Passifloras of Interest..(& MAOI plant Flavonoids)

[MagicGing]

while i was chatting with hyperspace fool about his passiflora use in the past, he said fresh passiflora leaf is nearly 10x as potent, compared to dried leaf

also, in regards to the above post, hyperspace fool also said that he had smoke fresh (like still wet) passiflora leaf while on mushrooms and it would turn into a aya like experience, very noticable difference of effects.

also, i have tons of incarnata growing wild all around me and is native to the area
i cant tell you how greatful i am for this thread, nen888

 

[DamiasOfEgypt]

I am reading this and starting to think that my experience with passionflower alone is a strange one. I get passionflower from plants that grow wild in the woods around me. Many of my friends ask me to give them a tea made of it. All I do is a vine about 2 feet long, chop up the leaves and stem down to little tea sized pieces. Then I boil the whole thing in a bottle and a half of water. The next day I would give them the bottle and I would give them all the same warning about sipping it and giving them a list of foods that could possibly cause adverse reaction. They never listened and as a result the same thing would happen. They would chug the mixture. !5 minutes later they would start to tell me they felt funny. Slowly they would lose some motor function, there limbs would feel heavier. But they would have a positive, floaty feeling and no real desire to get up. They would often laugh at the slightest thing. This would continue for about 2 hours and then they would get motor function back, though the floating feeling stayed for a few more hours and they had an easier time focusing in other classes, and overall had a good day. One guy with severe depression used it to get through the day. He told me it made him feel a sort off happy energized, but also relaxed feeling. He used it to curb what would have turned into a drug addiction with other pills. After long I guess he found his bliss again. He know has a fiance and his dream job in the military.

There was never reported any major visual changes, other than everything appearing slightly brighter, and a bit wavy.

Even smoked it produced a nice but very mild change in headspace. More relaxed and clear.

I have only been able to produce this effect from very fresh passionflower. I would pick the leaves and they would be in a tea in 5 minutes. Some got hung in a dark place to dry to be smoked later, then sealed without air in a ziploc bag. All used withing a week or so.

 

[nen888]

thankyou MagicGing for the comments
and DamiasOfEgypt for those passiflora observations..

imPsimon wrote:

I also wonder if it's possible to vaporise passiflora?
How effective is it?
Will the cyanide that weren't destroyed by drying (if there is any?) be destroyed by vaporising
or will i inhale a lungful of cyanide vapour...ouch!

..it is fairly common to smoke passionflower leaf (as a relaxant, to ease nicotine withdrawl or as a cannabis substitute)
and also, as mentioned earlier in thread, it is possible to extract and vaporise passionflower extract..this can lead to quite profound effects..
..cyanogenic glycosides are destroyed by heating or drying, so no you won't be inhaling cyanide..!
.

 

[endlessness]

nen, not to give you more work than you already have, but when you gather information on MAO actions, would you mind posting the IC50 values as well as any quantification of those substances whenever possible? Because then we can have a better picture on how effective those plants may be and what dosages we should be looking at.

Lets take pasiflora incarnata as an example, which you posted about in first page. You mention hultin publication talking about harmala amounts, can you please expand on the reference, who is hultin, where is this paper published? Are the amounts for all harmalas together, including the ones that arent effective MAOIs?

This paper here only claims for harmine 0.009 mg/g (dry) passiflora incarnata and 0.1 mg/g caerulea (dry). This would mean for a 200mg harmine dosage, you´d need like 20kgs dried incarnata or 2kgs dried caerulea, which is way too much, specially comparing the bioassay amounts you mentioned. Other harmala found, harmol, does not have good MAO-A action.

Of course, maybe this adds to the flavonoids, but do we have any info on amounts? You mentioned Apigenin and Kaempferol, do we know of amounts? The paper I linked earlier mensions vitexin, but vitexin seems to have potentially health hazards, specifically the swelling of thyreoid gland. Which leads me to another question, maybe it would be also interesting to quote the potential dangers (and maybe how to avoid them if we have such info like solubilities or how to break down the unwanted substances or whatever) in these passifloras and not just potential uses?

 

[nen888]

..the flavonoid IC-50s are in the verious references given in this post on page 1..yes, a bit of work to go through, but worth doing..have been very pressed for time lately..this is a very new area which obviously needs a lot more research, especially toxicologically..

Hultin means Eskil Hultin 'Partition Co-effecicients of Ether-extractable Passionflower Extracts' Acta Chemica Scandinavia 1965 in which he found harmol, harmaline, harman and harmalol..(attached below)
i thought i'd already attached it in this thread, but it was actually linked in Passion flower extraction questions - Harmalas - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus ..0.2% (total alkaloid) is cited by S. Voogelbreinder (2009) and Gracie & Zarkov, from i assume another Hultin paper (or else Neu cited by Hultin) which i'm looking for now..i will try to clear this up..


more tests needed..especially P. incarnata extraction..
300 grams dried, as stated, of P. incarnata, had enough MAOI activity in 3 people (as i anecdotally reported) ..there was no apparently toxic action at this level..but it may well have been flavonoids responsible, not alkaloids..
.

 

[jamie]

Data on single compounds, while interesting, does not always provide a totally useful picture of how these things work in plants when in ratio with hundreds of other compounds as is the case in many herbs/plants..often synergistic compounds which modulate/buffer some of the effects of each compound are present. The same compound could act two different way in the body depending on what else is(or not) present.

 

[nen888]

..still awaiting time to accumulate more info..
the general figure i've had for years for harmalas in P. incarnata is 0.2%..that was how the oral activation dose experiment years back was arrived at..

This paper here only claims for harmine 0.009 mg/g (dry) passiflora incarnata and 0.1 mg/g caerulea (dry). This would mean for a 200mg harmine dosage, you´d need like 20kgs dried incarnata or 2kgs dried caerulea, which is way too much, specially comparing the bioassay amounts you mentioned.

..i just want to point out that in the paper you linked endlessness that, as in a few cases where very small amounts of harmalas are reported for passiflora, the actual methodology used would fail to efficiently extract the majority of alkaloids..imagine, with nexian-know-how, extracting B. caapi like they did P. inarnata..
from the paper:

Approximately 15 grams of dried plant material was ground using a small coffee grinder and mixed with five times their weight of an acetic acid solution containing 30 grams of acetic acid per liter of water. The acetic acid and plant material slurry was stirred for five minutes before being filtered using a Bucher funnel and Whatman 4 filter paper. Two washings of the plant material with the acetic acid solution were performed. The aqueous plant extract solution was washed three times with 50 mL of petroleum ether and 50 mL of ethyl acetate using a seperatory funnel to remove the organic impurities. The bottom layer was collected and a saturated sodium bicarbonate solution was added to neutralize the acid. The resultant solution was extracted three times with 100 mL ethyl acetate to remove the aqueous impurities. The top layer was collected and excess sodium sulfate was added to ensure the removal of excess water.

..that this was the method would suggest to me that there are actually considerably larger amounts of harmalas in the material..

 

[Infundibulum]

..i just want to point out that in the paper you linked endlessness that, as in a few cases where very small amounts of harmalas are reported for passiflora, the actual methodology used would fail to efficiently extract the majority of alkaloids..imagine, with nexian-know-how, extracting B. caapi like they did P. inarnata..
from the paper:

Approximately 15 grams of dried plant material was ground using a small coffee grinder and mixed with five times their weight of an acetic acid solution containing 30 grams of acetic acid per liter of water. The acetic acid and plant material slurry was stirred for five minutes before being filtered using a Bucher funnel and Whatman 4 filter paper. Two washings of the plant material with the acetic acid solution were performed. The aqueous plant extract solution was washed three times with 50 mL of petroleum ether and 50 mL of ethyl acetate using a seperatory funnel to remove the organic impurities. The bottom layer was collected and a saturated sodium bicarbonate solution was added to neutralize the acid. The resultant solution was extracted three times with 100 mL ethyl acetate to remove the aqueous impurities. The top layer was collected and excess sodium sulfate was added to ensure the removal of excess water.

..that this was the method would suggest to me that there are actually considerably larger amounts of harmalas in the material..

..actually the published extraction is quite exhaustive, suggesting that there are very few amounts of harmalas. If these passifloras were extracted as we do with caapi, there would most likely be a close-to-zero yield.

Data on single compounds, while interesting, does not always provide a totally useful picture of how these things work in plants when in ratio with hundreds of other compounds as is the case in many herbs/plants..often synergistic compounds which modulate/buffer some of the effects of each compound are present. The same compound could act two different way in the body depending on what else is(or not) present.

That is very true; but the IC50 and Ki values are a good starting point at understanding inhibition strength of compounds.

 

[nen888]

^..it's the initial stage..i find it hard to conceive that a 2x5minute dilute acid wash, without heat, would effectively capture all the alkaloids..especially from plant material..

 

[DreaMTripper]

Wow great work nen! I love passiflora tea it so calming and tastes great with a touch of sugar, and that theres harmalas present to extract is even better! A genuine option for Aus based people to make effective changa.

 

[Zuckerwasser]

About Passiflora caerulea: I while ago i was taking venlafaxin. At that time i had a big passiflora caerulea, and because i had to move, i harvasted the plant to tea sometimes.
At the evening i make tea, containing out of valerian, chamomile, eschscholzia california. So i wanted to add passiflora caerulea, i looked at the internet, if there were reports of maoi and found nothing, sso i just tried.
Two weeks i drank passiflora caerulea (but at the morning), 2 teaspooons with boiling water.
The tea was harvested, while flowering in late summer, when it could have wearn fruits, because thats the time to harvest incarnata.
The effect was very comfortable, the firts week, then the effects stopped, dont know why.
I was calm, but not sedated. Not like anti-depressiv, i-want-to-do-lot-of-things, more like small calm-push, very nice. At that dosage there was as it seems no maoi, because i would have felt bad i think.

 

[the-badger]

I have a Passionflower growing in my garden, I need to try and work out which type it is.

 

[Sabnock]

Just wondering, how is Aya/Pharma with Passion Flower added as an admixture kind of thing?

 

[Ib]

Taken from Dr. Duke's Phytochemical and Ethnobotanical Databases, phytochemical data about P. edulis, P. foetida, P. incarnata, P. ligularis, P. mollissima, P. quadrangularis, and P. suberosa. ppm = parts per million & tr = trace

Spoiler

Passiflora edulis

Chemicals in: Passiflora edulis SIMS (Passifloraceae) -- Maracuya, Passionfruit:
ALKALOIDS Fruit 120 - 7,000 ppm JFM
ARACHIDIC-ACID Seed 780 ppm; JFM
ASCORBIC-ACID Fruit 300 - 1,205 ppm CRC
ASH Fruit 8,000 - 32,000 ppm CRC Seed 18,400 ppm; JFM
BETA-CAROTENE Fruit 4 - 17 ppm CRC
CALCIUM Fruit 130 - 1,190 ppm CRC Seed 800 ppm; JFM
CARBOHYDRATES Fruit 212,000 - 851,000 ppm CRC
CAROTENOIDS Fruit 580 - 11,600 ppm JFM
CATALASE Fruit: WOI
CITRIC-ACID Fruit 20,000 - 45,600 ppm WOI
EO Fruit Juice 23 - 43 ppm WOI
ETHYL-BUTYRATE Fruit: WOI
ETHYL-CAPROATE Fruit Juice 14 - 30 ppm WOI
FAT Fruit 7,000 - 28,000 ppm CRC Seed 230,000 - 238,000 ppm JFM
FIBER Fruit Juice 500 - 12,000 ppm WOI Seed 537,000 ppm; JFM
FLAVONOIDS Fruit 10,000 - 10,600 ppm JFM
HARMAN Fruit 7,001 ppm; JFM
IRON Fruit 16 - 64 ppm CRC Seed 180 ppm; JFM
KILOCALORIES Fruit 900 - 3,610 /kg CRC
LINOLEIC-ACID Seed 137,770 ppm; JFM
LINOLENIC-ACID Seed 12,420 ppm; JFM
MALIC-ACID Fruit 1,200 - 3,800 ppm WOI
N-HEXYL-BUTYRATE Fruit Juice 3 - 6 ppm WOI
N-HEXYL-CAPROATE Fruit Juice 14 - 30 ppm WOI
NIACIN Fruit 15 - 60 ppm CRC
NITROGEN Plant 960 - 1,920 ppm WOI
OLEIC-ACID Seed 43,700 ppm; JFM
PALMITIC-ACID Seed 15,595 ppm; JFM
PASSIFLORINE Leaf: JFM
PECTIN Petiole 24,000 - 140,000 ppm JFM
PECTIN-METHYL-ESTERASE Fruit: WOI
PELARGONIDIN-3-DIGLUCOSIDE Petiole 14 ppm; JFM
PHENOLASE Fruit: WOI
PHOSPHORUS Fruit 480 - 2,570 ppm CRC Seed 6,400 ppm; JFM
POTASSIUM Fruit 3,480 - 13,975 ppm CRC
PROTEIN Fruit 22,000 - 88,000 ppm CRC Seed 111,000 ppm; JFM
RIBOFLAVIN Fruit 1 - 5 ppm CRC
SFA Seed 20,470 ppm; JFM
SODIUM Fruit 280 - 1,124 ppm CRC
STEARIC-ACID Seed 4,050 ppm; JFM
THIAMIN Fruit 1.4 ppm; CRC
WATER Fruit 751,000 - 790,000 ppm CRC Seed 54,000 ppm; JFM
XANTHOPHYLLS Fruit 60 - 2,495 ppm WOI

Passiflora foetida

Chemicals in: Passiflora foetida L. (Passifloraceae) -- Granadilla Cimarrona, Stinking Granadilla:
ASCORBIC-ACID Fruit 150 - 835 ppm CRC
ASH Fruit 6,000 - 33,335 ppm CRC
BETA-CAROTENE Fruit: CRC
CALCIUM Fruit 200 - 1,110 ppm CRC
CARBOHYDRATES Fruit 152,000 - 844,445 ppm CRC
FAT Fruit 400 - 22,220 ppm CRC Seed 248,000 ppm; CRC
IRON Fruit 7 - 39 ppm CRC
KILOCALORIES Fruit 640 - 3,555 /kg CRC
NIACIN Fruit 14 - 78 ppm CRC
PHOSPHORUS Fruit 480 - 2,665 ppm CRC
POTASSIUM Fruit 3,410 - 18,945 ppm CRC
PROTEIN Fruit 18,000 - 100,000 ppm CRC Seed 108,000 ppm; CRC
THIAMIN Fruit 0.1 - 0.6 ppm CRC
WATER Fruit 820,000 ppm; CRC

Passiflora incarnata

Chemicals in: Passiflora incarnata L. (Passifloraceae) -- Manzana de Mayo, Mayapple, Passionflower:
ALKALOIDS Plant 250 - 300 ppm DUKE1992A
ALPHA-ALANINE Plant: DUKE1992A
APIGENIN Plant: DUKE1992A
CALCIUM Fruit 140 - 509 ppm DUKE1992A
CARBOHYDRATES Fruit 210,000 - 764,000 ppm DUKE1992A
D-FRUCTOSE Plant: DUKE1992A
D-GLUCOSE Plant: DUKE1992A
FAT Fruit 33,000 - 120,000 ppm DUKE1992A
FIBER Fruit 73,000 - 265,000 ppm DUKE1992A
FLAVONOIDS Plant 15,000 - 22,000 ppm DUKE1992A
GLUTAMINE Fruit: DUKE1992A
GUM Plant 2,500 ppm; DUKE1992A
GYNOCARDIN Leaf 100 ppm; DUKE1992A
HARMALINE Plant: DUKE1992A
HARMALOL Plant: DUKE1992A
HARMANE Na 1 - 120 ppm DUKE1992A
HARMINE Shoot 70 ppm; DUKE1992A
HARMOL Plant: DUKE1992A
HOMOORIENTIN Plant: DUKE1992A
IRON Fruit 16 - 58 ppm DUKE1992A
ISOORIENTIN Plant: DUKE1992A
ISOVITEXIN Plant: DUKE1992A
KAEMPFEROL Plant: DUKE1992A
LUTENIN-2 Plant: DUKE1992A
LUTEOLIN Plant: DUKE1992A
MALTOL Plant: DUKE1992A
N-NONACOSANE Plant: DUKE1992A
ORIENTIN Plant: DUKE1992A
PASSIFLORINE Plant: DUKE1992A
PHENYLALANINE Fruit: DUKE1992A Leaf: DUKE1992A Seed: DUKE1992A Stem: DUKE1992A
PHOSPHORUS Fruit 430 - 1,564 ppm DUKE1992A
PROLINE Plant: DUKE1992A
PROTEIN Fruit 23,000 - 84,000 ppm DUKE1992A
QUERCETIN Leaf: DUKE1992A7
RAFFINOSE Plant: DUKE1992A
RUTIN Plant: DUKE1992A
SACCHAROSE Plant: DUKE1992A
SAPONARETIN Plant: DUKE1992A
SAPONARINE Plant: DUKE1992A
SCOPOLETIN Root: DUKE1992A
SITOSTEROL Plant: DUKE1992A
STIGMASTEROL Plant: DUKE1992A
SUCROSE Plant: DUKE1992A
TYROSINE Leaf: DUKE1992A Seed: DUKE1992A Stem: DUKE1992A
UMBELLIFERONE Root: DUKE1992A
VALINE Leaf: DUKE1992A Seed: DUKE1992A Stem: DUKE1992A
VITEXIN Plant: DUKE1992A

Passiflora ligularis

Chemicals in: Passiflora ligularis JUSS. (Passifloraceae) -- Granadilla, Sweet Granadilla:
ASCORBIC-ACID Fruit 108 - 950 ppm JCB JFM
ASH Fruit 8,700 - 61,900 ppm CRC JCB JFM
BETA-CAROTENE Fruit 1.2 ppm; JFM
CALCIUM Fruit 56 - 810 ppm JCB JFM
CARBOHYDRATES Fruit 123,000 - 730,000 ppm CRC JCB
FAT Fruit 1,000 - 118,145 ppm CRC JCB JFM
FIBER Fruit 3,000 - 186,050 ppm JCB JFM
IRON Fruit 4 - 52 ppm JCB JFM
KILOCALORIES Fruit 460 - 3,965 /kg CRC JCB
NIACIN Fruit 14 - 100 ppm CRC JCB JFM
PHOSPHORUS Fruit 300 - 6,095 ppm CRC JCB JFM
PROTEIN Fruit 3,400 - 101,265 ppm CRC JFM
RIBOFLAVIN Fruit 0.6 - 6.2 ppm CRC JFM
THIAMIN Fruit 5.2 ppm; JFM
WATER Fruit 699,000 - 860,000 ppm CRC JCB JFM

Passiflora mollissima

Chemicals in: Passiflora mollissima BAILEY (Passifloraceae) -- Banana Passionfruit, Granadilla De Guineo:
ASCORBIC-ACID Fruit 700 - 8,750 ppm JFM
ASH Fruit 7,000 - 87,500 ppm JFM
BETA-CAROTENE Fruit 1.2 ppm; JFM
CALCIUM Fruit 40 - 500 ppm JFM
CARBOHYDRATES Fruit 63,000 - 787,500 ppm JFM
FAT Fruit 1,000 - 12,500 ppm JFM
FIBER Fruit 3,000 - 37,500 ppm JFM
IRON Fruit 4 - 50 ppm JFM
KILOCALORIES Fruit 250 - 3,125 /kg JFM
NIACIN Fruit 25 - 310 ppm JFM
PHOSPHORUS Fruit 200 - 2,500 ppm JFM
PROTEIN Fruit 6,000 - 75,000 ppm JFM
RIBOFLAVIN Fruit 0.3 - 3.8 ppm JFM
WATER Fruit 920,000 - 926,000 ppm CRC JFM

Passiflora quadrangularis

Chemicals in: Passiflora quadrangularis L. (Passifloraceae) -- Granadilla:
ASCORBIC-ACID Fruit 150 - 2,680 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 150 - 695 ppm DUKE1992A
ASH Fruit 4,000 - 71,000 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 8,000 - 37,000 ppm DUKE1992A
BETA-CAROTENE Fruit: DUKE1992A Seed 0.2 - 1 ppm DUKE1992A
CALCIUM Fruit 90 - 2,500 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 90 - 415 ppm DUKE1992A
CARBOHYDRATES Fruit 43,000 - 768,000 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 176,000 - 815,000 ppm DUKE1992A
FAT Fruit 2,000 - 95,000 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 13,000 - 60,000 ppm DUKE1992A
FIBER Fruit 7,000 - 245,000 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 56,000 - 259,000 ppm DUKE1992A
HCN Seed: DUKE1992A
IRON Fruit 6 - 143 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 29 - 134 ppm DUKE1992A
KILOCALORIES Fruit 200 - 3,850 /kg DUKE1992A Seed 810 - 3,750 /kg DUKE1992A
NIACIN Fruit 38 - 680 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 19 - 88 ppm DUKE1992A
PASSIFLORINE Leaf: DUKE1992A Root: DUKE1992A
PHOSPHORUS Fruit 170 - 3,035 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 390 - 1,800 ppm DUKE1992A
PROTEIN Fruit 7,000 - 130,000 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 19,000 - 88,000 ppm DUKE1992A
RIBOFLAVIN Fruit 0.3 - 5 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 1.2 - 6 ppm DUKE1992A
THIAMIN Fruit: DUKE1992A Seed: DUKE1992A
WATER Fruit 800,000 - 944,000 ppm DUKE1992A Seed 784,000 ppm; DUKE1992A

Passiflora suberosa

Chemicals in: Passiflora suberosa L. (Passifloraceae):
PASSIFLORINE Plant: ALK

 

[downwardsfromzero]

Ib, I think your post needs editing down a bit...

 

[nen888]

^lol
..great info and post Ib ! ..thank you for that...:d
the upper level given for P. edulis alkaloids in fruit (7000 ppm) is not too bad...

there are greatly differing reports of alkaloid levels in some of these species, and whether this is due to variety, seasonal variation or test methodology really needs clearing up..

Zuckerwasser..thanks for that report..strange that the effects diminished..tolerance? you're right there would probably not be maoi activity at that level, though mao inhibition doesn't necessarily make one 'feel bad' (unless it's an overdose) ..it's more to do with whatever amines are in your system that would lead to any unpleasant effects..

DreaMTripper..thanks..i love passiflora tea too..

Sabnock...Passionflower added to Aya makes the visions 'even more colourful'...

& the-badger, if you can't work out what your plant is from the pics in the thread, send us a photo when it flowers..

 

[Endurance]

....A recent paper on Passiflora incarnata L. from the Journal of Ethnopharmacology.

 

[nen888]

..a great species, and a great website for Passiflora lovers is, as mentioned on p1,
Passiflora xiikzodz..found on Mayan temples and in rocky gullies nearby..
there are images of it, and many species, on the site Blooming Passion

below is P. xiikzodz growing on the not-fully excavated temple ruin at Xunantunich in Belize..
no chemical studies i'm aware of..it's in the same sub-group as P. supeltata, which contains harman..

 

[nen888]

..thanks colour..always appreciate a passiflora paper
nice avatar, btw
.

 

[Endurance]

Thanks nen888... I think the paper in this thread would be more relevant in the Passifloras of Interest..(& MAOI plant Flavonoids) thread you started...