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Kash's Advanced LSA Extraction

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Hey everyone.

I've been trying this for about 3 years now, on and off. I'm really hoping someone can help me nail where this may be going wrong.
I've been a fan of these seeds for over 5 years, they've given me many the profound experience when I used to eat them with wine, but I am never doing that to my body again :sick:

I have been successful in following all the steps Kash has laid out, though I get slightly different results at different stages and my yield is always much poorer than their pictures showed.
My result is definitely psychoactive, though VERY faint effects with 35 seeds worth ingested. Colors are vivid, slightly euphoric bodily sensations and mild sedation, though I hardly believe this is a "common" dose's effects.

Over the years I've increased the quality of my glassware and tried to get the best solvents I can get my hands on.

Seeds are absolutely demolished into a dust finer than that of the moon itself.
I am using all the same materials listed, my naphtha consisting of Xylene, Ethyl Benzene and >10% mineral spirits.
I am using concentrated DCM and aqueous ammonia dropwise for the freebase section.
Separation is done through a glass separatory funnel.

Solution fluoresces green throughout the process, getting blue after the DCM / Water separation.
  • After multiple acetone pulls and evap, I am left with a very sticky, horribly oily reddish yellow/brown goo. This goo sticks to my plate, and suspending it fully in the distilled water is near impossible even after adding citric acid. Goo is left stuck to the plate, and I fear there is a lot of LSA left in there, not transferred into the water.
  • This goo under blacklight is slightly green, unsure if that means anything about potential desirables being left behind.
  • The color change when I add the ammonia basically doesn't happen. It's a very VERY slight change to a yellow tinge but nothing very notable. I fear there could be something going wrong here.
I don't know if anyone can help me with this info, but I'm really willing to try and get to the bottom of this, any input is greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

P.S Attached is my recent yield of 100 seeds, it's slightly wet and not fully evapped. Still, as you can see this is much less than what Kash has showed in their yield.

436656439_437927055606112_725101184632416721_n.jpg

(Edge of the dish is a reflection, specs are dust and the stuff outside the dish is shampoo I SWEAR)
 
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PensiveLament said:
Hey everyone.

I've been trying this for about 3 years now, on and off. I'm really hoping someone can help me nail where this may be going wrong.
I've been a fan of these seeds for over 5 years, they've given me many the profound experience when I used to eat them with wine, but I am never doing that to my body again :sick:

I have been successful in following all the steps Kash has laid out, though I get slightly different results at different stages and my yield is always much poorer than their pictures showed.
My result is definitely psychoactive, though VERY faint effects with 35 seeds worth ingested. Colors are vivid, slightly euphoric bodily sensations and mild sedation, though I hardly believe this is a "common" dose's effects.

Over the years I've increased the quality of my glassware and tried to get the best solvents I can get my hands on.

Seeds are absolutely demolished into a dust finer than that of the moon itself.
I am using all the same materials listed, my naphtha consisting of Xylene, Ethyl Benzene and >10% mineral spirits.
I am using concentrated DCM and aqueous ammonia dropwise for the freebase section.
Separation is done through a glass separatory funnel.

Solution fluoresces green throughout the process, getting blue after the DCM / Water separation.
  • After multiple acetone pulls and evap, I am left with a very sticky, horribly oily reddish yellow/brown goo. This goo sticks to my plate, and suspending it fully in the distilled water is near impossible even after adding citric acid. Goo is left stuck to the plate, and I fear there is a lot of LSA left in there, not transferred into the water.
  • This goo under blacklight is slightly green, unsure if that means anything about potential desirables being left behind.
  • The color change when I add the ammonia basically doesn't happen. It's a very VERY slight change to a yellow tinge but nothing very notable. I fear there could be something going wrong here.
I don't know if anyone can help me with this info, but I'm really willing to try and get to the bottom of this, any input is greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

P.S Attached is my recent yield of 100 seeds, it's slightly wet and not fully evapped. Still, as you can see this is much less than what Kash has showed in their yield.

View attachment 98535

(Edge of the dish is a reflection, specs are dust and the stuff outside the dish is shampoo I SWEAR)
Click to expand...
You might want to go easy on that blacklight - it could be eating into your yields. These alkaloids are very light sensitive (if you've ever looked into the lighting recommendations - or, more like, lack of lighting - for LSD synthesis that should give you the picture). Only use UV for the briefest time for confirmation and tracing.

You could also simply have weaker seeds.
 
Transform said:
You might want to go easy on that blacklight - it could be eating into your yields. These alkaloids are very light sensitive (if you've ever looked into the lighting recommendations - or, more like, lack of lighting - for LSD synthesis that should give you the picture). Only use UV for the briefest time for confirmation and tracing.

You could also simply have weaker seeds.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply!

You're right, I am rather enamored with the blacklight at times 😅 Though I keep nearly everything in as little lighting as much as I can.
By the way, do you know if the intensity of the color change at the ammonia stage is indicative of anything?

Transform said:
You could also simply have weaker seeds.
Click to expand...

I hope that is not the case! These things are impossible to find online in my current country of residence.

I will try to use the blacklight much less next time and see if my results are different.

Thank you!
 
Supposedly, you should follow the blue light. Didn't it jump into the nonpolar after adding ammonia? It looks like you've got it, I don't understand what is the issue here.

I second your claim on the very faint effects of a 35 seed extract.
 
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Ruffles said:
Supposedly, you should follow the blue light. Didn't it jump into the nonpolar after adding ammonia? It looks like you've got it, I don't understand what is the issue here.

I second your claim on the very faint effects of a 35 seed extract.
Click to expand...
It did jump, I was thinking that if the color change was not intense of a yellow enough then perhaps some product could be destroyed in some area there (or something along those lines)

Also, I am kinda wondering if there's any way to maximize the amount of desirables from the Brown Goo stage, as I still fear lots of alkaloids may be left over in there and I'm throwing them away.

Kash's original post regarding this, an old archived post where they tried a slightly different method (more so a different order of events), yielded very strong results for them.

I'm really hoping I can increase the potency, as 100 seeds is very expensive.
 
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Your results are nearly identical to mine. I was amazed by the final blue product and disappointed with the effects it produced, but then I have no experience equivalent to compare it to (never ate the seeds) and had too high expectations (LSD). Maybe a courageous large dose will do it with the blue stuff (> 80 seeds extract) or maybe it's not too active orally or sublingual or maybe it could use some MAOi or maybe it's the green stuff that's missing... So many questions.

A defating nonpolar wash on the seed mush before adding the base or freezing the acetone and centrifugjng the fat precipitates out may help to increase extraction efficiency. At least make the final product be less gunky?
 
IME, lysergamide-containing seeds can be a deep and powerful entheogen while still not being comparable with LSD in terms of psychedelic 'bells and whistles'. For me it was much more on the side of plant teacher/inner voice lessons-for-life kind of experience, with the visuals being limited to the fractalisation of everything into interlaced pentagrams, but very little that could match up to the "spewing rainbows everywhere while the walls melt" of LSD.

Of course, with a sample size of one, my anecdotal data isn't worth terribly much; it may also be worthy of note that my one successful excursion with these seeds was a counterpoint to what amounted to something of a preceeding alcoholic binge including consumption of brandy to wash the seeds down. This sort of ties in with the still-controversial, not to mention somewhat tainted, acetaldehyde hypothesis - although I would recommend in vitro combination of the extract with an acetaldehyde-rich beverage (or, very possibly, one with any of various other aldehydes) such as brandy or peppermint tea prior to consumption, rather than relying on the in vivo reaction of the lysergamides with endogenously produced acetaldehyde which is obviously rather hard on the body.
 
Tried the Kash extraction using 99% Ethanol instead of acetone. It works, but too much fat... Well, acetone has the same issue.

So, after drying the ethanol and ressupending the solids in water + fumaric acid, defatting wastes way too much nonpolar solvent. So what helps is to pH up to 7 (using a sodium carbonate saturated solution) and some of the fats drop out of solution, not all of it, but a lot (HBWR soap?) then pH it down to 4 again and defat using non-polar. Then proceed as usual.

Another thing: with a loaded nonpolar solvent (blue or greenish fluor glow), FASA does NOT drop LSA out of solution, but something else does drop out as a pale white precipitate (not sure what it is, no fluor using UV), then the nonpolar (still blue glow) may be dried. Maybe this is a harmless cleanup step. The final product does not taste like fumaric acid, more like any freebase. It has a blue to green to white glow depending on how thick it is. Just like Kash's original tek.

So ethanol works, neutral pH defatting works, FASAing the nonpolar works in reverse dropping out something that is not the target.

(EDIT: on reflection let's hold our judgment here, it does not drop with a blue fluor but I kept the FASA precipitated material for a future bioassay, it tastes like fumaric but not 100% so, it turns black on marquis).
 
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DI
Ruffles said:
Tried the Kash extraction using 99% Ethanol instead of acetone. It works, but too much fat... Well, acetone has the same issue.

So, after drying the ethanol and ressupending the solids in water + fumaric acid, defatting wastes way too much nonpolar solvent. So what helps is to pH up to 7 (using a sodium carbonate saturated solution) and some of the fats drop out of solution, not all of it, but a lot (HBWR soap?) then pH it down to 4 again and defat using non-polar. Then proceed as usual.

Another thing: with a loaded nonpolar solvent (blue or greenish fluor glow), FASA does NOT drop LSA out of solution, but something else does drop out as a pale white precipitate (not sure what it is, no fluor using UV), then the nonpolar (still blue glow) may be dried. Maybe this is a harmless cleanup step. The final product does not taste like fumaric acid, more like any freebase. It has a blue to green to white glow depending on how thick it is. Just like Kash's original tek.

So ethanol works, neutral pH defatting works, FASAing the nonpolar works in reverse dropping out something that is not the target.

(EDIT: on reflection let's hold our judgment here, it does not drop with a blue fluor but I kept the FASA precipitated material for a future bioassay, it tastes like fumaric but not 100% so, it turns black on marquis).
Click to expand...

Did you end up testing this pull and notice any difference in effects/yield versus methods without this cleanup step?

Also, what is "FASA"?
 
PensiveLament said:
Did you end up testing this pull and notice any difference in effects/yield versus methods without this cleanup step?
Click to expand...

I tested about 1/4 of the final blueish liquid extracted with ethanol instead of acetone as described. Two trials, and it was active, for sure. But nothing close to the 12.5 seed equivalent it was supposed to be. A certain euphoria on 0130 hours and an `electric feel`, excellent memory recollection and very talkative. At > 0300 a faint CEV. There was this one moment at 0230 h on the second trial that I felt a wave come on and I had to lie down and chill a bit, and that was a definite psychedelia confirmation, felt very much like that peak or crest of a mushroom trip. Overall a couple of mellow above threshold trips. Coincided with getting a cold on the first and a strep throat on the second trip which made me very paranoid and pareidolic on there being some inflammatory agent on the extract. The FASA derived white powder from the last non-polar step has a taste of fumaric acid, most likely it is exactly that.

Hoping that someone finds an easy way to get the goods out of HBWR on my lifetime!
 
Ruffles said:
I tested about 1/4 of the final blueish liquid extracted with ethanol instead of acetone as described. Two trials, and it was active, for sure. But nothing close to the 12.5 seed equivalent it was supposed to be. A certain euphoria on 0130 hours and an `electric feel`, excellent memory recollection and very talkative. At > 0300 a faint CEV. There was this one moment at 0230 h on the second trial that I felt a wave come on and I had to lie down and chill a bit, and that was a definite psychedelia confirmation, felt very much like that peak or crest of a mushroom trip. Overall a couple of mellow above threshold trips. Coincided with getting a cold on the first and a strep throat on the second trip which made me very paranoid and pareidolic on there being some inflammatory agent on the extract. The FASA derived white powder from the last non-polar step has a taste of fumaric acid, most likely it is exactly that.

Hoping that someone finds an easy way to get the goods out of HBWR on my lifetime!
Click to expand...
Similar to my experiences with the traditional Kash extractions I've performed.

I echo your desires! With the intensity of experience the raw seeds can provide someone, I hope that trimming down the undesirables and maintaining the potency of the active alkaloids can become something the hobbyist can achieve.
 
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