Wew here we go, sorry I could not use lesser words
1, 2, 3 and 4 exactly as I thought :thumb_up:
I've not done 1 and 2 because my stuff was so clean already, so jumped to 3 and 4 with my pan-method because I focused on the fact if only that (3 & 4) would work for me at least.
But to be able to poor something liquid off in 4 then it must have at least some liquid to poor off, so that's why I went for 25ml demin water on 1.000 gr material (precision scaled), that according to your experiment, Burnt, Hazenfratz should crystallize.
But Houston we have a problem.
After 24 hours in the fridge all I got was this, see picture, the glass is still fogged due taking it out of the cold.
I pored the liquid off (straight without filtering so no volume loss) and got 20 ml, so 5 ml was evaporated.
I have now
double the concentration of the aforementioned solubility limits (1:40) so all should have been crystallized. I don't know why this did not work. A too low concentration is now absolute out of the question, and I should not use lesser water to make it worth because else step 4 would be not workable as a true filtering step.
How much liquid in total do you use on how much material? So we can compare the concentrations used during the cooling stage.
I already got a hint at 10 ml, see picture again in previous post, that tiny amount of liquid that had not crystallized was way to dark (meaning full of non crystallized stuff) for my liking.
I had the intuition that this would happen, but now I see it happening, and now you also might understand why I was calling "impossible" in my first reactions to your suggested method. Now I am puzzled even more because you and the other sources you mentioned point in the direction that it should be possible. Mindlusion also mentioned it is very soluble in cold water which I see now confirmed.
I see only 2 ways from here:
1) burnt's mentioned 1:40 rule was about Harmine, I have crude Rue harmalaHCL that is like roughly estimated 50% harmine. Maybe the other 50% (mainly harmaline) doesn't follow the rules? Do you have success with crude HCl extract, meaning non separated (harmine/harmaline) harmala's?
2) as I've mentioned before in the VDS thread, it could be just as well salt retention from the manske that turns the multiple following crystallization processes into a semi-overlooked manske effect, making it crystallize in cold. My stuff however was centrifuged which makes the salt contamination very low, plus the fact that I do not work with saturated salt but just 15 - 18 gr/100ml in the (final) manske, which prevents potential salt contamination by 50% compared to using saturated salt.
I know you do not follow the likelihood of salt retention on many passes, but what can I make of all this?
I feel a bit blind about what happened, I only have guesses.
Now for me you understand I feel not much motivation to carry on with this tech
There's one thing I might check, that is I have Harmine (I suppose its like 90% or better in purity) and see how that behaves. It's FB so I would first make some HCL's of it and proceed same experiment with. Just to see how it compares to crude rue extract. But I feel a little dulled for the moment I think you can guess. Even if that works a little better, it likely is not enough to drag me over the line to really use it tek wise.
All thoughts very welcome.
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PS.1: people who perform multiple manskes usually have a standard like using e.g. 20gr/100ml or whatever, but forget about the salt retention they keep carrying along, making their true salt levels a notch higher than thought. In my case this never happens as I stop adding salt on eye sight which makes it very clear when to stop adding, so my potential salt retention from previous step(s) is embedded. I am not against using full saturated in general, but my reasons to trust eye is like I said in previous post and always end like 15 - 18 gr/100ml when afterwards checked on the salt used. I don't suggest to copycat the 15-18 number blindly as acid and especially concentration in the manske plays big role when crystals start to form.
PS.2: there was someone here who followed a Hazenfratz thingy accurately (forgot exactly what tek/steps but iirc a concentration that was way off) and found it complete non workable. Why is a mystery, but just telling.
PS.3: please drool over the wonderful
bokeh porn of last picture, I have a new pic tool Fujifilm X-T2
Guys sell your DSLR's while you can, mirrorless is on the move.
PS.4: maybe this thread belongs better in the Harmala section? To be moved?