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Immense Interest in DMT for years, but I have an awful amount of apprehension in experiencing it

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lucid

Rising Star
I have been borderline obsessed with DMT ever since I read The Spirit Molecule. The implications were fascinating and I researched all I could on it and read all of the trip reports I could on erowid. The fact that it exists in all of us and is likely to be released upon extremely traumatic experiences, like death, etc floored me. I won't go into the details simply because I'm positive everyone else here is well aware of all of this or they wouldn't be here...

My experiences with mushrooms have been difficult. I've tried it 2 times and both times had a difficult time on them. I only took a gram each time. I just remember having thoughts like 'why did I do this to myself' and 'will this end' etc. I don't think I'm good at completely letting go (control). I really want to be able to handle mushrooms and eventually DMT, but I wonder sometimes if I'm just the type that can't take it.

I am scared to try it again because I think if nothing else, being so worried about it will come up one way or another no matter how I prepare to take it again.

I am intellectually fascinated about DMT, but trying it for myself is completely different. I know there is the potential to have a bad 'trip' , while fairly rare, but I want to understand this more from a community of people who have tried it.

Part of me feels like there is too much shit going on in my head to be able to handle shrooms/DMT , or perhaps somethings just not right with me and it brings it out. I feel this is extremely important, and I want to be able to reap all of the benefits of this incredible chemical, and I suppose I will one day regardless if I want to or not (even more reason to get it right now).

Anyone have any ideas to allow me to enjoy psychedelics. I am genuinely interested and not looking to 'get fucked up'. I would really love to work through it, and to me it makes sense to get over my issues with mushrooms first, but I'm curious what others think about this.

Thanks for any help!
 
DMT is a little easier to work with in that the duration is shorter and the dose can be more controlled, as opposed to mushrooms.
The mushroom is a tough teacher so I wouldn't get too down on yourself but there will be many similar feelings, so you should try to overcome these negative feelings.
Ultimately, you are the only one who can answer your question and master your thoughts and feelings.
If your intentions are true then you will be lead to where you seek.
 
"why did I do this" -that one's a classic. My first trips were from shrooms, and at first I just simply wasn't ready to embrace it. A couple of years from those experiences I tried mushrooms again, I felt the time was right, and it was, the experiences I had were so different to the previous times, just amazing. I certainly find mushrooms to be special, they offer me so much varied doors. Unfortunately, I can't get hold of them anymore.

I'd suggest taking small amounts of mushrooms and learn to just simply relax with some carefully selected music to assist you in focusing on your fears of letting go. Maybe do this once a week for a while in prep for DMT or ayahuasca.
Work-out, go running or something, train as you would to face your biggest fear.

I've only ever had one really bad experience on psychedellics, and that one was seriously not enjoyable. Very hard work. A couple of years later I went back with the intention of conquering it and reaping it's benefits, which I did, and did well. I love the sense of victory over fears, and the freedom in new space.


Just go for it man, own what's owning you, that fear. You won't regret it!


Peace
 
You read the spirit molecule? do you remember the part where rick talked about meditation methods? how he was taught to "just sit" "just lye" "just breathe" i suppose its a good way to calm yourself down. ive been meditating alot lately i find its really good for calming you both physically and mentally. before a trip just sit somewhere in a comfortable position. clear all thought from your mind the only though that should be inside your mind is the sound of your breathing in-------out in-------out. dont think any words just concentrate on the sound of your breathing. let the substance control you then ask a question.

also, music might help calm you. try listening to this:
meditate experiment enjoy
 
The dreamer found LSD and shrooms to be scary so shied away after a few trys many years ago, but has found he loves spice and has never had a bad time. It can feel freaky but he thinks it is actually more manageable than the more popular psychs. Project love, surrender, and you should be fine.

Check the new FAQ (is this in the Wiki?) for sound advice on 'perfect' set and setting :)
 
Love and Surrender help me calm the pre-flight anxiety and truly enjoy the trip. I try to focus on Love or another similar emotion/state of being. As long as you are willing to surrender yourself to the spice and accept whatever it shows you, wherever it takes you, you will do just fine. Mushrooms are a tougher teacher, especially as a result of the duration, but the sense of age, knowledge, and connectedness, along with the feeling of being recharged post-trip make them invaluable, imo.
 
Thank you for the responses...

I am just trying to wrestle with this concept of an alien intelligence being accessible during a DMT trip. Not so much if that happens or not, because I'm open to this possibility, but more the implications of what that means.

Does this mean that they are always able to watch/observe/interact with our everyday lives? While many at first might answer "Of course", I'd like to know why many times, reading trip reports both in The Spirit Molecule and erowid, they (the entities) seem to be rushed. Is the only way they can interact with us is when we use DMT?

If so, what does this mean?

Also, in regards to an afterlife... If we are able to experience DMT now and enter this other realm, but eventually it is over and we return, then what does this say about death. I assume on death we experience a very strong rush of DMT and have a very profound experience where time and space are completely altered, but that DMT trip does come to an end. And what after that? I'm anticipating answers like "We become part of everything, even if our individual consciousness ends", but does this really constitute an afterlife? I'd love to hear your thoughts on this and I'm sorry if my question doesn't get to the root of what I'm saying, but its hard to break my thoughts down into intelligible questions.
 
lucid said:
I am just trying to wrestle with this concept of an alien intelligence being accessible during a DMT trip. Not so much if that happens or not, because I'm open to this possibility, but more the implications of what that means.
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Yea, I'm right there with you. To my mind, this is why integration is always a very intriguing process. The alien presence itself carries so many implications, many of which are made apparent in hyperspace, some of which remain after returning. It has rocked my conception of what it means to be human, alive, or conscious, to say the very least.

Does this mean that they are always able to watch/observe/interact with our everyday lives? While many at first might answer "Of course", I'd like to know why many times, reading trip reports both in The Spirit Molecule and erowid, they (the entities) seem to be rushed. Is the only way they can interact with us is when we use DMT?

If so, what does this mean?
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No clue, but it could mean that our brains are naturally able to contact these creatures and that DMT is the chemical that allows our brains to function as such, it could be that we were created by an alien race and DMT is the means they left us to contact them, or it could be, as burnt states, merely the result of our perception of chemical processes (a large imabalance, i guess in this case) in the brain. I think, if you were to accept the oft debated statement about DMT playing a role in dreaming as truth, you could spin out a whole host of theories just on that alone. Spice is so fascinating in part because it's so far outside of understanding in the classical, Western (post-modern), dualistic sense.

Although this raises the question that has haunted me since reading The Spirit Molecule: Why does the brain actively transport DMT across the blood-brain barrier? Why is this the second most sought out molecule behind glucose?

Also, in regards to an afterlife... If we are able to experience DMT now and enter this other realm, but eventually it is over and we return, then what does this say about death. I assume on death we experience a very strong rush of DMT and have a very profound experience where time and space are completely altered, but that DMT trip does come to an end. And what after that?
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Well, DMT could be the bridge, allowing your consciousness to transcend the body and join whatever you want to call allness or it could be something completely different. As to what after that...well :) if we knew that, wouldn't it spoil the surprise? 😉
 
Well, Swim got the feeling, that earthly existence is NOT T H E Existence but a part of existence if that makes sense. Time seems to be part of this experience we're having but it doesn't appear to be a concept of general order when it comes to "life"....
 
Lucid,

I wouldn't go into this with the expectation that any real answers await you. Rather, the experience tends to multiply the questions and humble the seeker with the realization that answers are subjective, arbitrary and beyond comprehension. Don't place too much stock in the experiences and interpretations of others either - and that includes Strassman's. He's just one more individual trying to make sense of the nonsensical. The whole pineal production thing is only conjecture - nothing more. The truth is that without the benefit of actually dying, nobody knows where we go.

I also have to say, contrary to others' opinions here, that the freebase DMT experience (IMO) is WAAAAAAY beyond that of low dose mushrooms, and a much more challenging ordeal overall than most if not all other psychedelics. It can be be blissfully euphoric or it can be utterly terrifying. Sometimes it's both all at once. But talk about the "I wish I hadn't done this" feeling. Imagine the most alien feeling you've ever encountered jumping on top of you like a rabid monkey before you've even exhaled your first hit... and you've still got a couple more to go before you even launch. It's a lot to handle, brief as it is. Take it slow and with great respect.
 
PerPLexeD had his own horrid shroom trip which started off with him tripping 10 minutes after dosing, and having chaos begin to flood the world wherever he went. He ended up laying on his bathroom floor crying for a good 1-2 hours, completely scared. He got stuck in infinite thought of "Its turning on me. This is them turning on me." He spent his entire peak trying to wake up from this dream. He is still very scared, but knew that this trip had moreso to do with other things in his life that were supposed to him, as opposed to what the substance itself had instore for him. He is so in love with psychadelics, but refuses them on a regular basis as he realizes it isn't always the right time to do it. He enjoys sitting in complete darkness, with music, and himself. If comfortable, a companion is more than welcome to join, but that companion must be 100% on the same page. At first, he feels resistance to the music. He enjoys it, but it isn't on the same frequency as him. He breathes, and meditates(switches between few different styles). To the point where his body has no more suffering, battling of sorts, mind cleared and opened(he is open-minded to the nth extent naturally, meditation takes one into a new level = it is a requirement, unless there are other factors getting one into such a relaxed and opened state). He is now dancing, flowing with the music, feeling the notes rushing through is body, thoughts become much more visual and clear. Once PerPLExeD is at this state, he is more than ready(while still respecting and not underestimating) the substance he is about to consume. If one is planning on going to a higher level of conscious, they must first clear a path so they do not stumble and fall.
PerPLexED
 
Imagine the most alien feeling you've ever encountered jumping on top of you like a rabid monkey before you've even exhaled your first hit...
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My friend never had this feeling. It's always a tingling sensation in the head and then the patterns start creeping up. Yes, it feels different than ordinary reality...but "the most alien feeling"?
 
Hey lucid, i guess that's your problem, your fear of letting go, fear of losing control.

Especially on mushrooms you shouldn't take low doses imho, just take a decent dose, not too low, it's best to take just a touch more then you think is enough, at least a full dose, you don't wanna just hang there on the doortep of the trip for hours, out there in the cold, while you could just aswell come in there, in the warm, colourfull environment mushrooms have to offer.

I used to be cautious too in the beginning untill i realized it's not meant to be half there, you have the choice, go for it completely, or don't, not going half for it, that won't work with mushrooms, you can do that with LSD, even with DMT, but not with mushrooms imo, they only get you confused, when you upper the dose, the real magic reveals itself, while it was kept hidden in the shadows before. :p


Don't be affraid of DMT though, if you start with a small amount you will notice that it's really not that frightening at all, i've read many stories of earth shattering experiences, but i myself had only blissful experiences with it, nothing dramatic, no entities, i guess it differs from person to person, or maybe i'm not doing enough, wich will probably be it. :p
 
I have to agree that vaporized DMT is more managable than mushrooms. The duration is the reason. The actualy voyage in hyperspace only lasts 4-7 minutes with a gentle (in comparison) comedown and a wonderfully refreshed feeling afterwords (even after the scary ones).

There is little time for reflection when in hyperspace, little time for the mind to create a bad place. With mushrooms you have hours in which bad thought loops, intense inner strugles, and powerful self exploration can occur. DMT leaves only time to gasp in astonishment and have a few interactions with entities (on occasion)....and it raises many more questions than it answers, that is very true.
 
I have mixed feelings... to me DMT is the most challenging substance and therefore the one I'm most anxious about, the duration is short but sometimes the experience perplexes and dominates my thoughts for months.... that being said, sometimes the effects are quite mild, once all the colours in SWIM's room changed, that was mild, but the alien encounters and archetypal religious experiences, those are difficult to get the hang of personally... they're all different, they're all challenging in different ways, but judging from reading the post, I do think DMT is going to be easier going than mushrooms, SWIM has learned that so much of this is about anxiety and the fear itself, as it's been said, it's all about letting go of fears, SWIM had a great mushroom trip the other night...SWIM likes to use these opportunities to explore fear and anxiety... the thing about DMT is that it tends to overpower fear and anxiety and then you can't help but experience it raw, with acid and shrooms you have to deliberately drop your fear to enjoy it....
 
I would not use mushrooms as an education for what is to be expected of a DMT trip. Mushrooms have taken me to hell and back. Even with a long duration trip like DMT and rue extracted harmalas I have never felt like all is lost. In this situation with mushrooms I always try to find someone to hug and remind myself that it's all in my head and it's just the chemicals talking, to no success. With DMT it's more like "you know what is going on, just commit to the experience and hang on in there.

Also, just because DMT can take you further than any other psychedelic, doesn't mean you can't start out small.
 
I think DMT is basically second to only psilocybin mushrooms..mushrooms can take you the farthest in my opinion(besides salvia but that's sort of a differnt ball park)..most people that have taken real large doses are aware of just how powerful they can be..many people I meet think that LSD is somehow deeper than psilocybin, and then put DMT at the top..but that is because when you take LSD, you are taking whatever dose is in that hit..and with DMT people smoke enough to breakthrough all at once because it is a much shorter and easier trip in my opinion..with mushrooms I know people who never take more than a piece of stem or one little cap..maybe half a gram at a rave or something..for those that dont believe me, allyou need to do is eat a handfull one night in a dark room..I did it once..and never did that again!..3 grams is enough to blow me away..I get so much more out of it than smoking DMT..but I still love spice..

Ayahuasca on the other hand I place beside the mushrooms..but the mushrooms for some reason just vibe with me more than anything else.

Never had a real high dose of cactus so I can't comment of that.

Dont get me wrong, DMT is intense and can scare the shit out of me..but still, mushrooms are top of my list..

I think that smoked DMT in mid level doses is good to prep one for mushrooms and aya in mid level doses, and high dose DMT is good to prep one for a mushroom or aya high dose breakthrough. I have fully broken through with mushrooms, and I was there for like 45 minutes, flying around the solar system, meating ancient beings etc..so much I can only remember fractions of it..I went farther that night than I have ever gone on DMT or anything else other than maybe salvia..

Also, mushrooms are active at lower doses, much more so than DMT..in the way of visions anyway..I can have visions with mushrooms and still be aware of my body and reality somewhat..and so I think lots of people get to that level and stop there, never ever trying a larger dose. But if you keep going it just gets deeper and deeper and deeper...when you breakthrough with mushrooms it's so damn intense, the carrier wave is louder for me than it ever is with DMT, you are held there for longer, the colours are more vibrant etc..With DMT I dont have visions at lower levels, only visuals.. and if I am in the dark, there is barely any visuals at all until I start to breakthrough...I notice that alot..psilocybin seems more prominant in the dark, where with DMT if I want a lower dose I need some light in the room to see the visuals..but with aya it's different..aya I can sit in the dark with just fine.

I think that if psilocybin can be vaporised, which I think it can, it will prove to take one farther in than spice..and be preferred.
 
fractal enchantment said:
....I think that smoked DMT in mid level doses is good to prep one for mushrooms and aya in mid level doses, and high dose DMT is good to prep one for a mushroom or aya high dose breakthrough. I have fully broken through with mushrooms, and I was there for like 45 minutes, flying around the solar system, meating ancient beings etc..so much I can only remember fractions of it..I went farther that night than I have ever gone on DMT or anything else other than maybe salvia..

Also, mushrooms are active at lower doses, much more so than DMT..in the way of visions anyway..I can have visions with mushrooms and still be aware of my body and reality somewhat..and so I think lots of people get to that level and stop there, never ever trying a larger dose. But if you keep going it just gets deeper and deeper and deeper...when you breakthrough with mushrooms it's so damn intense, the carrier wave is louder for me than it ever is with DMT, you are held there for longer, the colours are more vibrant etc..With DMT I dont have visions at lower levels, only visuals.. and if I am in the dark, there is barely any visuals at all until I start to breakthrough...I notice that alot..psilocybin seems more prominant in the dark, where with DMT if I want a lower dose I need some light in the room to see the visuals..but with aya it's different..aya I can sit in the dark with just fine.

I think that if psilocybin can be vaporised, which I think it can, it will prove to take one farther in than spice..and be preferred.
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Interesting post and tells me once again how different we are. I've had huge doses of shrooms but never close to breaking through. And a low dose of DMT is more visual for me than shrooms. But I just love to smoke DMT after peaking on shrooms. Just when I feel I'm starting to come down. Then I'm of course taking about a good shroom trip. I would never dare to smoke DMT while on a bad trip on shrooms.

Maybe I will be able to break through on shrooms only, some day after I've done more DMT breakthroughs. I don't have too many experiences with spice. I need to practice more :)
 
PerPLexED had a low dosage of mushrooms before. Made him all giggly. Would rank it JUST above a cannabis high, a low dose and a full dose are COMPLETELY different so there is no "easing" into it. Agreed with the fact that the more magical stuff comes out with higher dosages >>> less confusion, although peaking does become overwhelming (PerPLXed almost threw up many times from such extravagant things it was so amazing), although not bad at all. Cannabis smoking while on mushrooms is said to allow it be more managable, but perplexed cannot confirm this. He says that a bad trip is only one in which nothing is learned, and much good luck to you.
 
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