No effect from Ayahuasca

[jivangilad]

I have met a few people complain that they had no psychedelic effect from Ayahuasca, given at proper dosage.
Actually once I gave to my friend. He felt very sick and vomited with no psychedelic effect.
Other two people asked me to give them Ayhuasca. One said that he didn´t feel even physical effect from proper dosage of Ayhuasca, and another that he did feel sick but no psychedelic effect.
So now I am confused. Will it work on them, and how much I should give them.

 

[Jees]

...So now I am confused. Will it work on them, and how much I should give them.

If this confuses you, should you be serving then? An honest question without pun intended.

 

[Final Incarnate]

What kind of Aya did you use ?


Original Aya ( Caapi plus chacruna )

Aya- Rainbow rue style ( Acacia Confusia root bark powder plus, syrian rue extract )

or something else ?

were you or the people using it in a dark room with light max 1900k color temp ? ( like candle light )


a Theory i have is sometimes Aya can be like Creatine, in which it has to "load" b4 you get anything from it. also too is maybe your m8's pineal glands were heavily calcified.

when me or someone else did it, the first time they blasted off ( after a few failed blast offs), they said it felt like a fire cracker went off in their mind, they got a telepathic message of "get ready" 5,4,3,2,1 then boom.

 

[hermes111]

What Jees said. Why do you have to be the person introducing them to Aya? Ask yourself if you are doing it truly for them, or for you.

But to answer the question. Many reasons possible.
Psychotria leaves sold, especially in non specialized shops are usually very low quality. Often requiring at least double the dosage. But don't just try that on others, might end up very badly.

Vomiting too early before any absorption is a likely reason.

Also there's a problem with the traditional method of mixing the plants in one potion. It works just fine in the amazon because it's common practise to take a second or even third cup if the first one didn't work, guaranteeing proper MAO inhibiton. Also they usually use much higher amounts of caapii. They prepare Ayahuasca in bottles, material is plentyful. In the west usually one dose is prepared, if MAO isn't inhibited properly, all of the DMT gets eaten by MAO and is wasted. That's why it's common practise in the west to brew the MAOI and DMT containing plants separately, and drinking the MAOI first and wait a little. Since material is expensive every dose counts.

And sometimes it just doesn't for no apparent reason, even happens to experienced amazonian shamans. Some people think that's because some people are not ready, not meant to do it, or it's just the wrong time.

 

[DmnStr8]

I have been asked a few times to make Ayahuasca for friends. I refused. I am not a shaman. I always state that I can help instruct those interested in making their own. I would have no problem in helping someone create the experience for themselves. They have all been unwilling to create Aya in their lives. That right there says tons about those people and supports my decision to not give them anything.

If someone cannot create this in their own life then they should not partake unless they are with an experienced shaman. I hold the DMT and Ayahuasca experience with reverence. Many things could go wrong. Many changes in the mind can occur. Irreversible in many ways. You can't un-see what you see.

Will Ayahuasca help these people? I am not the one to answer that question. I am my own shaman. That is my path. I choose to have these experiences and create them for myself in my life. I speak my truth quietly and walk my path alone. I do not wish to be followed. I do not wish to influence anyone. I do not wish to be a shaman for someone else.

If you are providing Ayahuasca for these people then I feel you are responsible for what happens to them. Without you, they would not have these experiences. You are walking a fine line. Altering the path of another. From your questions I can make a reasonable assumption that you are not an experienced shaman. Therefor, my advice is to stop providing Ayahuasca for people. I mean this in the most respectful way possible.

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime." ~Maimonides

 

[Sabnock1990]

Ime, separate the plants (the Caapi or Rue, and DMT-containing plant) take the Caapi or Rue first and awhile later take the DMT-containing plant, like 30 minutes or an hour later, sometimes even 15 minutes apart is fine, just gotta find the right timing. Also make sure the dosages are good for both plants. Another factor is digestion, sometimes our digestion can be stuck and not move forward, so getting digestion going is good for helping things kick in, like maybe taking a plant to help get digestion going or eating a little something maybe 20 to 30 minutes after taking the DMT-containing plant. As long as the plants are separated, the dosages and timing are fine, and digestion is moving forward, it'll work. Oh yeah and if you vomit too early it won't work, so try not to vomit until after 2 hours (if i vomit, it's usually close to two hours after ingestion).

 

[jivangilad]

As to those who suggest not to give to others, I can only say that there are no Shamans where I am.
If I wont give them maybe they will not do it or maybe experience it with worse people.
I am not experienced shaman, but I do see it as my responsibility to share what I know with those who seek it.
This is how I feel, and I try to do it as carefully and responsibly as possible.
I try to prepare them much more then others I think.
Besides I don't want to walk my path alone anymore, but share it with others, if they wish to join me.
And I do worn people about the risks before.

Anyway I gave my friend 2.5 gr syrian rue powder. wait about 15-30 minutes and then 2.5 gr mimosa powder.
Should affect most people.
He only felt sick.
I don't think he vomited before 60 minutes.

The other person was given a drink in a dosage which did affect others around but not him.
I think it was traditional Ayahuasca.
The other was given a drink which did affect his friends. I don't know how it was prepared.

So ShamensStamen , you suggest to eat something like a small fruit before? wont it disturb the stomach even more, and make it nasty to vomit?

 

[hermes111]

No offense mate, we didn't mean to be rude. But you do have to know you are playing with fire. Someone might turn insane, someone might die. It is rare but it does happen, and the only one to blame will be you. Let them go to other people or better yet, show them where to get proper information and just look after them. If they do it themselves, and someone has an undiagnosed heart condition or something and doesn't make it, you'll be safe both legally and as far your conscience goes.

It didn't take much to know that you are inexperienced. And you not even knowing what traditional Ayahuasca is and what not makes things even worse.

Besides I don't want to walk my path alone anymore, but share it with others,

That's exactly what I was hinting at. It's not about them and improving their lives, it's about you. Just think about that. If you don't want to go your way alone, that's exactly what the Nexus is for. You can share your experiences with people all over the world here.

And people are much more nicer if you don't endanger other people. Nobody here has something about giving Ayahuasca to other people itself. Not knowing what your doing is the problem. If you knew what you're doing you wouldn't ask these kind of questions.

But do what feels right to you, just be aware that you're taking unnecessary risks.

Much Love .

 

[Jees]

... but I do see it as my responsibility to share what I know with those who seek it...

You can feel responsible for sharing knowledge but that is not the same as taking responsibility beyond your level, nor does this mean that you are responsible for another ones path. It almost sounds like you feel guilty if you didn't? Beware, people take easily advantage of others who feel overly responsible.

I do not know if this is the case, but just check if there is no personal ego hiding behind "I have to do this for them."

Also consider, when an experience goes south for someone particular in whatever way, not seldom the 'provider' gets the blame bullet, no matter how positive the relation was earlier on.

Having that said, things might as well turn out very well for you and friends, it's just you take a gamble of unknown magnitude. Usually people who serve others are far beyond beginners level, not necessarily shaman-ish at all, no need for that per se. If all stay cool, no problem. But 'the scene' is always wary for the next episode in the media of naive people who ended up over their heads, we really don't need another one of those, this is also a responsibility to consider. Do you have a take-on how to deal with heavily freaking out persons? Chances are small, yet it does happen.

Good intentions are not enough when it comes to this. I hope you understand the cautious attitude you encounter here.

In the case it is a big success, consider things might not stop there and soon expand rapidly, words pass words and eventually hit the ears of many people, too many. You have responsibility here towards yourself too, to not end up being the product of your good intentions, eventually before a judge because people talk so fast and easily.

Not to frighten you, not to be negative, but to inform you what really happens out there.

Godspeed with you, blessed be

 

[hermes111]

Much more relatable & down to earth reasoning than I provided, thank you,

 

[skoobysnax]

Perhaps guiding your friends to do more research right here on the nexus beginning here Attitude Page - DMT-Nexus Wiki first and foremost.And this: DMT-Nexus Wiki AND this valuable resource http://www.oht.me/ Reading every word as I did when DMT came into my possession the first time. It's funny that the questionnaire started as an april fools joke but I thought it might be a good idea to actually have to take a harm reduction test before being able to access the teks.

I see no problem agreeing to trip sit your friends after they are adequately educated and everyone agrees to seek medical attention should things go wrong and you are in a clean safe space. The guidelines are out there but I agree with Jees on being aware that word will travel. Sound like you started with a low dose, is this the same that you personally use?

 

[kolorit]

I have met a few people complain that they had no psychedelic effect from Ayahuasca, given at proper dosage.
Actually once I gave to my friend. He felt very sick and vomited with no psychedelic effect.
Other two people asked me to give them Ayhuasca. One said that he didn´t feel even physical effect from proper dosage of Ayhuasca, and another that he did feel sick but no psychedelic effect.
So now I am confused. Will it work on them, and how much I should give them.

If your friends are unresponsive to Ayahuasca, they may also be unresponsive to what you are telling them.

Once, I wanted to take aya with a couple friends of mine, and both of them were taught heavily about the dangers, the precautions and the implications.
As it turned out, one of them had been drinking so much alcohol the day before we wanted to start, that he not only wanted to arrive hours later, but was also pretty hung over.

I simply wanted to know, if he knew that alcohol beforehand was a really bad idea (since I have said it to him a thousand times) and he accused me of delaying "his trip", so I simply cancelled it.

You can't get through to some people, and maybe you shouldnt.
Let them find out on their own

 

[jivangilad]

Thanks you for you advices.
I do have some experience as I have spent five months in Peru with a shaman.
I did take Ayahuasca more then 100 times, and encountered myself with some fricking out conditions.
So I know at least some of the conditions that can happen.
So I am more experienced at least then the people that take with me.
I take with them like a friend, not more then that.
If people can take mushrooms or LSD just with friends, and no guide it can be done with Ayahuasca I assume. Though it is true that Ayahuasca can make you frick out seriously.
And I think I benefited from friends I connected with in trips not less then my experienced shaman.

And I agree, some people just wont listen, and this means that you should not deal with them.

As for now, I did Ayahusca recently with 2 guys, and we were all satisfied.
One of them actually, was pretty lost, and I managed to help him get out of it.
Pretty scary and dangerous obviously.
I plan to do soon with 3 other people.

And yes this is true.
I am taking a serious risk because I feel like this is important for me and for the people I do with.
No contradiction. I will probably need to see where it goes if it goes further.
And since at least I don't take money, I hope I will be less accused. Especially as Ayahuasca is not specifically mentioned in law here.
I think I will treat the guy with normal dosage, and see how it goes.
Obviously things can go wrong.
I actually gave my friend once 1 gr. syrian rue. No mimosa. He got serious panic attack from it.
I will give them first in one session small dosage, and then in another more serious one.

 

[thymamai]

I have brewed aya 3 times now and was only successful the 3rd time around when I ditched caapi for the maoi portion and used rue instead. If you are using caapi and it isn't working I suggest using rue. The whole ordeal is tedious enough as it is, getting down all the liquids and keeping them down long enough for any of the alkaloids to be ingested and not to mention finding the right time and space to get as F'd up as aya will F you up for as long as it does without feeling uncomfortable or embarrassed about it which is the reason why I haven't done it a lot more by now. Hard to find the right context for this stuff.

So anyway I recommend rue over caapi to beginners just because it takes a lot less volume injested to get those mao's inhibited.

Presently about to trade some of my supplies for some lsd because I am living in a communal space and a tab of lsd will be a lot more convenient on a sunday at the beach than brewing all this illegal stuff in their kitchen and worrying about where I'm going to be drinking it so for now kinda off of the aya thing. . . this as a way of stressing the importance of context and whether or not you are ready for it. I have it and haven't used it because I've just not been ready and/or prepared to go through with it for a full on breakthrough.

God, sorry I got a little bit rambly here. Best of luck.

 

[Jees]

...I did take Ayahuasca more then 100 times...

That is something already :thumb_up:

...I am taking a serious risk because I feel like this is important for me and for the people I do with...

"I feel" can have a variety of reasons: intuition, ego playing tricks, a search for confirmation, .....
I hope it's intuition. Yet the word "important" is an indicator for something?? I'm little suspicious about words like that
Anyway, hope your path is guided and free of hassle :thumb_up:

 

[Intezam]

... I gave my friend 2.5 gr syrian rue powder. wait about 15-30 minutes and then 2.5 gr mimosa powder.Should affect most people.He only felt sick.

This powder method does NOT work for most people (it doesn't work for intezam and we have very potent rue and ACRB). No matter how many powder we ingest (veg. gel caps...etc) it doesn't work at all.....

But the same amount boiled with vinegar works: :shock: Haoma!
So the answer is: Boil boil boil boil :thumb_up: (btw:longer boils plus some greens like basil or majoram = may result in moar THH)

 

[jivangilad]

So I gave my friend 2gr. syrian rue, 2 gr. mimosa, drank together.
He did feel it noticeably and was satisfied.
I assume what he felt was realy standard for this dosage. Though he weights actually 90 kg.

 

[Jees]

So I gave my friend 2gr. syrian rue, 2 gr. mimosa, drank together.
He did feel it noticeably and was satisfied.
I assume what he felt was realy standard for this dosage. Though he weights actually 90 kg.

That is a therapeutically dose, wetting the toes, or dipping the chest
Just upping one more gram rue could already double the experience. I'd say to not up mimo before a sufficient level of maoi was reached, which is like 3 to 4 gr rue. Only then start upping mimo. It sounds like you're getting OK with doing all this :thumb_up:

 

[○]

So I gave my friend 2gr. syrian rue, 2 gr. mimosa, drank together.
He did feel it noticeably and was satisfied.
I assume what he felt was realy standard for this dosage. Though he weights actually 90 kg.

That is a therapeutically dose, wetting the toes, or dipping the chest
Just upping one more gram rue could already double the experience. I'd say to not up mimo before a sufficient level of maoi was reached, which is like 3 to 4 gr rue. Only then start upping mimo. It sounds like you're getting OK with doing all this :thumb_up: