your way is any better than mine, or vice versa. Neither even have a clear survival advantage. As someone who has relied on formulations and theories to accurately predict things by analogue on regular basis (oh gawd that makes me sound like an asshole but it's how I've typed it out) , I can confidently say that I just simply disagree with that and I resent the hostility you're expressing.

'alienate everyone'

I think I just have. A lot of negative responses to my request for advice. I submitted this because I wanted constructive criticism and saw the flaws in my thinking before diving in. I'm not sure exactly how you guys have the impression that I'm 'attempting to wow them with her unfounded insights'.

I haven't put forward any insights because I've had none.

'And for what it's worth - I think you're going to end up hurting yourself. You know not what you're getting yourself into.'

Thank you for your concern. I'm here to learn Can you suggest what I can do to know better what I'm getting into so that I might have a better than harmful experience.

On again thanks for the valuable feedback! Cheers.

 

[Bill Cipher]

Slow and steady wins the race. All the reading in the world just won't prepare you for that moment of complete ego dissolution. There's no shame in working up to that, either in terms of dosage or through the use of other psychedelics. Try to understand and accept that this thing you are envisioning is not what you think it is. There is no possible way whatsoever to imagine it without experiencing it.

I've seen people with very little drug experience do fine with DMT breakthroughs, and I've seen battle tested veterans of prior psychedelics use reduced to fits of blubbering. The most important quality is malleability. How flexible can you be? You're obviously a smart guy, but over-analysis within the moment is a one way ticket to a hyperslap.

 

[obliguhl]

Out of lingering curiosity, hypothetically based on my previous misunderstanding, what would be? I just want to metaanalyse my research process to better understand for next time, that's why I'm asking

Sorry for just shooting that at you...sure i can explain it in more detail. First of all, Breakthrough Experiences can be had using salvia, mushrooms and "oral dmt", you just have to take enough (well, this is also oversimplified). But even if not, intensity is not everything. Every psychedelic tends to offer a certain valuable aspect. While tryptamines share commonalities, they still are distinctly different and provoke different reactions. For instance, a low dose of mushroom might be very beneficial, if you want to talk a walk through a forest, to connect with your Nature. While oral dmt is in many cases (not all) not so explosive than smoked DMT, it offers you more time and together with caapi more guidance of some sort. This is the reason, a ton of people tend to prefer pharma/aya over vaped DMT these days....but vaped DMT is surely a interesting thing because of its rather short duration and extreme intensity...

But you see, there is no clear hirarchy to psychedelics as they all got different flavours. Saying one psychedelic is better than the other is comparing apples with oranges.

 

[tango]

'alienate everyone'

I think I just have.

I don't think so. If they thought you were just trolling around, people here would have simply ignored you. It always amazes me how much patience some of the members have, taking the time to welcome newcomers and discuss stuff that might seem just obvious after you've been browsing the forums for a while.

Back to your original question, I think that for troubled minds dmt has 2 major advantages over the other psychedelics you mentioned: it only lasts a few minutes and it takes you from here somewhere else and then straight back. The less radical compounds may slowly move you into a limbo where you're left to dwell on everything that is wrong in your life for hours on end, with limited mental defenses (harder to distract yourself from those thoughts than when you're sober).

 

[JacksonMetaller]

Wrong attitude man. I can understand ketamine if you are prone to addiction, but seriously this isn't a competition. If DMT was the be all end all of all drug experiences no one would ever touch LSD and shrooms again. But that's not the case. Different drugs for different reasons. Sure DMT is much more visually impressive, but you're not going to get the absolutely mind-blowing life altering realizations and thought spirals that you can achieve with LSD and mushrooms. You can't interact with your environment with DMT like you can with LSD and shrooms. Also weed + acid is the bees knees Quite literally one of the most impressive experiences this world has to offer and I've only done it on the comedown. I can't imagine how incredible it would be on the peak.

If you go for DMT first just pick the best setting. I can't tell you which one that would be, but whatever makes you most comfortable. Probably your lover. Also the first few tokes are awkward and uncomfortable sometimes. Do NOT feel threatened by some of the new feelings. Once you break through it's all ".....WHATTTTT.... OH MY....???? "

 

[Enoon]

concerning the "where to do it" question, forget about the university or any public place IMO. Either go to some remote outside place or do it at home. The GVG does not vaporize 100% clean so there will be residue left + it's an awkward situation being zoned out and halucinating while the campus guard checks you out.

And if it's your first time doing anything have someone with you who can help you out if you freak out or don't feel well in any way.

Personally I find no substance is superior to another. They all have their merits and a lot of times it's not even just the dose that can get you to the place you need to be, but rather your need to experience something + your ability to let it happen, that gets you there.

be careful wit mdma... the hangovers can be unpleasant

wish you the best.

 

[Kasura]

I would just like to say something:

Fuck yeah OP, you have an awesome mindset. There are so many people who would have gotten ridiculously sad at our responses to your posts, but you actually took them personally and have changed because of that. Good shit man

I wish you the best of luck on your travels.

 

[Jarl Von Hoother]

Hey, Blackand Blue. I see you have a dozen or so bored puppies biting your pant legs- Don't worry they can be territorial. Just don't let them hump your knees. metaphorically speaking of course

Now how to extract spice I believe is the desired answer you're looking for. What else would bring you here? Now before we skip to that don't go burning bridges and find what could be best you.

In that case I suggest taking a step back, chill out and listen to Terrence Mckenna talk about mushrooms

Mushrooms can be grown indoors for a month using spores from online vendors, you can easily fully colonize jars steirl ie. (steamed or pastureized) brown rice flour/vermiculite mulch inside. Once these colonies take buldge against the jar you can simply watch their growth take place if provided in a suitable climate in a clear plastic box with dampened perlite you'll find on the shelves of homedepot. Simple, hobbish and affordable.

Using the simple:
PF Tek part 1
PF Tek part 2
PF tek part 3

You get the hint

Now as for DMT since you seem to know so much about it start your extraction today! using theMarsofold Tek Save this pdf btw. But I also reccomend lots of reading before you get started until once fully equipped with the knowledge that you won't need to be afraid to ask all these self-righteous jerks. Express yourself man thats why we're all here, not to flaunt Ph.Ds or show off our politically correct analrentiveness in some sanctimonious smug cold shouldered attitude toward such smart newcomers who may suddenly find themselves a bit confused once stepping in. now get cracking, right now I have pound of mimosa waiting in my crockpot I use the same tek I linked you to. So good luck, Black and Blue

Sincerely Jar Von Hoother

 

[Kalagan]

In my view, in your first post you appear quite reckless and probably not informed enough, but that's ok, at least you didn't went in blindly and you asked, that's a good move. I pretty much went :shock: when reading your post.

As others have said, doing your first time alone isn't a good idea, doing it a alone in your campus is insane and doing it with a "dangerous drug dealer" is really not good either, I think that the fact that you are even considering these means you need to read more about what you're heading towards. You will need a sitter, and you need to know how to choose one. Only someone you trust and feel confident with. Find the right place, the right person and the right moment in your life to do it, there is no rush so take your time. Set and setting is probably the most important parameter that will affect your experience.

I disagree with the way you compare those different compounds, you can't judge their value by whether you end up in some other dimension and have a contact with entities or not, they all have something different to teach and not everyone enjoys their teachings the same way, you ll have to find what works for you. Actually with Salvia, I ALWAYS have contact with entities, but I was unaware of that possibility and I certainly didn't expect it or sought after it.

I m glad to see how reading what people said already helps you to change your attitude.
Maybe think about extracting it yourself if you can? You will never know for sure what you get out there, remember that you are planning to flood your system with a neurotransmitter here.

Good luck, be very careful, read a lot, plan accordingly and I believe that you will most likely be rewarded.

Recommended reading: The Spirit Molecule by Rick Strassman, great info in there.

 

[Blackandblue]

Thanks everyone!

A broader perspective and a lot to consider to work out! I'll be back!

 

[MomentOfTruth]

"Thou shalt not knock it before thou hast tried it."

One of those lost commandments?? hahaha!

Reminds me of Moral Orel

 

[DisEmboDied]

I don't understand this post. It was written schizophrenically. Sorry. Peace.