Observations about ascorbic acid (vitamin c) on ACRB

[Satorie]

An extraction attempted with Vitamin C as the acid (as opposed to vinegar) proved initially disappointing. Did 5 pulls and barely yielded anything. However, after letting the bark sit in the basic soup for a couple more days, and then pulling again, it yielded about 2g weak goo from 100g ACRB.

In the past, vinegar extractions have yielded almost the same amount of more potent white x-tals.

Repeat trials seem to suggest that vinegar is much better to use than Vitamin C. I think that the solubility of DMT ascorbate is relatively low compared to the solubility of DMT acetate. When Vitamin C is used, the results of the extraction seem much more like the results of an STB ACRB extraction than the results of an ATB extraction, suggesting that much of the DMT failed to migrate to the water during the acid stage when vitamin C is used.

 

[downwardsfromzero]

Suggests possible value in DMT ascorbate precipitation? More tests needed!

 

[concombres]

An extraction attempted with Vitamin C as the acid (as opposed to vinegar) proved initially disappointing. Did 5 pulls and barely yielded anything. However, after letting the bark sit in the basic soup for a couple more days, and then pulling again, it yielded about 2g weak goo from 100g ACRB.

In the past, vinegar extractions have yielded almost the same amount of more potent white x-tals.

Repeat trials seem to suggest that vinegar is much better to use than Vitamin C. I think that the solubility of DMT ascorbate is relatively low compared to the solubility of DMT acetate. When Vitamin C is used, the results of the extraction seem much more like the results of an STB ACRB extraction than the results of an ATB extraction, suggesting that much of the DMT failed to migrate to the water during the acid stage when vitamin C is used.

You know this really has me thinking now.
I have decided to work solely with brews for the time being, but I wonder will my brews be more potent if I work with different acids.

Currently I have a batch brewed up using lime juice. Once that is used up I think a more scientific approach to brewing in in order to test whether or not using different acids to achieve the same PH while following the same tried & true brewing method will provide a more potent brew from the same batch of plant material.

 

[skoobysnax]

An extraction attempted with Vitamin C as the acid (as opposed to vinegar) proved initially disappointing. Did 5 pulls and barely yielded anything. However, after letting the bark sit in the basic soup for a couple more days, and then pulling again, it yielded about 2g weak goo from 100g ACRB.

In the past, vinegar extractions have yielded almost the same amount of more potent white x-tals.

Repeat trials seem to suggest that vinegar is much better to use than Vitamin C. I think that the solubility of DMT ascorbate is relatively low compared to the solubility of DMT acetate. When Vitamin C is used, the results of the extraction seem much more like the results of an STB ACRB extraction than the results of an ATB extraction, suggesting that much of the DMT failed to migrate to the water during the acid stage when vitamin C is used.

Citric acid was the same for me. Vinegar worked better.

 

[anon_101]

interesting post. I just used ascorbic acid for the first time, also using a new TEK, the Jim Jam Party TEK, making it impossible for me to be able to compare to my previous extractions.

It would be nice to see actual evidence with yield values in comparison.

I used D-Limonene as my solvent, thus pulling a full spectrum DMT, aka Jungle Spice. I will conduct more extractions comparing yields on the classic A/B extractions and Jim Jim Party extractions to see the results for myself.

 

[BringsUsTogether]

interesting post. I just used ascorbic acid for the first time, also using a new TEK, the Jim Jam Party TEK, making it impossible for me to be able to compare to my previous extractions.

It would be nice to see actual evidence with yield values in comparison.

I used D-Limonene as my solvent, thus pulling a full spectrum DMT, aka Jungle Spice. I will conduct more extractions comparing yields on the classic A/B extractions and Jim Jim Party extractions to see the results for myself.

Ignoring differences in tek, what was the difference in yield between yields of your extractions with ascorbic acid and vinegar?

 

[anon_101]

Ignoring differences in tek, what was the difference in yield between yields of your extractions with ascorbic acid and vinegar?

I'll let you know as soon as possible on this post. I have more extractions coming soon.

It was my first Jim Jam extract, because I was "going green", also using ascorbic acid to reduce smell.

My previous extractions using vinegar were with different TEKS, using Naphtha, for white/yellow DMT crystals.

Due to the different spectrum of the extractions, I can't make a comparison yet.

 

[locojuiceman]

It could maybe be the bark itself as in, not that good? Some has yeilded spectacular, some yeilds almost nil... leading me to believe its not the acid, as long as the PH range is 3-5 acidic, results should be as good as the bark is ...
using citric acid has always worked great over here and its not even 'cooked', most of the time its done with cold soaks....
citric acid and vitamin c are essentially the same thing aren't they? And its cheaper than buying powdered 'vitamin c' I found ...
Vinegar isn't used for the process because it stinks to high heaven ...

 

[drown]

It could maybe be the bark itself as in, not that good? Some has yeilded spectacular, some yeilds almost nil... leading me to believe its not the acid, as long as the PH range is 3-5 acidic, results should be as good as the bark is ...
using citric acid has always worked great over here and its not even 'cooked', most of the time its done with cold soaks....
citric acid and vitamin c are essentially the same thing aren't they? And its cheaper than buying powdered 'vitamin c' I found ...
Vinegar isn't used for the process because it stinks to high heaven ...

I would be more inclined to believe it was the bark. I generally use two vendors and both are genuine however vendor #1 consistently yields 2+% and the other a consistent .5-1% one with very much more nmt...(vendor #2 for the curious has more nmt)

But i believe it does warrant a bit more research. dmt acetate although still an salt is structurally different from dmt ascorbate which could cause dissimilarities in its reactive capabilities, including its solubility in particular solvents. Much like dmt fumarate is generally accepted as the only crystalline salt form of dmt the structural difference changed the temperature and atmospheric pressure at which the salt could solidify or recrystallize. I think i'll convert some of the material i still have and run a 1:1 side by side at room temperature to see the variable solubility rates. I'll post my results at the end of the experiment.

 

[BringsUsTogether]

I would be more inclined to believe it was the bark.

I tried with bark from the same [REDACTED] and the vinegar indeed yielded better than the vitamin C batch. I think further experimentation is needed.

 

[subiazim]

citric acid and vitamin c are essentially the same thing aren't they?

Citric acid is a tricarboxylic acid and it's actually classified as a pretty weak organic acid. Ascorbic acid is on the other hand is considered a carboxylic acid.


Anyone ever try apple cider vinegar?
It's a very natural substance and has a higher % of acetic acid (~6-9%) percent than regular white vinegar (4-5%)

 

[BringsUsTogether]

citric acid and vitamin c are essentially the same thing aren't they?

Citric acid is a tricarboxylic acid and it's actually classified as a pretty weak organic acid. Ascorbic acid is on the other hand is considered a carboxylic acid.


Anyone ever try apple cider vinegar?
It's a very natural substance and has a higher % of acetic acid (~6-9%) percent than regular white vinegar (4-5%)

Tried. Works fine :thumb_up: .