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Does yopo feel different from cebil?

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Well, they are not the same.

I think all the information that can be given on the topic has (in your last thread on the topic) and there's really not much anyone else can say. You may just have to bioassay them both and judge for yourself.

Chemically, yopo is generally 5-meo-DMT dominant, and generally cebil is 5-HO-DMT dominant.

-eg
 
entheogenic-gnosis said:
Well, they are not the same.

I think all the information that can be given on the topic has (in your last thread on the topic) and there's really not much anyone else can say. You may just have to bioassay them both and judge for yourself.

Chemically, yopo is generally 5-meo-DMT dominant, and generally cebil is 5-HO-DMT dominant.

-eg

My source has these (Listed from most to least expensive):

Cebil seeds
Yopo seeds
Powdered (with hull) Cebil seeds

Should I get some of each and just use the powdered for a bufo extraction?

I'm not sure the powdered can be used for snuff considering the shell hulls are in the powder......can anybody speak on this?
 
maranello551 said:
entheogenic-gnosis said:
Well, they are not the same.

I think all the information that can be given on the topic has (in your last thread on the topic) and there's really not much anyone else can say. You may just have to bioassay them both and judge for yourself.

Chemically, yopo is generally 5-meo-DMT dominant, and generally cebil is 5-HO-DMT dominant.

-eg

My source has these (Listed from most to least expensive):

Cebil seeds
Yopo seeds
Powdered (with hull) Cebil seeds

Should I get some of each and just use the powdered for a bufo extraction?

I'm not sure the powdered can be used for snuff considering the shell hulls are in the powder......can anybody speak on this?

It it was myself personally, I would by a sample of both.

As far as buying "powdered" ethnobotanicals, I will never do this, it's far too easy for "saw dust" or other forms of "cut" to be slipped into the product without your knowledge, I'm not sure if there is evidence that this actually happens, but being a wary consumer means the possibility that it could occur means it's something to remain mindful of.

I'll stop here and allow someone other than myself to offer some input, because I'm not a yopo or cebil expert, just a researcher.

-eg
 
maranello551 said:
Well? Does it?
Well with yopo and cebil it is always a hit and miss, some vendors sell old almost inactive seeds or sell one for the other. Personally in the study of both seeds I have observed a lot of differences and similarities on the effects and duration. My rat finds that cebil tends to be a little bit more reliable in strength, but also tends to have more of a plain and linear effect and its accompanied by strong physical sensations (sometimes nice, sometimes not so much) more so than yopo. The observed psychic effects of cebil consist on tingling sensations (specially in the head area), intermittent blurred vision, rapid and chaotic CEV composed of light color lines (most of the times of a red pigment). The effects on the ego and perception of space and time are very mild. These more intense effects are felt 5 to 15 minutes after consumption, followed by a state that resembles a low dose of psilocybin, with a clear mindset for the next 45 minutes and a refreshed feeling for the rest of the day.
With yopo the experiences varies a bit. My rat was observed to present symptoms of effects that where somewhat more dynamic and morphing than the ones of cebil. The physical sensations are sometimes overcome by the mental and emotional sensations, consisting on a somewhat more enjoyable body load. The intermittent blurred vision is more pronounced and is accompanied by strobing tints of blue, red and green. It produces a sense of euphoria and moments of mild dissociation. Moving patterns consisting of lines overlay on top of visible field. CEV´s are sometimes more harmonic and they resemble much more the ones provided by the use of DMT. Perception of space and time is somewhat affected, egoloss seems to be very hard but posible if the dose is very high. Strong effects seem to be felt from 5 to 30 minutes after consumption, having a more lasting peak than cebil. The follow effects are the same for both seeds, feelings of mild tryptamine ingestion with a clear mind, refreshing feeling, euphoria.
These observation where made after repeated applications of similar doses of both materials. The ROA used for these experiments where intranasaly (snuff) and smoked plant material and crude, and slightly purified extracts.
My rat tends to prefer yopo, even though sometimes seeds are bunked (50/50) or cebil sold as yopo. Once both of them are tried is easy to tell the difference. Cebil seeds have been easier to find personally and they tend to be fresher and in the production of extracts they tend to have higher yields than yopo. By experience I could see my rat behaving more like in ayahuasca when yopo was consumed, with a very distinct 5 MeO DMT dissociative sensation, it feels very much like a cocktail of stuff. While cebil feels more linear and predictable, and the effects look closer to psilocybin than to DMT. I now grow my own as im lucky to live in the tropic and suggest anyone working with these entheogen to do the same (even if its harder on more templarte weather, is still posible) as potency varies greatly depending on the freshness of the seeds.
Consumption method and preparation is also a very significant factor. In snuff preparation calcium carbonate seems to be the best option, as it is strong enough and does not irritate the nasal passage as much as other bases do. Is harder to screw up the pH by overshooting. Calcium Hydroxide works good too, but I was never able to give it to my rat without giving her a nasal chaos for a few days. Although there are people that claim that there is a sweetspot to work with calcium hydroxide without burning the hell out of your nose. Sodium Carbonate and Bicarbonate render a very low potency snuff in my experience. Next is how are you applying the snuff. Regular insulation (like taking a line of coke) won't be giving you much of the "nice" effects and lots of the purging. Simply because when insulating you are dragging the snuff down your throat passage as well, eventually falling in your stomach and making you puke (both seeds cause vomiting as soon as they hit the stomach) and letting less plant material in your sinuses to be absorbed. The snuff needs to be blown up the nose, this can be achieved by creating a self-adminestrating device out of hollowed tubes, much like the amazonians do. Or having someone to blow it through an empty tube into the nose. Doses for these method vary a lot but usually tend to fall between .5g to 3g, sometimes there is a tendency to redose.
The beans can be basified with ammonia (or not) and smoked, dose is smaller for desired effects but the taste tends to be to powerful and nauseating, negative physical effects are greater and it has a toxic feeling. Crude extracts can be done with and without basifing and as potency varies they need to be tested to find proper dosage.
Hope you find it useful =)
 
entheogenic-gnosis said:
It it was myself personally, I would by a sample of both.

As far as buying "powdered" ethnobotanicals, I will never do this, it's far too easy for "saw dust" or other forms of "cut" to be slipped into the product without your knowledge, I'm not sure if there is evidence that this actually happens, but being a wary consumer means the possibility that it could occur means it's something to remain mindful of.

What if I buy a sample of each type of whole seed,

and then

do a bufo extraction on both the powdered cebil as well as on a similar weight of whole cebil (accounting for the weight of the hulls after de-hulling)to compare yields......this way the potential crud would be left out, and if the bufor yields are comparable, I could at least use the far cheaper powdered cebil for extractions rather than snuff powder...
 
maranello551 said:
entheogenic-gnosis said:
It it was myself personally, I would by a sample of both.

As far as buying "powdered" ethnobotanicals, I will never do this, it's far too easy for "saw dust" or other forms of "cut" to be slipped into the product without your knowledge, I'm not sure if there is evidence that this actually happens, but being a wary consumer means the possibility that it could occur means it's something to remain mindful of.

What if I buy a sample of each type of whole seed,

and then

do a bufo extraction on both the powdered cebil as well as on a similar weight of whole cebil (accounting for the weight of the hulls after de-hulling)to compare yields......this way the potential crud would be left out, and if the bufor yields are comparable, I could at least use the far cheaper powdered cebil for extractions rather than snuff powder...

For sure, your plan so far seems reasonable. I would buy a sample of each whole seed for sure, as for the powder, that's your call.

While I know how to extract from these seeds, I have never personally preformed the procedure, so I could tell you how it's done, but as far as the advice that only comes from experience, there's not much I can do there...

This thread has piqued my is interest, and acquiring some samples for experimentation seems like the next logical step, I feel like I should have experience in this area, as a tryptamine/phenethylamine researcher and an organic chemistry student and enthusiast, it only seems reasonable.

I can post the technical workups available for anadenanthera seed extraction if you feel it may be helpful.


-eg
 
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