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I left a Buddhist community and now can't find any meaning in life

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Tara123

Rising Star
Up until 5 months ago I lived in a Buddhist community based on gelug Tibetan tradition. I was heavily indoctrinated, which wasn't really a bad thing because I was super happy. Nothing else really mattered to me other than the pursuit of enlightenment and the words of my guru. But then I had this awful spiritual crisis where I started to question everything and a deep depression started to set in. I walked out and found myself living back in my home town with my alcoholic dad. When this happened I literally felt like I was shifting into a different dimension and it was awful. I've suffered physical pain and a deep depression ever since. I've tried to piece back together an 'ordinary' life (job, friends etc) but nothing seems to mean anything. Its like I'm just going through the motions and am dead inside. I found out about psychedelics shortly after I left and thought that these may help me to lift the depression and make sense of my experience. I've only tried 2x 3g mushroom trips so far and they have both been incredibly beautiful experiences (I cried for the entire duration of the second trip) but I've had no change in my mindset of basically just feeling empty. And now I'm getting desperate. I was going to increase my dosage to 5g but I am questioning whether this is something that can even help me at all, or will it make things worse. I am wondering whether I would be better to return to the community and not seek my own answers via psychedelics. But there is something inside me that is pushing back against this, maybe it is pride in admitting I was wrong for having left. I've struggled with depression my whole adult life and the reason why I became a Buddhist in the first place was because it was the only thing that gave me any peace. And then I went and rejected that peace completely. I can't really believe that I've found myself in this situation and its not something most people can help me with. I've found a lot of comfort in this forum as I feel like people here actually understand spiritual matters and have insight that can't be found elsewhere.

I'm worried that I will never feel any joy again in life.

If anyone has any ideas on what I should do next or how I can ease my depression I would be very grateful.
 
Your post here caught me right before bedtime, sifting through the forums one last time for the night... it tugged at my heartstrings, but I'm not going to be all mushy, rainbows and unicorns about it Tara.

Living a lifetime as a human being in this particular realm of existence is not easy, in fact it is brutal and full of sorrow. There is no getting around that.

The best that one can really do is to find a pattern of living (out of the myriad options granted us by the Nature of the Universe) that creates a feeling deep within us that all the suffering we experience is somehow worthwhile.

This is no easy task ime.

It takes courage, it takes willpower, it takes an ever-present desire to be a better human all the time.

This Path is not for the faint of heart nor the easily distracted.

As human beings, our primary duty is to literally CREATE MEANING out of the brutal chaos that this realm implicitly engenders every nanosecond of eternity.

Again, no easy task whatsoever.

This Path begins with getting rid of external and internal clutter (by organizing and cleaning) your immediate surroundings and the things that you can somewhat control, like your own self and your personal space. Letting go of things, yes, but most importantly letting go of no-longer-useful emotional patterns that recreate the same triggered, looped, behavioral patterns we so desperately cling to because we can't seem to find any other meaning in our lives besides the never-ending drama that our egotistical minds prefer to create (thus engendering even more of the brutality and chaos that we're supposedly trying to remedy).

THERE IS deeper meaning within us. Not to sound like a broken record, but it is not easily accessed without a lot of self-sacrifice (literally) and determination. Psychedelics can, possibly, help in the quest, but they are not panaceas at all. In fact, they have the power to throw you off the sanity cliff into deep delusion and confusion. That does not necessarily mean that they are not useful. Psychedelics are very powerful tools that should never be taken lightly.

I hope that this helps you in some small way.

May you find your Peace
 
Doc Buxin said:
...CREATE MEANING out of the brutal chaos...
I like this one Doc :thumb_up:

Seeing the chaos of life as a painter palette and we are the painter, it's up to you from here.
Where is happiness? Where is enlightenment? Where is purpose? These are strange questions like a painter standing before a white canvas with the palette in his hand and asking: "Where is my darn painting?"

Booby trap for the mind: I need more colors on my palette then I'm set, a bit like I need more money then I'll be happy. What works way better than assets is inspiration what to do with it what you have. Some people make art with just one tone. Trial and error and re-try.

Somehow we are thrown into it.
My little cognition cannot grasp it, like I cannot understand how I make a legion of body cells each day, yet I do.
While we can calculate it's behavior finely we still don't know what electricity or gravity is, brave are the scientists.
I give in to my un-knowing, it is all "alien" to my personal me/ego.
So here I am without the big picture with my questions.
Now, are we going to "paint" something today while we don't know?
Study, work, social time, sport, ... there's sometimes too many colors on my palette 😁
:love:
 
I can definitely understand that coming form a community with a fixed orientation on spiritual discipline and practice can result in a rough landing back here in the core of organized confusion.

At least know that you're not alone in this. There are many of us that go through that each and every day and, at the end of such days, the experience is what should be taken into acount mostly. Or with what i've learned today, tomorrow i'll do better. I constantly say that to myself when things get challenging and, to some extent, it works, the next day i'm more prepared to accept and understand the world.

What also works is, as the nexians before me stated, gaining some form of perspective after which setting purpose definitely becomes a lot more clear.

I definitely can't recommend enough of the activities that provide noursihment for the mind and body, and basically anything that can keep you distracted and help you steer away from more negative habits of the mind/ego. It is well known that altering brain chemistry with various types of serotonin (and not only) inducing workouts can be very very beneficial (also addictive, but not a bad thing)..buh' bye depression. These can be done anywhere you feel comfortable, indoors as well as outdoors. I'd recommend being outdoors as much as possible while it's the warm season.. the sun helps a lot. Definitely try, as much as possible, to have a clean and responsible lifestyle.

Ultimately i do recommend to hold on to your beliefs, lessons learned, past experiences and maybe use your wisdom to help and heal any possible wounds and lack of communication between you and your family? It could be worth to try at least, if you haven't already.

On a different note, i would say that some entheogen work might help, though patience is required because changes will not come in an instant. Just remember that these tools help, they are great initiators. What they aren't though, they're not wonder cure all medicine. So try to live them and enjoy them without expectation. In time they will reveal to you exactly that which you need.
 
Friend, find a way to be of service to others. Everyone always suggest the feed -the-homeless thing, but there are so many volunteer opportunities out there that if you look you can find something you are passionate in and do it.

So many of the elders in my country sit at home alone all day with nobody to share wisdom with, there are people with special needs you may find have more in their mind than you ever conceived of.

Finding similarities helps place us within a larger matrix of society and even if we sleep alone we can feel belonging on a deep level. I used to think such a feeling was impossible but i live within it all day every day. Service rescued my Love from oblivion.

Seeing results in another human beings countenance or words will, i promise you as sincerely as I'm capable, start giving you the meaning you miss.

The search for God seems to end at our heart.
 
In it's raw essence, Buddhism is very different from other spiritual philosophies. But in the way it's being practiced, it very often is not. And what I mean with that, is that all the current forms of Buddhism, are full of dogmas and superstition, just as much as Christianity, Hinduism or Islam.
While the whole idea of Buddhism, is about letting go of all that bullshit. The irony is even, that the higher up in the hierarchy of any particular Buddhist cult, the average Buddhist tends to be, the more they tend to care about all the dogmas, the superstition, and the externals and appearances.
The clothing, the hierarchy itself, the rituals, the gender or ethnic background of people...
They have become the central aspects of Buddhist practice, in most of Asia.
Most of the budhists in Asia don't even meditate.

No wonder that, if you devoted your life to a philosophy that is all about seeing through ego-related stuff, you've become dessilusioned with a practice that is all about ego and self-importance.

About psychedelics I can tell you this: it is utterly useless to try to have the same revelations twice. They have given you something. So they cannot give you the same thing,yet again.
Before taking any psychedelic substance again, it is time to integrate your previous experiences first.
You have to fully embrace what's been given to you, including all the uncomfortable aspects of it.
Embrace the struggle it takes to integrate these experiences, just as much as you'd want to embrace the beauty and bliss of it.

And if I'm correct, someone here recommended to take st John's worth instead of tryptophan, in another thread. That could definitely help. But it is a real medicine and not a placebo, and therefore should be taken with caution: side-effects do occur, and even allergic responses, and it isn't safe to combine with other anti-depressants and a whole lot of drugs. But it is definitely proven to be effective.

Physical activity also helps against depression. Especially walking.
 
Accept everything in your life as it is right now. That is the first step out of depression. Accept all your decisions and try and make some peace with it all. Easier said than done I know, but it is needed. When you can accept the misery in your life you can move forward without taking it all with you. Don't carry around the burdens you have, place them down. Then move forward. Go to where you feel you will find contentment but realize you can be content right where you are now if you choose.

You have many choices facing you right now. Just make one choice at a time. Go to where your heart is guiding you. All this will pass in time. I hope one day you look back at your struggles and find some pride in how you overcame them. This is an opportunity for growth.

I think it's great that you chose to put this all out there and ask for help. I think that is pretty awesome to be honest! There are so many genuinely beautiful people here on the nexus who can offer some great advice and words of encouragement. Focus on that for now!

I wish you the best of luck along your path. Everything will be alright!!


Namaste my friend!!
 
I'm in the same boat, OP. I spent almost my entire young adult life alone and plundering the deeps of a near-perfect solitude. Keeping in contact with no one, just drifting. Creating an oasis of mar within myself... Don't know what you'd call that exactly but it's something somewhat analogous to abstaining for years in the mountains. Half of it spent homeless, yet quite content within, simply amassing depth, soul.

Now that I am approaching thirty it's grown apparent that I still have a lot of other areas that need working on which I skipped out on. Things like building friendships and most anything else you might imagine which is commonly associated with adult life. I don't know if it's for me, but I have to try.. because my body is getting older, less springy, less infallible. I am beginning to feel the need for those things, in many ways for the first time ever. My guess is that it's time to leave the mountains and challenge myself in ways that did not feel pertinent before, were not absolutely necessary before.

Good luck.
 
If I may ask, what set off the spiritual crisis, and gave birth to the questions that troubled you?

You have been given some good replies and distilling down the key messages would be a good exercise. As others have said, and Buddhism at some level concurs with, is the unescapable fact of this existence that suffering is an intrinsic part of the package. Establishing meaning in the maelstrom is an ongoing work in progress- the key word being "work" ie consistent and sustained effort, the absence of which is in effect regression, rather than simple stagnation. And this meaning is a personal thing with general considerations but specific finer details which apply to any individual.

Be light- don't weigh yourself down with attaching to the negatives, and feeding them. Have compassion for yourself and recognise that the questions plaguing you prove you live as a sentient being, whose perspective is malleable, with the right work.

Be stoic-expect bullshit from others and life, because this is what reality delivers. The wish for it to be otherwise is both at variance and in conflict with "how it is", and one can choose the friction which comes, or glide with it.

Be disengaged-seek the stillness that Buddhism as a psychological technique for mastery of ones emotions values so highly.

Psychedelics are simply an adjunct to this work and can embellish the efforts made but as powerful tools with a myriad of outcomes cannot really be a replacement for the "work of living" that is required. Where they are of value is allowing one to observe the mechanistic nature of the process of Input-Processing-Output that our brains are designed so aptly to perform, and realising that change is achievable with effort. It will always be a work in progress and the notion that a state of permanent enlightenment can be arrived at (for most of us) is most likely a fallacy, the pursuit of which can bring its own burdens.

Lastly, do not be afraid or reluctant to seek medical help if needed.

Good luck!
 
Tara, You have also experienced happiness and love.

You need to trust God.

**I'm worried that I will never feel any joy again in life.

You don't know what's going to happen Tara. You're worried about your imagination.


Fear or love?

You decide.
 
corpus callosum said:
If I may ask, what set off the spiritual crisis, and gave birth to the questions that troubled you?

I think the thing that started it was the Buddhist explanation of rebirth and karma. It seemed too simplistic an explanation and I needed to question it and consider different ideas and really thrash these things out as concepts, but I didn't feel I was doing that properly with the people in my community. I was just being lazy, not really questioning the teachings, succumbing to social pressure of fitting in with the group and enjoying what was basically a pretty wonderful living arrangement.

I did a good job of ignoring this for several years. But then a very good friend of mine from within the community started to rock the boat in a big way and I could see how people were responding really negatively to their accepted 'truths' being challenged and I just knew that this couldn't be right. The doubt started to grow and I knew I could do as I had done before, bury it, but I purposely let it continue this time, even though I knew it would lead to chaos. I kept thinking 'if you're gonna jump you have to jump now'.

Its not that I think the teachings are wrong. I also don't necessarily disagree with 'belonging' to a religion. Some people in my community were doing a better job than me. But there were also many like me, not really questioning things properly and not able to consider other ideas without their faith collapsing.

I didn't know where this path would lead me and I was really frightened on leaving the group, and rightly so because the time since then has been really hard, as you can see from my post above.

This way of doing things, creating meaning, doing the work of living, feels even harder because i'm just so used to having the path laid out so beautifully for me. But I can see how perseverance here will bring good things, it already has! On my good days I can see that really clearly.

Thanks so much everyone for the really good advice. I feel like I need to read these responses over and over and really take them to heart.

With love :love:
 
Hi Tara,

There have been some good insights in this thread, but I just wanted to add my own perspective. I too have struggled with depression and a long-held existential/spiritual preoccupation.

First of all, I think there are a variety of different kinds of depression, stemming from a variety of things. These can range from issues with self-appearance, loneliness (or lack of community engagement), problems with brain chemistry, trauma, having a neurotic/melancholic personality, not taking care of the body, etc. To me, it seems like your primary concern is that you can't find a reason to exist in this world. You can find no meaning, an existential problem. That said, you should reflect if there are any other catalysts, because addressing some will often sooth the others. As others have said, make sure you're looking after your body and diet. Those two aspects are the easiest to remedy, and they have a huge influence on mood. Make sure you exercise and eat good food.

No one can give you a reason to live, a way to find meaning and fulfillment, but you can evaluate what is lacking. You mention you struggle enjoy work and community. But have you asked yourself if they are the best fit of work and community for you? Most people find work bearable for one or more of three reasons: Their work engages them with their community, their work allows them the funds to pursue their real passion, or their work is their real passion. Can you find work which will fulfil one of the criteria? Many people work solely to provide for their children/family, the ultimate form of community. Do you want to have a family one day? Many people find having children as the ultimate source of meaning. Is there a community with which you identify or would like to, or is there a group of people you would enjoy helping? If so, you might benefit from making engagement with this type of employment your primary goal.

If you can't now think of a community, then ask yourself what type of thing do you most enjoy doing? You should attempt to match your favourite types of actions to your employment. Do you most enjoy working with your hands? Then do something with your hands for work. Are you most happy when helping people with problems? Then maybe social work would fulfill you. Are you highly intellectually obsessed? Perhaps academia. Creative? Then find a creative job, or bear a job solely so you can fund your creative endeavour. What types of problems do you most like to solve? Are they spatial problems, organizational, creative, logical, personal, emotional, or something else? Your job and your community should be tied to one another, but also, ideally, to the types of activities you find enjoyable. People generally feel best about their work when they feel they are helping a community they are a part of and value. For some people, that community is simply comprised of the people in their workplace. For others, it will be much harder. You might have to seek an employment lifestyle which will make you feel communally involved. For me, I know I would like to have a family and I would like to fund my creative pursuits which probably won't be profitible financially, so that is enough reason to work. However, I've spent enough time working jobs I felt were meaningless and dull to know I need to do something which engages my interests. I'm only really satisfied when reading and writing and engaging intellectually, so I decided to go back to university in order to pursue a career in academic research. That's my goal.

Goals are important. If you can think of anything which might solve these issues, you should make that your primary goal, and this goal will give some sort of structure and meaning to your life in itself. If you can't for the life of you think of any worthwhile job or community, then you should make the search for them your primary goal. The search for meaning is what Albert Camus viewed asbeing at the heart of meaning itself, the fight against nihilism. To get a little bit spiritual, if you investigate the world, take in everything it has to offer, explore it to find yourself, you'll see the universe constantly unravelling the grandiosity of its sheer existence before you. Experience of existence is a gift we might only possess for a lifetime. Take the time to do many different things, talk to many different people, travel, in order to find your own personal meaning. Just don't be stagnant. If you need to get away from people to find a new community, do it. Be open. If you find your job completely unengaging and numbing, either find a way to make it better or leave it. Find a more fulfilling job/community ASAP, before it becomes more difficult (although its never too late). You don't have to fit in to mainstream society, but you can if you want.

On the matter of psychedelics for treating depression/existential crisis, it can be hit or miss. Some people report having all their problems being fixed by psychedelics, for others, it seems to have the opposite effect, opening their worldview up to negative aspects of existence which they previously hadn't perceived. Most people are somewhere in the middle. In my experience, I don't feel like psychedelics have ever had a lasting effect on treating my depression and existential dread. My first DMT experience did, however, seem to cure me of my lifelong preoccupation and fear of death. You might consider microdosing psilocybin mushrooms. Many people seem to report positive results with doing so.

If you do try a larger dose of a psychedelic, you might want to try meditating on some of these issues before you go into the experience (in a safe place, with set and setting in mind, of course). But psychedelics tend to take you in places you weren't anticipating anyway. I tend to find that most hallucinogens open me up to far more questions, without providing me the answers. The answers are for me to work towards myself. But sometimes those questions are exactly what is needed. You can't find the right answer without the right question. On the other hand, freebase DMT seems to provide me with answers to questions which I couldn't have even fathomed, but in a way that doesn't necessarily translate into everyday life and the search for meaning.

My only other advice is to read widely: fiction, philosophy, non-fiction, whatever, on many different topics and from many different perspectives. But that might just be the biased opinion of a book-worm.

I wish you all the best.
 
There is not much I can add to all the good advice but I have found walking to be helpful. In nature you can work through things on long walks, see the beauty, maybe wildlife and plants and tiring yourself helps with sleeping well plus the exercise is good. Also, you still have meditation skills, yes? so even if you don't believe some aspects of that faith you still have a useful ability. You mentioned your dad,caring for people who are ill is one of the greatest challenges in life, it is a mark of our humanity but to be able to care for someone you must also care for yourself. You do matter,an individual person is at the same time the least and the most significant in the universe...you are unique!
 
I don't want to get gushy, but I can't thank you all enough for this beautiful set of responses. It's helped me a lot and given me some things to work on.
 
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