Potentially deadly! Datura seeds for lucid dreaming?

[Schahin92]

So dear community.

I read a story of taking low amounts of Datura seeds around 1-3 or 1-5 to have instant vivid and lucid dreaming at night.

What experiences have you done and is it really safe? Could there be variying potencies that do induce delirium if the seeds are too potent?

 

[northape]

Hello and welcome.

Datura is a very high-level medicine. I would advise you to look the other way. One needs years of experience and a lot of sensitivity to work with it.

Traditionally, only another elder could initiate you into Datura. Just like tobacco, it is a poison and can easily kill you. 1-3 seeds are a very low dose and will produce some effects on your dreams. I do not know about "instant vivid and lucid dreaming at night," though. We are all different, and you need to have a compatible nervous system for this kind of effect.

Do you have such dreams often? If yes, Datura can stimulate them; otherwise, it cannot create something out of nothing. Our human system is much more complex than what modern science can show. There is a whole notion of a subtle or psychic body that is just as real as you are. That is the key to lucid dreaming or any altered state, actually. We have no information about it in the West.

Long story short, work with more commonly used medicines. Datura should never come on your radar. There are a lot of dream-inducing herbs that you can try.

Stay safe

 

[doubledog]

I did use datura in the past for enhancement of dreams, it really very effectively potentiates dreaming process, but I do not think that it produces lucid dreaming state of mind. Quite the opposite is true, I was more immersed in dreams than I normally would, which is not very surprising as datura tropanes produces dream-like states.

On the other hand, some lucid dreaming skills are very useful for navigating stronger datura experiences.

But in general, datura is not worth it in higher doses, if you really decide to try it for dream enhancement, do not go over 2 seeds.

 

[Jamie01]

I have smoked brugmansia with weed for this purpose and I just got super high and pleasantly sedated with hypnogogia.

 

[northape]

I feel that even DMT/mushrooms could more easily produce lucid dreams in the weeks after use.
After a few days of 1-2 Datura seeds before sleep, I started to get the usual side effects from tropanes: dry mouth and problems with motor skills.
So, everyone is unique in their reaction. I seem to be very sensitive to Datura. Huperzine A is a much better and safer candidate to induce lucid dreaming.
Beware, long-term use of Huperzine A leads to constipation. I found that out the hard way

Edit: Never forget the best lucid dream inducer: good quality tobacco

 

[Schahin92]

I did use datura in the past for enhancement of dreams, it really very effectively potentiates dreaming process, but I do not think that it produces lucid dreaming state of mind. Quite the opposite is true, I was more immersed in dreams than I normally would, which is not very surprising as datura tropanes produces dream-like states.

On the other hand, some lucid dreaming skills are very useful for navigating stronger datura experiences.

But in general, datura is not worth it in higher doses, if you really decide to try it for dream enhancement, do not go over 2 seeds.

What do you mean with immersed?
Yes I am not interested in trying any high dosage with Datura I would have tried only one seed or two anyway. How vivid was the dream though, what was the difference to a normal dream state?

 

[doubledog]

After a few days of 1-2 Datura seeds before sleep, I started to get the usual side effects from tropanes: dry mouth and problems with motor skills.
So, everyone is unique in their reaction. I seem to be very sensitive to Datura.

I did also experience side effects as dry mouth etc from small doses of seeds, that is normal.

What do you mean with immersed?
Yes I am not interested in trying any high dosage with Datura I would have tried only one seed or two anyway. How vivid was the dream though, what was the difference to a normal dream state?

Datura dreams are more vivid, it produced a feeling of being more present in the dreams. Datura alkaloids produce dream-like states of mind even when you are awake, so it somehow synergizes with your normal sleep dreams.

 

[northape]

I'll give a more general idea to you, @Schahin92:
To get lucidity in your sleep, you need a lot of acetylcholine in your system. For this, there are cholinergic compounds like Huperzine A or tobacco. Datura has tropane alkaloids that work the other way around; they tend to create a dream headspace with a lack of lucidity. Heavy doses of Datura usually lead to amnesia or a loss of memory of the experience. So you can easily deduce for yourself what Datura would bring.

 

[Transform]

Datura should never come on your radar

I dunno, a single seed can be a pretty good antinauseant too. Synergistic tiny amounts with certain plant brews have something of an established history. But you're quite right that anything more than the tiniest amount carries unacceptable levels of risk.

 

[doubledog]

I add strong warning here:

Datura is very insidious plant, it creates illusions like no other plant I know and is very good in keeping you believing these illusions. (I am not describing acute hallucinations here, but long term effects)

It can give you unusual strenght and abilities, but you will pay for it.

 

[northape]

I dunno, a single seed can be a pretty good antinauseant too. Synergistic tiny amounts with certain plant brews have something of an established history. But you're quite right that anything more than the tiniest amount carries unacceptable levels of risk.

Just as @doubledog pointed and what I wrote in my first post: Datura is a very high-level medicine.
One needs a lot of experience to work with it, and even then, it requires your utmost respect and a mature approach. Sadly, most people assume that it's just another psychoactive plant and get burned. That's why it's better to just appreciate Datura from afar until you're truly ready.

Edit: I've been using 1-2 seeds in a ceremony to mitigate nausea until it fully shifted the energy and produced one of the biggest openings ever.
Datura is no joke, even at a low dose.

 

[Jamie01]

I will admit I actually love smoking the stuff with weed. I have 10 brugmansia plants and quite a bit of dry leaf. I hardly ever use it and last time I did was at least a year ago. When I first began experimenting I was both looking for lucid dreaming enhancement and also something to help with what I felt was a growing dependence on diphenhydramine for sleep. Solved that issue mostly with other herbs but now I am interested in salves...especially for muscle cramps.I think that salves goes well with my obsession with Nordic witchcraft.

Doesn’t seem to be much out there on salves. This guy has some good personal info on using nightshades but not sure if it’s in this talk or another…

 

[northape]

now I am interested in salves...especially for muscle cramps.I think that salves goes well with my obsession with Nordic witchcraft.

Salves are a whole other game. I want to make one myself for my mom. It should work well as a pain reliever and for arthritis.
How does it connect to Nordic witchcraft? I've become interested.

 

[Jamie01]

More so henbane and probly in beers really but also transdermal in Scandinavia.

 

[northape]

More so henbane and probly in beers really but also transdermal in Scandinavia.

Maybe Datura grows in the south of Scandinavia. I'm too far North
I grew my Datura in pots, hehe. Thanks for sharing. I only know of a flight ointment, or whatever it's called.

 

[Jamie01]

You might be into this.

The Mead and the Maiden – The Initiation of the Goddess

This article is taken from a chapter in my 2004 thesis “The Maiden with the Mead – a Goddess of Initiation in Norse Myths`” (Maria Kvilhaug) 8.1: The Maiden: Encompassing the Three Worlds Giantess,…

bladehoner.wordpress.com

 

[Jamie01]

Maybe Datura grows in the south of Scandinavia. I'm too far North
I grew my Datura in pots, hehe. Thanks for sharing. I only know of a flight ointment, or whatever it's called.

You should look into Hatsis work on European witchcraft…especially his book The witches ointment.

The ship burial at Oseberg had a Norse Volva with a bag of henbane and cannabis seed along with a fabric thought to have been of Persian silk(I think)…

 

[Sakkadelic]

Solved that issue mostly with other herbs but now I am interested in salves...especially for muscle cramps.

Salves are a whole other game. I want to make one myself for my mom. It should work well as a pain reliever and for arthritis.

Yes it does work well for pain relief, and I find that the relief is long lasting. I've had my cousin and aunt try it for different chronic pain issues and both reported that it worked amazing. I use mandrake for making ointments but datura or other nightshades should work the same.

 

[northape]

I'm bookmarking this. Thank you both
Time to honor local Spirits, I guess.

 

[Transform]

Maybe Datura grows in the south of Scandinavia. I'm too far North
I grew my Datura in pots, hehe. Thanks for sharing. I only know of a flight ointment, or whatever it's called.

I've found datura growing wild or at least naturalised at around 53.4°N, 10.6°E in a sheltered, south-facing location. That's still way further south than you but it's a reference point, at least.