I don't think it would matter. I think 95% of the mescaline gets pulled out with the first two limo soaks (as long as you give them 24hrs each and stir often). When I heated my 2nd pull last time I didn't get any more mescaline, but got more goo, so it seems like heating the limo just pulls out more goop.
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Non toxic food safe extraction of mescaline using d-limonene (orange oil)
- Thread starter 69ron
- Start date
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
Anyone had luck distilling, filtering, or otherwise re-using the limonene? Stuff is expensive as hell, but SWIM had a dream about a pot still coming in handy.
antichode
Esteemed member
SuperRad said:
SWIM can confirm this, heating the limo seems to make something else soluble with the acid and water, SWIM tried this to clear emulsions in the past and the emulsions just move into the water.... Better to let time do the work, by the morning any emulsions (if you have any) will be gone.
I always leave my limonene soaks covered in the fridge and it doesn't make the mescaline noticably less soluble and the results are pretty clean.
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
SWIM just heard that the rubber seal on his Ball jars looks much lighter than before he shook a bunch of limonene in it. Whoops.
And god damn, SWIM just informed me that he left the oven on drying his vinegar for 4 hours, and now it looks like flaky rust
Guessing that won't be active at all.
And god damn, SWIM just informed me that he left the oven on drying his vinegar for 4 hours, and now it looks like flaky rust
Guessing that won't be active at all.
antichode
Esteemed member
Touche Guevara said:SWIM just heard that the rubber seal on his Ball jars looks much lighter than before he shook a bunch of limonene in it. Whoops.
And god damn, SWIM just informed me that he left the oven on drying his vinegar for 4 hours, and now it looks like flaky rust
Guessing that won't be active at all.
Yeah limonene seems to destroy a lot of cheap plastics and rubber, swim made the mistake of buying a cheap coffee press the first time round, the limonene just pulled it to pieces.
Your acetate might still be ok, it just depends on how hot you let the oven get. SWIM was under the impression that all Mescaline salts have a reasonably high mp.... Its most likely the other alkaloids have burnt and this might change the overall potency of the acetate, but the mesc should still be fine.
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
SWIM says it was about 200*F for 4 hours. Going to bioassay .15g or so. If it is as potent as the .15 that SWIM tried a few weeks back, this means that a food dehydrator is totally unnecessary, which would be big news I guess.antichode said:Touche Guevara said:SWIM just heard that the rubber seal on his Ball jars looks much lighter than before he shook a bunch of limonene in it. Whoops.
And god damn, SWIM just informed me that he left the oven on drying his vinegar for 4 hours, and now it looks like flaky rust
Guessing that won't be active at all.
Yeah limonene seems to destroy a lot of cheap plastics and rubber, swim made the mistake of buying a cheap coffee press the first time round, the limonene just pulled it to pieces.
Your acetate might still be ok, it just depends on how hot you let the oven get. SWIM was under the impression that all Mescaline salts have a reasonably high mp.... Its most likely the other alkaloids have burnt and this might change the overall potency of the acetate, but the mesc should still be fine.
Oh, and it was p. torch, so no other alks to speak of.
antichode
Esteemed member
Touche Guevara said:
Its probably fine, SWIM doesnt know the mp of acetate but he's pretty sure it would be more than 200*f
Touche Guevara said:
That is not neceesarily the case, Torch just seems to have more mesc compared to the other alks than Pach does. Limonen in particular seems to pull a lot more, plus there is the likeliehood of remnants from the limonene its self staying in the final product that could have burnt.
No it's a big fat cactus full of oils, plant matter and other crazy alks. But it's the easiest to pull pure mesc from.
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
Fair enough, thanks for the clarification. In any case, it can now be said that the decomposition of active alkaloids occurs at some point between 0 and 4 hours in an oven at 200*F :lol:
Kind of unrelated question: if a food dehydrator or dry air is used, does the end product become less sticky? SWIMs is like a warm tootsie roll almost, but it would be cool to use a kif press or something and make little discs for his friends :twisted:
Kind of unrelated question: if a food dehydrator or dry air is used, does the end product become less sticky? SWIMs is like a warm tootsie roll almost, but it would be cool to use a kif press or something and make little discs for his friends :twisted:
damiana
Cosmic Dragon
Good to know!!! SWIM was using a light that got really hot to evap the vinegar faster, not sure what the temp of the vinegar got to though. His product wasn't that strong and he didn't think twice about it. Maybe it broke down. SWIM has a dish of vinegar sitting on a heater that was on for a little while(it never got that hot) but is off now. He will soon find out how potent this stuff is and will consider not using the light anymore if it's more potent. Maybe he will let if evap the slow old fashion way from now on, with patients.
kemist
John
ILPT have been working hard to get an extra cash and try this nice tek with some modifications.
First at all he would like to pre treat his 4-isopropenyl-1-methyl-1-cyclohexene with vinegar and water. Just perfom two-three pulls on limonene before commencing extraction of alks.
Ilpt cannot distill at the moment and heard that some of you guys have had contaminated first pull.
First at all he would like to pre treat his 4-isopropenyl-1-methyl-1-cyclohexene with vinegar and water. Just perfom two-three pulls on limonene before commencing extraction of alks.
Ilpt cannot distill at the moment and heard that some of you guys have had contaminated first pull.
Madcap
illudium Q-36
So... the extract was really inactive after the over baking? I left my first vinegar pull in the oven too long and was left with a super sticky mess that scraped up reddish. I poured some distilled water on it and after it evaped, the pan was scraped and I have powder the same consistency as non overcooked acetate the only difference is that now its red in color.
I put 80mg in my coffee this morning and it seemed to be fairly active. I don't know how long it was over cooked though .... but it certainly is rust-red.
BTW: the reason I poured water on it was that once my GF accidentally spilled water on my evap pan and after I let it dry the area that was exposed scraped up easier and more powdery than other areas of the pan.
I put 80mg in my coffee this morning and it seemed to be fairly active. I don't know how long it was over cooked though .... but it certainly is rust-red.
BTW: the reason I poured water on it was that once my GF accidentally spilled water on my evap pan and after I let it dry the area that was exposed scraped up easier and more powdery than other areas of the pan.
Touche Guevara
Rising Star
SWIM says it was only about 0.1g that was pulled from the used limonene to see if anything was left. It was hard to scrape up, and tended to fly all over the place like rust particles into the air. Used a bit of water to make it easier to collect, took the whole thing, and nada. And this was someone who got minor visuals and incredible body effects from 0.15gMadcapv2 said:
damiana
Cosmic Dragon
^
SWIM tried acetate that was evap with a heating lamp and it was very weak(he thinks the lamp over heated it). This stuff was also rust red. Then SWIM tried, from same cactus different pull, acetate that was evaped using patients and some heat with a heater and it was way more potent. This stuff was much more amber looking with some red. HMMM.
SWIM tried acetate that was evap with a heating lamp and it was very weak(he thinks the lamp over heated it). This stuff was also rust red. Then SWIM tried, from same cactus different pull, acetate that was evaped using patients and some heat with a heater and it was way more potent. This stuff was much more amber looking with some red. HMMM.
When SWIM evaps in a food dehydrator, he notices that the amber waxes tend to reside toward the edge, and that he gets more tan waxes toward the middle. SWIM has tried a mixture of the tan and red with mixed results at high and low doses, but when he tried what was collected specifically of the red, he got weak results at very high doses. SWIM thinks that the red is some sort of inactive or barely active impurity. This is from peruvian, which supposedly doesn't have any significant actives other than mescaline. This is nothing new, as the OP touches on this, as well, but SWIM believes he can confirm it for the most-part.
So far 500mg of tar-balls (likely a mixture of impurities and pure mescaline acetate, evaporated with little or no heat) resulted in an LSD-strength experience for SWIM, whereas 600mg from the same batch resulted in very light effects for SWIM's FOAF. SWIM's done about 400-450mg from the same sort of batch with vastly lighter effects. 550mg from a darker brown mixture of impurities and mescaline of both acetate and carbonate (evapped with some heat) produced significantly stronger effects than the 400-450mg but significantly weaker effects than the 500mg tar-balls for both SWIM and his other FOAF. 550mg for another of SWIM's FOAF's and 600mg for SWIM of a redder yield that was a much darker brown when scraped up produced even weaker effects than the previous. The last trial SWIM had was with 400mg of a brown mixture of carbonate and acetate, which was about as strong as the 400mg tar-balls. SWIM's also noticed that he's definitely been able to confirm the activity of every dose he's tried at 100mg with various types of yields, so they all have some decent amount of activity; some just seem to miss the mark at higher doses.
The only way SWIM can conceive of to solve this issue is try different evaporation techniques from the same method of salting (vinegar, for starters), separate and document yields visually and by weight, basify each separately and in the same manner, salt each separately with HCl, finally clean up and document the results. In SWIM's case, he and his FOAF's would have to bioassay the pure mescaline HCl from about 600mg, working their way down, in order to compare to prior trials with the acetate.
SWIM would rather stick to the nontoxic techniques, but since he's been having trouble with his dosages and has some acetone and HCl on hand, he figures it would be a fairly productive way to spend the Winter. SWIM's had at least two amazing and a few satisfying experiences with mescaline in the past, so he feels the effort would be worthwhile. He's just looking to develop some more sure-fire guidelines for administration, considering that so many have had troubles with it.
So far 500mg of tar-balls (likely a mixture of impurities and pure mescaline acetate, evaporated with little or no heat) resulted in an LSD-strength experience for SWIM, whereas 600mg from the same batch resulted in very light effects for SWIM's FOAF. SWIM's done about 400-450mg from the same sort of batch with vastly lighter effects. 550mg from a darker brown mixture of impurities and mescaline of both acetate and carbonate (evapped with some heat) produced significantly stronger effects than the 400-450mg but significantly weaker effects than the 500mg tar-balls for both SWIM and his other FOAF. 550mg for another of SWIM's FOAF's and 600mg for SWIM of a redder yield that was a much darker brown when scraped up produced even weaker effects than the previous. The last trial SWIM had was with 400mg of a brown mixture of carbonate and acetate, which was about as strong as the 400mg tar-balls. SWIM's also noticed that he's definitely been able to confirm the activity of every dose he's tried at 100mg with various types of yields, so they all have some decent amount of activity; some just seem to miss the mark at higher doses.
The only way SWIM can conceive of to solve this issue is try different evaporation techniques from the same method of salting (vinegar, for starters), separate and document yields visually and by weight, basify each separately and in the same manner, salt each separately with HCl, finally clean up and document the results. In SWIM's case, he and his FOAF's would have to bioassay the pure mescaline HCl from about 600mg, working their way down, in order to compare to prior trials with the acetate.
SWIM would rather stick to the nontoxic techniques, but since he's been having trouble with his dosages and has some acetone and HCl on hand, he figures it would be a fairly productive way to spend the Winter. SWIM's had at least two amazing and a few satisfying experiences with mescaline in the past, so he feels the effort would be worthwhile. He's just looking to develop some more sure-fire guidelines for administration, considering that so many have had troubles with it.
damiana said:
My findings confirm this also. The desert molecule no like heat
69ron
Rising Star
My guess is that the red color is mescaline N-oxide forming from being exposed to too much heat. Most N-Oxides are brownish or reddish from the oxygen. Mescaline N-Oxide is probably inactive because it's probably too polar to pass the blood brain barrier.
When drying, it's a good idea to avoid too much heat. Same with extraction. SWIM found that when extracting using heat, yields were always very small.
When drying, it's a good idea to avoid too much heat. Same with extraction. SWIM found that when extracting using heat, yields were always very small.