Nootropics VS. Psilocybin

[SoldadoMonje]

Hello all, first post here.

I come up with a noob & philosophical question, basically I'm interested in long term neurogenesis enhancement looking to improve my attention, motivation and thinking process, lets call it Mindset. I believe that in order to achieve our goals in life the outcome is going to be related directly to our own level of commitment, daily habits, beliefs, environment, etc. We all face challenging obstacles in our life which most of the time are emotional barriers instead of intellectual ones.

These are my questions:
- Do I start with a basic stack of Piracetam + Acetyl L-Carnitine + CDP Citicoline? if so, which doses and for how long do I cycle them? (I do not consume alcohol nor any other meds).
- How about taking Psilocybin regularly in order to promote neurogenesis instead of consuming any Nootropic? Can I take/cycle them both at the same time? if so, how?
- Which option is going to help me deal best with emotional stuff? (which are in fact, manifestations of a complex, interconnected web of psychological, chemical, and neurological factors).

NOTE to address long term benefits without neglecting our health. Prefer playing safe first before going extreme.

 

[Ufostrahlen]

Do I start with a basic stack of Piracetam + Acetyl L-Carnitine + CDP Citicoline? if so, which doses and for how long do I cycle them? (I do not consume alcohol nor any other meds).

Why this particular stack? I'd start with Piracetam and simple choline bitartrate and see if it has an effect on me. I tried it, the effects were near placebo The Piracetam was pharmaceutical from a real pharmacy if it matters.

For a cycle duration have a look here:

Piracetam-induced improvement of mental performance A CONTROLLED STUDY ON NORMALLY AGING INDIVIDUALS

Domain Registered at Safenames

Have you read: Feed Your Head: Harnessing Neurogenesis? Fishoil, curcumin and exercise could be added on top of your stack. And of course, start meditation (long term fix, take at least 6 months into account and aim for 3 to 20 years).

If you need stronger stuff, maybe talk to a doctor?

 

[joedirt]

basically I'm interested in long term neurogenesis enhancement looking to improve my attention, motivation and thinking process, lets call it Mindset.

This may not be what you are looking for but...

Neurogenesis: I would say to keep a habit of continuously learning something new.
Attention: mindfulness meditation will kick any drugs ass in this department.
Motivation: I would start a regular exercise regime.

You do those 3 things, learning, meditation, exercise and I'm pretty sure you will have great mindset.

Peace

 

[SoldadoMonje]

Thanks for your kind replies.

I already do meditation and exercise regularly (not everyday, just less than 3 times per week) and I always feel motivated and curious to learn new stuff BUT the real thing here is my self-sabotage mechanism deeply rooted with emotional stuff that always holds me back. I'm always like not touching ground.. quite immature, confused or lost I believe.
Definitely need somehow to change my attitude towards developing emotional resiliency, being more mature, committed to finish everything I start quickly without allowing distractions, develop self-esteem, change environment, doing more and thinking less.
I changed my diet and lifestyle radically 4 years ago, went to spinal surgery almost 2 years ago which was causing me trouble at work out time. Physically I'm very healthy and in excellent conditions to perform anything I want, but as stated before: feeling limited.
I consider giving a chance to psilocybin as well as to piracetam but don't know exactly how to start this approach properly. Would appreciate any suggestions.

 

[Ufostrahlen]

I already do meditation and exercise regularly (not everyday, just less than 3 times per week) and I always feel motivated and curious to learn new stuff BUT the real thing here is my self-sabotage mechanism deeply rooted with emotional stuff that always holds me back.

I'd say ramp up the meditation practice to 2h a day. The day has 24h, 8h sleep, 2h meditation practice and 14h to deal with your every-day stuff. Exercise 3 times a week is good.

Try out different meditation practices: zazen, breathing techniques, mantra techniques etc. You can download a HQ binaural beat mp3 here, which I use for meditation practices. Just sit comfortably in a seat, relax, listen to the mp3 with headphones and observe breath and heartbeat. Let thoughts pass through you and maybe say a mantra like "om", if the thoughts try to overtake your practice or disturb you. It's impossible to think if you repeat a mantra constantly. Add your favorite substance to the mix, if you like.

I consider giving a chance to psilocybin as well as to piracetam but don't know exactly how to start this approach properly. Would appreciate any suggestions.

Well, get the stuff and start experimenting. Start a Piracetam cycle as described in the above mentioned paper and see how it affects you. With psilocybin, IDK. Best to have a benzodiazepine at hand, if psilocybin brings up too much emotional stir. Personally, I touch that thing with a pole, but everyone's different.

 

[joedirt]

I'd say start with 3 dried grams of shrooms and see how that works out. I find I am generally a more open person in the days and weeks after the experience.

I would also up the meditation to 30 minutes a day... but honestly I think meditation in combination with shrooms works wonderfully.

My only sincere advice is don't expect a total fix from drugs alone. In my experience it's never really been like that. It's been like, "Oh this is how i've been and this is how I should be"... it's of course still on us to come out of these experiences and change our relationship with the larger world.

In some way's you can use psychedelic experiences as a measure of how you are doing. I pretty much find that if I'm being a descent human being and treating others well I have good experiences.. if however I have done any sort of misdeed it will almost certainly be thrown back in my face during the trip.. Which BTW is easy to over come by just agreeing with your inner self to right the wrongs...

I'd say just about every time I do shrooms I come away either calling someone I haven't spoken to in a while or apologizing for something I said or did...

God I really do love shrooms.

Best of luck...

 

[Nathanial.Dread]

Edit - removed
Blessings
~ND

 

[benzyme]

nootropics are nice, I've been a fan for 17 years, but they are not a replacement for
actual thinking, the real neurogenerator. same applies to psilocybin.

that being said, some of the ACh precursors/agonists have helped with short-term mem development,
but a balance must be realized because of downregulation.
they may be safely taken with weak RIMAs.
ampakines are nice too, especially with ACh precursors

 

[Jin]

don't limit meditation to sitting only meditation

don't limit it to an hour or two , meditate all the time

also don't limit it to a mantra , breath , mindfullnes , and self inquiry , use all these techniques and go beyond the techniques

the idea is to - not only meditate but to become meditation

 

[joedirt]

Beware of pop-science talking about neurogenesis. It's a lot more complicated than just pumping your brain full of drugs, and the research that has been done has been less conclusive than you might like (and also all in rodents, so that's something else to be aware of).

Blessings
~ND

I agree Nathanial, but there is clearly something that is happening when people experience improved scores of openness and less fear for months after the experience.

Most of the current research on depression is leading more towards a neurogenesis model now as opposed to just a neurochemical depletion model. If that is the case then it would seem likely that the neurogenesis component of these experiences could in fact be part of what is happening.

The others aspect that I'm almost certain will be shown soon enough via a radio labeling experiment is that the SERT receptors are actually up taking psilocin and DMT and thus essentially topping off the serotonin tanks so to speak.

 

[Nathanial.Dread]

EDIT - Removed

 

[corpus callosum]

I come up with a noob & philosophical question, basically I'm interested in long term neurogenesis enhancement looking to improve my attention, motivation and thinking process, lets call it Mindset. I believe that in order to achieve our goals in life the outcome is going to be related directly to our own level of commitment, daily habits, beliefs, environment, etc. We all face challenging obstacles in our life which most of the time are emotional barriers instead of intellectual ones.

I agree with the members who suggest exercise, meditation and an ongoing process of learning as the way forward due to the multiple benefits these activities provide. These require a significant degree of commitment to yield results and are no quick fix.

Speaking for myself only, I've found that deconstructing emotional barriers and elucidating the relationship between these and ones intellectual constructs is very effectively achieved with the combination of NMDA antagonists and an agent such as psilocybin or LSD. If one is prepared to make a sustained effort to resolve ones issues then such a combination can provide a firm foundation for the work to come, IME.