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Pictorial Guide to Caapi Vine Alkaloid Extraction

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Well I am on the drying stage of the main batch, and then probably a third of that still decanting.

I had zero problems and looks like a great yield, I kept my ph at 4 for acidifying. and when I based I used lye and kept in at a ph of 12.

This was done on 100 grams red caapi vine, and phosphoric acid/lye
 
Very good to hear! If you get the chance to do another run with vinegar, with the same vine, let us know how the yields compare.
 
I dont have anymore of the same batch so I couldnt do it accurately. However, I used vinegar to convert to acid in the step after you wash the freebase. I dont have anyway of knowing if it produces a better yeild, but I can say its taking a lot longer to settle, the freebased crystals are not very dense, doubled in size from when I first freebased from the acid washes at the beginning that were done with phosphoric acid.

This also clears up the other few posts in here where this tek failed with red caapi, I will post my yeilds as i get them. The first one will be ready to scrape in a couple hours.

At this point I can do my own test and use a few other people as variables, to see whether vinegar or phosphoric acid would produce a more active molecule in the end. maybe the harmalas that were converted with vinegar as oppose to phosphoric acid would have more of an effect or vise versa.

I am about to receive a pound of yellow vine, so i am going to do some tests.
 
Just an idea, would this tek work with MHRB? Making a tea the same way and following all the steps? Or it would pull too much crap from the bark? Assuming that somebody would have said it already if it was... But might be worth a test...?
Thanks anyway if anybody has any insight.
 
Curiouskid said:
Just an idea, would this tek work with MHRB? Making a tea the same way and following all the steps? Or it would pull too much crap from the bark? Assuming that somebody would have said it already if it was... But might be worth a test...?
Thanks anyway if anybody has any insight.
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Isn't that the basic premise of the A/B teks? Am I missing something?
 
ragabr said:
Very good to hear! If you get the chance to do another run with vinegar, with the same vine, let us know how the yields compare.
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I will be able to do the comparison. ATM I'm extracting black caapi with phosphoric acid and have enough caapi left to do another extraction with vinegar.

I use a modified procedure. Instead of 3 boilings I did methanol pre-extraction. Alcohols are much less selective than water so lots of gunk (lipides and whatnot) is extracted. Now I've dissolved the dried extract in diluted H3PO4 (pH~3). There is a lot of sediment. I plan to wait until the solution is completely clear and then decant and discard the solids.

Is there a chance that some beta-carbolines phosphates are trapped there? Guess I'll keep the solids for a while.
 
With everything dried and scraped up I have 1.2 grams harmalas from 100 grams red caapi. They are an off white, and all I have done is smoke some with great effects.

Success with phosphoric acid and red caapi..

Much peace and love
 
SnozzleBerry said:
Curiouskid said:
Just an idea, would this tek work with MHRB? Making a tea the same way and following all the steps? Or it would pull too much crap from the bark? Assuming that somebody would have said it already if it was... But might be worth a test...?
Thanks anyway if anybody has any insight.
Click to expand...
Isn't that the basic premise of the A/B teks? Am I missing something?
Click to expand...

Not really, all the A/B in the wiki are talking about an acid soak to start and use all kind of nasty chemicals...
The question is would it be possible to extract spice starting with a tea, adding a base like sodium carbonate, decanting, adding acid to separate the plant material, again a base, and decanting till the right ph is attained... exactly this same tech but with MHRB.

Maybe some A/B are very similar but they couldn't be found :? That's probably worth a try
 
Oh, I got you. I didn't realize you meant without a non-polar solvent (not all off which are "nasty", by which I assume you mean a petrochem). Tmk, there isn't a tek that doesn't use a NPS (the water tek technically doesn't require one, but no one has actually pulled it off successfully and had their results presented as verified DMT freebase). A base like sodium carbonate isn't strong enough to freebase DMT, afaik. Perhaps following that procedure using something like NaOH would yield something, but I don't know that anyone has tried it...sounds interesting to me.

As far as "eco-" or "green" teks go, take a look at these, they don't require petrochems (using D-Limonene and/or vegetable oil in their place) and some don't require lye:

Amor fati's Compendium for the Extraction of Jurema
Amor fati's Nontoxic Approach to Spice Extraction
BLAB - The Big Leisurely A/B
Jorkest's D-Limonene and Fumaric Acid Approach
Nontoxic limonene tek

Hope that helps
 
Thanks so much SnozzleBerry, 've been trying Q21's tek and Amor fati's with orange oil and sunflower oil with success, was just curious to see if anybody tried with only water as solvent; which sounds interesting as water is found anywhere!
Caapi can be freebased with sodium carbonate following this tech instead of NaOH so like said before: might be worth a small scale try...

Cheers mate anyway for yours advices and links of the teks
 
Curiouskid said:
...was just curious to see if anybody tried with only water as solvent; which sounds interesting as water is found anywhere!
Caapi can be freebased with sodium carbonate following this tech instead of NaOH so like said before: might be worth a small scale try...
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As to the water only tek, it can be found here, but as I said, no one has yet to post results that were actually verified to be DMT.

As to sodium carbonate, yes, it is a strong enough base to freebase harmala alkaloids from caapi, but it is not, afaik, a strong enough base to freebase DMT molecules in an aqueous MHRB solution.
 
Finished this extraction last night on ~70 grams yellow caapi vine from HP. acetic acid as added to 3 forty-five minute boils. decanted overnight and mixed with 6 grams sodium hydroxide in 60ml warm water.

pH of ~12. Converted back to an acid and the decant from the night before removed all but maybe 10mg insolubles.

this is where I have a question.. When adding the naoh the second time salts seemed to continue to crash out with each drop of the solution. I added maybe 4 grams worth of lye solution into the mixture before I knew what i was putting in wasnt paying out. The pH was now over 13

after maybe 5 cleanups with 200ml water i got a sad 0.159mg..

help?
 
I´m just finishing up a batch of caapi leaf done with this method.

I had previously soaked the leaf in acetone for about 1month and gotten abunch of goodies, although after this extraction i guess that about 60% was still left in the material.

I know acetone is not the best solvent for harmala extraction but itr was all i had. but in the future i will use this methos only.
 
Wow--it looks like huge yields here. If you get close to 2% yield on 50g caapi, that would be 1g of harmalas. Why is it that the standard pharma dose of harmalas is 200mg or max 400mg, when it appears we are drinking sometimes up to 1g of them with only 50g caapi tea? ... so confused.
 
moyshekapoyre said:
Wow--it looks like huge yields here. If you get close to 2% yield on 50g caapi, that would be 1g of harmalas. Why is it that the standard pharma dose of harmalas is 200mg or max 400mg, when it appears we are drinking sometimes up to 1g of them with only 50g caapi tea? ... so confused.
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That’s a very good question. It has been asked before, but no one has yet come up with a good answer. Maybe caapi tea has something in it that slows or regulates the absorption of harmalas? Hard to say what is going on. My yields from black caapi have always been around 2% (with one exceptional yield of 3%) and the one time I extracted from yellow I got slightly under 1%. Vine containing 0.5% alkaloids would have 250mg alkaloids per 50g caapi, which seems typical. The alkaloid content of caapi varies so much that it’s impossible to say what’s going on without quantitative analysis (extraction of alkaloids).

I have very limited experience with this, but my very first caapi-only aya experience was with brew from 15g of black caapi. I made brew from 30g and drank half of it. It was very strong and made me feel very ill. I extracted the alkaloids from the other half and got about 2%, which means the first dose had around 300mg alkaloids. All I can say is that it felt like 300mg!

I don’t think there are any regular aya drinkers among us who also regularly extract caapi alkaloids. A good experiment for an experienced aya drinker would be: Prepare caapi brew – enough for 2 doses. Drink one dose and note effects. Extract the second dose, consume the resultant alkaloids, and note effects. As far as I know, no one has tried this yet.
 
gibran2 said:
A good experiment for an experienced aya drinker would be: Prepare caapi brew – enough for 2 doses. Drink one dose and note effects. Extract the second dose, consume the resultant alkaloids, and note effects. As far as I know, no one has tried this yet.
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SWIM has tried this once, and the extracted alkaloids were nowhere near as strong or as long-lasting as the brew had been. She suspects these results, and so didn't think they warranted a post until she tried it again.

After extracting the alkaloids, she was surprised to only get a yield of ~275mg's, when the brew had been the strongest she's ever ingested.
 
ragabr said:
SWIM has tried this once, and the extracted alkaloids were nowhere near as strong or as long-lasting as the brew had been. She suspects these results, and so didn't think they warranted a post until she tried it again.

After extracting the alkaloids, she was surprised to only get a yield of ~275mg's, when the brew had been the strongest she's ever ingested.
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So you subsequently took the 275mg extracted alkaloids?

As I said earlier, I had brew from 15g black caapi, and it was uncomfortably strong. I then extracted about 300mg alkaloids from the remaining 15g, but didn’t follow up by taking the alkaloids. (I can’t imagine what 50g of that brew would have done to me.)

Since then I’ve had 1 or 2 pharma journeys with 300mg alkaloids, and they were every bit as uncomfortable as that original 15g dose of brew.
 
The extracted alkaloids were taken, and only lasted for ~4 hours instead of 10+. She was more comfortable laying down, but was able to walk around without strong nausea, unlike with the brew where she was unable to move her head without developing the spins.

The aya alkaloids were much more comfortable for her than a comparable dose of rue alkaloids.
 
working with yellow vine, the precipitates took a day to settle after the first addition of NaOH. any milkiness is floating goodies.
 
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