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Do you use datura?
- Thread starter elru
- Start date
PowerfulMedicine
Rising Star
So many people seem scared of datura and rightly so. Most people who try it, even when they claim to be doing it in a responsible manner, use way too much initially. This coupled with the wide variation in potency from plant to plant and even time to time, makes using datura unsafe for "tripping".
There actually is a smart way to do it though. First you find one large plant. Pick 20-25 large leaves. This is too ensure that you will have a large amount of leaves with the same potency. Dry the leaves in a dark, dry, and not too warm place. One large leaf usually weighs about 250mg when dry. Now decide on a very small amount to use as a test. I usually use one large leaf (250mg) initially, but use what ever you feel comfortable with. Just remember that starting too small will be tedious. Just brew the a tea with that amount of leaf and 8oz of boiled water. Do not boil the leaf material.
In each subsequent test increase the amount by the initial amount used. Its also a good idea to space the tests out by at least a week. For me each test increases by one large leaf. For me, I usually feel nothing until I reach 750mg leaf material and then it is only a slight buzz in my head with no side effects. I am not going lie. I find it to be pleasant at this dose. I don't feel any dry mouth until 1250mg of leaf material. This is accompanied by a slight drunken feeling but no delerium. This too is generally enjoyable to me. I have yet to venture into doses sufficient enough to produce hallucinations, but I guess that they would occur at 1750-2000mg of leaf material without inducing too much delerium.
These doses are only specific to me and the specific batch of leaves that I am using. For every batch that I use I repeat this procedure and so should anyone else who decides to experiment with datura. This is the only safe way that I know of to find that sweet spot with datura were you can "trip" and not become psychotic.
There actually is a smart way to do it though. First you find one large plant. Pick 20-25 large leaves. This is too ensure that you will have a large amount of leaves with the same potency. Dry the leaves in a dark, dry, and not too warm place. One large leaf usually weighs about 250mg when dry. Now decide on a very small amount to use as a test. I usually use one large leaf (250mg) initially, but use what ever you feel comfortable with. Just remember that starting too small will be tedious. Just brew the a tea with that amount of leaf and 8oz of boiled water. Do not boil the leaf material.
In each subsequent test increase the amount by the initial amount used. Its also a good idea to space the tests out by at least a week. For me each test increases by one large leaf. For me, I usually feel nothing until I reach 750mg leaf material and then it is only a slight buzz in my head with no side effects. I am not going lie. I find it to be pleasant at this dose. I don't feel any dry mouth until 1250mg of leaf material. This is accompanied by a slight drunken feeling but no delerium. This too is generally enjoyable to me. I have yet to venture into doses sufficient enough to produce hallucinations, but I guess that they would occur at 1750-2000mg of leaf material without inducing too much delerium.
These doses are only specific to me and the specific batch of leaves that I am using. For every batch that I use I repeat this procedure and so should anyone else who decides to experiment with datura. This is the only safe way that I know of to find that sweet spot with datura were you can "trip" and not become psychotic.
FiorSirtheoir
Rising Star
fractal enchantment said:
This is what I was told by one of my friends and teachers. He taught me about Lakota 'medicine' and sweat lodge. He had an experience with this plant, it spoke to him, so he took some of the leaves and dried them made a tea from them. He was very spiritually grounded, and he said it opened the spirit world to him. He did share the brew with several others and it had varying effects, some very delusional. Anyway, back to the salve. He told me that the Apache had practice of taking the top 3 inches of the root, emulsifying it with a hard edge, like the edge of a plate, with water in full sun. They would beat it into a paste which they would put onto the bottom of their feet and it would give them the ability to fly. His body died some years ago before we ever gave it a go, and I have yet to try it.
He also told me of another tribe that would use it for a 'coming into manhood ceremony'. I can't remember which America tribe it was, but they would give the young man many doses of tea over the coarse of several days, which part of the plant I have no idea. It was said that it removed any childhood prejudices and purified them for manhood to be one of the 'people'.
That is the extent of what I have been told.
aetherbound
Rising Star
Let me preface this story with the all too common, " I was young and dumb and there wasn't forums or even an internet!"
So a buddy who had heard me talking about doing mushrooms asked if I had ever heard of angel trumpets. I hadn't and that day after work we went to a neighborhood he knew and right on one corner was a huge bush loaded with beautiful blooms.
I jumped out of the car and retrieved around a dozen blooms before the property owner came out of the garage yelling at me. I went home and prepared them as I was told, strip out pistel and stamen and only use the petal portion.
I boiled them down to around a quart of liquid and put in the fridge to get cold. I had been warned that I would experience a few things: I would talk to people that wasnt actually there, newsprint would look like the Russian language
and effects may last for awhile.
I was planning on going out as it was Friday and a payday so to kick things off I took a hit of blotter I had been saving and half an hour later drank a pint of the tea. Within an hour the acid was kicking in and at 1.5 hours I was so disoriented and sleepy I crawled in the bed and passed out. I awoke in the morning to a co-worker at the foot of my bed asking me why I hadnt shown up to work, I replied I had taken angel trumpets and was messed up. I then realized there was no one in my room , I chuckled and everytime I looked in my periphery he was there again. I snatched up a novel I was reading a could not make out a single letter. This lasted the entire weekend. I went and poured the rest of the tea out and never touched it again.
Aetherbound
So a buddy who had heard me talking about doing mushrooms asked if I had ever heard of angel trumpets. I hadn't and that day after work we went to a neighborhood he knew and right on one corner was a huge bush loaded with beautiful blooms.
I jumped out of the car and retrieved around a dozen blooms before the property owner came out of the garage yelling at me. I went home and prepared them as I was told, strip out pistel and stamen and only use the petal portion.
I boiled them down to around a quart of liquid and put in the fridge to get cold. I had been warned that I would experience a few things: I would talk to people that wasnt actually there, newsprint would look like the Russian language
and effects may last for awhile.
I was planning on going out as it was Friday and a payday so to kick things off I took a hit of blotter I had been saving and half an hour later drank a pint of the tea. Within an hour the acid was kicking in and at 1.5 hours I was so disoriented and sleepy I crawled in the bed and passed out. I awoke in the morning to a co-worker at the foot of my bed asking me why I hadnt shown up to work, I replied I had taken angel trumpets and was messed up. I then realized there was no one in my room , I chuckled and everytime I looked in my periphery he was there again. I snatched up a novel I was reading a could not make out a single letter. This lasted the entire weekend. I went and poured the rest of the tea out and never touched it again.
Aetherbound
PowerfulMedicine
Rising Star
FiorSirtheoir said:
This Apache method is very similar if not exactly the same as the procedure outlined in the book The Teachings of Don Juan by Carlos Casteneda. I recently read and reread this book and was thinking it would be very interesting to follow the preparations used in the book. I will surely try a salve in the near future now. Its good to see other accounts of the use of datura in a traditional context. It is very sad that the indigenous knowledge of such a powerful plant like datura is slowly fading away like the knowledge of so many other of our plant brethren.
This is actually where it goes wrong. The strength also depends on how you extract it (do you boil it?, for how long?, etc.) so it could still be unpredictable. Then, the state of drunkennes can quickly pass over into total delirium.PowerfulMedicine said:
Also the idea to use as many leaves as you feel you're gonna be comfortable with is quite dangerous.
Most of all: there is no 'sweet spot' for datura. It is NOT a psychedelic. Once you trip, you're in a state of delirium. There is a a stage where you feel a sort of drunkennes, but that's as far as you can go. Any further is totally reckless and suicidal.
And i know what i'm talking about. When i was a teenager i experimented with it in my youthfull ignorance. I have been through such a delirium and i can say that if it wheren't without some good sitters around, i most likely would have caused a serious accident.
Ginkgo
Rising Star
The hyoscyamine and scopolamine content of leaves of Datura stramonium can vary with as much as 1000% between plants as well as between individual leaves. Yep, 10 times the potency in some compared to others. I think using any other part than the seeds (which varies considerably less) is a bad idea.
PowerfulMedicine
Rising Star
polytrip said:
First of all, I actually said how I extract it. I specifically say that I brew it like a normal tea and do not boil it. I may have not been clear about the amount of leaves to use. I should have said to use no more than 1 leaf increments, but that less is fine.
powerfulmedicine said:
polytrip said:
I never said that datura was a psychedelic. I actually said that it is unsafe for tripping, but I do feel that it is a very valuable tool for exploration of the consciousness and spiritual world if used correctly. I also would have to disagree that there is no sweet spot. Just because you never found a sweet spot doesn't mean that there is none. As we all know, tropane alkaloids are very potent and dosing can be tricky.
I would also like to point out that there is a difference between delirium and psychosis. Being slightly delirious is not suicidal or even all that dangerous. People become delirious from fevers everyday and you don't hear about them running around naked and doing stupid shit that gets them killed. There are different levels of delirium. The trick with datura, in my opinion, is to find that dose where you barely become delirious. It may take some a bit of work but it is possible, even if most people never find that dose.
polytrip said:
I understand that harm reduction is very important but the truth is that with a plant as wide spread as datura you will never be able to totally prevent stupid teens from experimenting. All the fear mongering doesn't seem to do much to curb the use of datura. But the fact is that there is a safe way to use datura. The use of datura predates written history. Millions of people have used it over many millenia and have done so in a safe way. I think that instead of everyone being all like "datura will kill you!", they should be like "Datura can kill you if you don't take the right precautions" and then offer constructive safety precautions.
Evening Glory said:
I have read that before but in my experience, that is not the usual case. I have never come across two leaves that were collected at the same time from the same plant with significantly different potency. Maybe I have just been lucky. I also didn't mention that I don't use D. stramonium. I use D. wrightii, a very close relative of D. innoxia. It has more scopolamine(less toxic) and less of the other alkaloids as compared to D. stramonium.
Bindu, a couple of datura seeds can't kill you. Most of the times the delirious dose is anything between 50 seeds and 300. But these higher doses already are physically risky.
But the most risk is even due by the nature of the delirious experience which may take you risk you wouldn't have take.
That's why you can safely ingest 3 datura seeds but no more than 10 to stay below threshold effect and ONLY look for its medecinal properties.
But the most risk is even due by the nature of the delirious experience which may take you risk you wouldn't have take.
That's why you can safely ingest 3 datura seeds but no more than 10 to stay below threshold effect and ONLY look for its medecinal properties.
ewok
.
I write this as a warning.
When I was 18 me and a girl I knew collected some datura leaves and flowers from a house close to my flat at the time, we boiled it up as a tea had a cup each, not much happened just lost ability to focus, when reading words blurred into one big ink puddle, she reported the same.
A few days later I boiled up some left over leaves and drunk an unknown amount, I sat down and just watched TV. A hour or so later I picked up my playstation controller and started playing street fighter, after awhile I thought that's strange the fireballs are crossing my lounge then POP it disappeared(I should note now I didn't have a playstation at the time). Confused by this I went back to watching TV. Same thing happened playstation-fireballs-POP. All gone again this happened several times.
I started talking to the guy in full army gear that was standing in my kitchen, at the time this seemed a perfectly normal thing to happen, POP he disappears.
One by one people where turning up to the party I was chatting away with people and POP there gone so I'd talk to the next person, when they disappeared I'd simply move on it was what I thought was normal never struck me as odd.
Then a real person turned up who I think for my protection suggested I go to his place with him, we got a taxi and on the way I vividly remember a truck in front of us when that POPPED I recall talking about it and getting mad that the taxi driver didn't see it I thought he was messing with me. I was not happy but shrug it off, when we reached my mates house somehow I lost him and went to what I thought was his place I was banging on the window people kept telling me to leave they were being real rude in my opinion. But I left and decided I should go home(about a one hour walk).
Just down the road I recognized some people in a car and knocked on the window cause they weren't looking at me, they wouldn't wind it down, I got sick of waiting and went back to walking, I seen someone else I knew went over had a chat then POP its a lamp post further down the road I see someone else I knew started talking then POP its a bush a tree a lamp post. Over and over people I know, talk with them then POP gone.
When I get to the road down by the harbor I keep seeing people I know walk into the water I go to follow but the sharks scare me to much there far braver than I, Then I'm back talking to bushes and trees.
Eventually I get to the train station its all clear I decided to take the short cut, half way across the tracks they start yelling watch out get off the tracks, there are trains everywhere I freak out and sprint to the fence I'm safe I jump it.
After a lot more people POPPING and becoming tree/bush/lamp post I make it home with complete relief as I had started noticing how weird it was with all the POPPING, I go to bed I wake up and someone is holding me up above the bed I struggle but can't stay awake.
In the morning I wake up feeling strange starting to get faint memories I'm glad I'm now straight, People outside start talking I go out there but no one is there. Back inside It starts up again people talking but can't find them. I get a flash where I see someone out window I turn quickly but gone I'm to slow. I start getting real paranoid and confused.
Over the next few weeks the voices don't stop I got flashes of people animals objects, one night a carriage with horses steam's through my wall across the room and out the opposite wall, I see a little boy walking on my wall, my family get worried and contact the local mental health unit. I got taken in for assessment weeks had gone by they didn't think it was from the datura and I end up in hospital, I run away, cause A commotion in my confused state and get arrested after a week in jail I was transferred to the forensic psychiatric ward.
Took at least 6months to get back to a semi normal state it was a terrifying time in my life and I would warn anyone against even considering taking datura. I had no idea what was real I thought everyone was out to get me I was stuck in a seemingly endless trip.
When I was 18 me and a girl I knew collected some datura leaves and flowers from a house close to my flat at the time, we boiled it up as a tea had a cup each, not much happened just lost ability to focus, when reading words blurred into one big ink puddle, she reported the same.
A few days later I boiled up some left over leaves and drunk an unknown amount, I sat down and just watched TV. A hour or so later I picked up my playstation controller and started playing street fighter, after awhile I thought that's strange the fireballs are crossing my lounge then POP it disappeared(I should note now I didn't have a playstation at the time). Confused by this I went back to watching TV. Same thing happened playstation-fireballs-POP. All gone again this happened several times.
I started talking to the guy in full army gear that was standing in my kitchen, at the time this seemed a perfectly normal thing to happen, POP he disappears.
One by one people where turning up to the party I was chatting away with people and POP there gone so I'd talk to the next person, when they disappeared I'd simply move on it was what I thought was normal never struck me as odd.
Then a real person turned up who I think for my protection suggested I go to his place with him, we got a taxi and on the way I vividly remember a truck in front of us when that POPPED I recall talking about it and getting mad that the taxi driver didn't see it I thought he was messing with me. I was not happy but shrug it off, when we reached my mates house somehow I lost him and went to what I thought was his place I was banging on the window people kept telling me to leave they were being real rude in my opinion. But I left and decided I should go home(about a one hour walk).
Just down the road I recognized some people in a car and knocked on the window cause they weren't looking at me, they wouldn't wind it down, I got sick of waiting and went back to walking, I seen someone else I knew went over had a chat then POP its a lamp post further down the road I see someone else I knew started talking then POP its a bush a tree a lamp post. Over and over people I know, talk with them then POP gone.
When I get to the road down by the harbor I keep seeing people I know walk into the water I go to follow but the sharks scare me to much there far braver than I, Then I'm back talking to bushes and trees.
Eventually I get to the train station its all clear I decided to take the short cut, half way across the tracks they start yelling watch out get off the tracks, there are trains everywhere I freak out and sprint to the fence I'm safe I jump it.
After a lot more people POPPING and becoming tree/bush/lamp post I make it home with complete relief as I had started noticing how weird it was with all the POPPING, I go to bed I wake up and someone is holding me up above the bed I struggle but can't stay awake.
In the morning I wake up feeling strange starting to get faint memories I'm glad I'm now straight, People outside start talking I go out there but no one is there. Back inside It starts up again people talking but can't find them. I get a flash where I see someone out window I turn quickly but gone I'm to slow. I start getting real paranoid and confused.
Over the next few weeks the voices don't stop I got flashes of people animals objects, one night a carriage with horses steam's through my wall across the room and out the opposite wall, I see a little boy walking on my wall, my family get worried and contact the local mental health unit. I got taken in for assessment weeks had gone by they didn't think it was from the datura and I end up in hospital, I run away, cause A commotion in my confused state and get arrested after a week in jail I was transferred to the forensic psychiatric ward.
Took at least 6months to get back to a semi normal state it was a terrifying time in my life and I would warn anyone against even considering taking datura. I had no idea what was real I thought everyone was out to get me I was stuck in a seemingly endless trip.
bindu
*
ah ok, well they strapped him to a hospital bed for 15 days. So there was no danger that he could hurt himself
only the last 4 days he had horrortrips
i wonder if people that ingested too much can be helped,
the people in the hospital had no clue on what to do.
ssri for example avoiding negative thoughts and hellfire until trip is over
only the last 4 days he had horrortrips
i wonder if people that ingested too much can be helped,
the people in the hospital had no clue on what to do.
ssri for example avoiding negative thoughts and hellfire until trip is over
Jin
yes
hi , the place where i come from has a long history of cultuaral datura use (no i am no yaqui indian , i am from india and a east indian :d ) , sages , sadhus , yogis or the gurus whatever you want to call them have used it for 1000's of years here , a long history of its effects , doseages and preparation methods have all been well documented and preserved ( you can search the VEDAS and auyerveda books ) , however the real documentation is possesed by a certain cult of sadhus who are really not willing to share this knowledge with anyone except the other fools ready to join them ,
this datura sadhus are not respected by any spiritual societies in india who mostly think this sadhus are crazy fucks ( which is ofcourse true ) , this sadhus are not really spirutalists as i have met some , these people are greedy as hell and have started using their knowledge to fool idiots who smoke datura with them and are later robbed and sometimes killed by the sadhus , or if you are a girl probably rape is in order before you meet your doom , this is one of the most poisinous substance known to these guys and they are using it appropriately to fool their victims after their victims have inhaled the datura smoke(these sadhus probably have stronger recipies that they use as a smoke not ingesting it , also they miX hashish in the smoke which is crucial to the madness blend)
i have known only two people who smoked datura , one roams barefeet on the road not knowing anything and the other friend of mine , roams the streets shouting the words " can anybody satisfy me " :lol: oh yes they both have tails growing out of their asses that they can only see and they never really came down , ever its been more than 10 to 11 years for both of them
datura is really a wonderful plant to poison other people or wreck their lifes if you intend to use it that way , SADHUS know all about it and they can help anyone who is in need to learn , only once you find yourself lying naked on a street not knowing who you are ? that is the real lesson of datura and many have learn it as i know of
this is no drug , this is an experience of ultimate stupidity and everyone willing enough to embrace it is welcome to find himself naked far away from home sucking on a tree with legs stretched upwards and bound and gagged with shit
this datura sadhus are not respected by any spiritual societies in india who mostly think this sadhus are crazy fucks ( which is ofcourse true ) , this sadhus are not really spirutalists as i have met some , these people are greedy as hell and have started using their knowledge to fool idiots who smoke datura with them and are later robbed and sometimes killed by the sadhus , or if you are a girl probably rape is in order before you meet your doom , this is one of the most poisinous substance known to these guys and they are using it appropriately to fool their victims after their victims have inhaled the datura smoke(these sadhus probably have stronger recipies that they use as a smoke not ingesting it , also they miX hashish in the smoke which is crucial to the madness blend)
i have known only two people who smoked datura , one roams barefeet on the road not knowing anything and the other friend of mine , roams the streets shouting the words " can anybody satisfy me " :lol: oh yes they both have tails growing out of their asses that they can only see and they never really came down , ever its been more than 10 to 11 years for both of them
datura is really a wonderful plant to poison other people or wreck their lifes if you intend to use it that way , SADHUS know all about it and they can help anyone who is in need to learn , only once you find yourself lying naked on a street not knowing who you are ? that is the real lesson of datura and many have learn it as i know of
this is no drug , this is an experience of ultimate stupidity and everyone willing enough to embrace it is welcome to find himself naked far away from home sucking on a tree with legs stretched upwards and bound and gagged with shit
Seraph
Rising Star
Jin so you're saying Datura is a weapon? Can datura alkaloids be injected? What if I carry around a high-pressure water pistol loaded with compressed datura gasses? Does this mean I can make anyone I want go bye-bye if they get in my way without legal implications?
Enemy brandishing a knife: I'll cut you up!
Me: Goodbye (at a distance I spray the datura gas like pepper spray)
Enemy doesn't understand what he is doing.
I run.
Enemy is mentally screwed for threatening me.
Everything I say is fictional. Do not try this at home or anywhere else under any circumstances.
Enemy brandishing a knife: I'll cut you up!
Me: Goodbye (at a distance I spray the datura gas like pepper spray)
Enemy doesn't understand what he is doing.
I run.
Enemy is mentally screwed for threatening me.
Everything I say is fictional. Do not try this at home or anywhere else under any circumstances.
Seraph, this is highly innapropriate and you should know this after so many months in this forum!
Jin was telling his perspective of the dangers of datura which is used with negative intentions, and you turn this into "so I can make a weapon out of this" ? Dont you think this is completely out of line considering our attitude and how we try to establish a harm reducing information database ?
Jin was telling his perspective of the dangers of datura which is used with negative intentions, and you turn this into "so I can make a weapon out of this" ? Dont you think this is completely out of line considering our attitude and how we try to establish a harm reducing information database ?
