Psychedelic Propaganda

[The Traveler]

Varied opinion is what we need! I don't think people are acting wrong according to the forum's standard and I believe that's the problem. How will we get anywhere if everyone agrees!? Start acting out. Hunter S. Thompson came within a few votes of becoming Sheriff of Aspen because he raised important questions that were taboo among the community. He was a wild man who took many, many undesirable actions and I love him for that. I'm not saying we need more Hunter Thompson's in this forum. We could use, however, people taking a stance in new positions.

I will be back later...

On the DMT-Nexus people can take any stance they like as long as they will abide this attitude:
* Stay respectful
* Substantiate your stance, say why you make that stance and give good reasoning for it
* Stay open for other (substantiated) opinions, if they disprove a point of yours recognize it as a good way to improve yourself
* Don't mention anything that can bring this community in legal trouble, like trading illegal substances, etc

It's actually a pretty simple Attitude. It is meant as a tool, to make sure we can all get along while we bring our ideas and a way to be constructive so we can improve as a whole.

If people cannot substantiate their reasoning or use lines like "I know this to be true and you should just accept that without me giving you any proof" then we will get nowhere. Then we just have to accept things which cannot only be false but also very dangerous. Just agreeing with each other 'just because' is a recipe for disaster.

Of course we have some generic consensus here on the DMT-Nexus. We got that after long debates and (re)checking things out a lot. Because of that we know now how to extract Caapi for example, we all agree here that the teks for that work. We also know what certain substances will do and how certain combinations will work.


I think you have a certain feeling about something that feels wrong but you cannot yet put a finger on it. Up till now people are confused as to what you really mean with your wordings in this thread. I propose that you try to find out where that itchy feeling is coming from and also that you read some of the threads gibran2 mentioned. Maybe you overlooked an important part of this community?


Kind regards,

The Traveler

 

[Hyperdimensional Cuttlefish]

Criticizing members of a niche forum for being of a similar mind seems a bit short sighted. Why are we here? What do we seek? Of course we are similar. So are members of any number of other groups, that's what MAKES them a group. Step back and think for a bit.

Bemoaning the lack of individuality on an anonymous forum is also silly; by the nature of anonymity we take on an element of homogeneity. This is mitigated to a certain extent by the names,signatures and images we choose to represent ourselves... but only so far. You need to spend time reading posts and you will see personality in the words. Give it time.

Perhaps it isn't the uniformity of the nexus that bothers you, but that it isn't your view right now.

 

[RayOfLight]

Varied opinion is what we need! I don't think people are acting wrong according to the forum's standard and I believe that's the problem. How will we get anywhere if everyone agrees!? Start acting out. Hunter S. Thompson came within a few votes of becoming Sheriff of Aspen because he raised important questions that were taboo among the community. He was a wild man who took many, many undesirable actions and I love him for that. I'm not saying we need more Hunter Thompson's in this forum. We could use, however, people taking a stance in new positions.

I will be back later...

On the DMT-Nexus people can take any stance they like as long as they will abide this attitude:
* Stay respectful
* Substantiate your stance, say why you make that stance and give good reasoning for it
* Stay open for other (substantiated) opinions, if they disprove a point of yours recognize it as a good way to improve yourself
* Don't mention anything that can bring this community in legal trouble, like trading illegal substances, etc

It's actually a pretty simple Attitude. It is meant as a tool, to make sure we can all get along while we bring our ideas and a way to be constructive so we can improve as a whole.

If people cannot substantiate their reasoning or use lines like "I know this to be true and you should just accept that without me giving you any proof" then we will get nowhere. Then we just have to accept things which cannot only be false but also very dangerous. Just agreeing with each other 'just because' is a recipe for disaster.

Of course we have some generic consensus here on the DMT-Nexus. We got that after long debates and (re)checking things out a lot. Because of that we know now how to extract Caapi for example, we all agree here that the teks for that work. We also know what certain substances will do and how certain combinations will work.


I think you have a certain feeling about something that feels wrong but you cannot yet put a finger on it. Up till now people are confused as to what you really mean with your wordings in this thread. I propose that you try to find out where that itchy feeling is coming from and also that you read some of the threads gibran2 mentioned. Maybe you overlooked an important part of this community?


Kind regards,

The Traveler

I think this was my problem, when I think of evidence I think of what I consider to be evidence and not what everyone else might think it is. For me my personal experience counts as evidence, this is why I've clashed with people.

I realize now that this is a science based forum and my opinions shouldn't be discussed here unless I can offer 'proof' as to the reasons I have them... well they can be discussed but they will usually generate hostility witch is better avoided.

 

[The Traveler]

...

I think this was my problem, when I think of evidence I think of what I consider to be evidence and not what everyone else might think it is. For me my personal experience counts as evidence, this is why I've clashed with people.

I realize now that this is a science based forum and my opinions shouldn't be discussed here unless I can offer 'proof' as to the reasons I have them... well they can be discussed but they will usually generate hostility witch is better avoided.

In situations like that you can still bring your opinion without any problem. Just make sure you can explain to people, preferably in a neutral tone, why you have that opinion and why it matters to you. Also make sure you leave open a large enough space for other people to react to your opinion and bring in their own opinion as a result of that. That way you can, as a group, philosophize about ideas and opinions in a way that can be very constructive.


I also like to make an example of your thoughts on abortion thread:

The first post in a thread is an invitation for other people to join a topic of your choosing. This means that you have to make it a good place for other people to join that discussion and give people an opportunity to make constructive posts without entering a pit fight.

However, in your first post you post something in a very negative way and make it sound like that is the truth while in fact it is a rather more complex issue. Especially the "I wonder why its legal to kill unborn babies" is an open invitation for people to react in a harsh way, just like you started it. Action = reaction.

A better way to start that discussion is to recognize that the topic you are gonna post about is a divided topic among people. If you know that beforehand then you can state in the first part of your opening post that you know this is a hard issue and that many people will probably have a thorough opinion about it. Then make it clear that you would like to have a civil debate about it and that you will do your best to look at all the reactions with a clear and nonjudgmental mind and that you prefer that others will do that too.

This way you take the heat away beforehand instead of putting oil on the fire.


Debating, even about opinions, is not a problem. Preaching, that IS a problem.


Kind regards,

The Traveler

 

[gibran2]

I think this was my problem, when I think of evidence I think of what I consider to be evidence and not what everyone else might think it is. For me my personal experience counts as evidence, this is why I've clashed with people.

I realize now that this is a science based forum and my opinions shouldn't be discussed here unless I can offer 'proof' as to the reasons I have them... well they can be discussed but they will usually generate hostility witch is better avoided.

There’s no need for proof when sharing an opinion, belief, or subjective state. Just be clear in such cases to state that it’s your opinion, belief, or subjective state.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions and beliefs, and one’s subjective state isn’t open to debate.

 

[Jin]

I think this was my problem, when I think of evidence I think of what I consider to be evidence and not what everyone else might think it is. For me my personal experience counts as evidence, this is why I've clashed with people.

I realize now that this is a science based forum and my opinions shouldn't be discussed here unless I can offer 'proof' as to the reasons I have them... well they can be discussed but they will usually generate hostility witch is better avoided.

hey rayoflight , i read much of your posts and they no doubt generate some friction , however i consider you opinions are valuable and much needed to generate variety ,

nexus is no doubt a science based forum and we appreciate facts , however we have opinion based posts also like one on abortion and whehther we would like to have childeren and many others and as long as people present their opinions as opinons and not fact , i see no problem with it and neither do any of the nexians i guess

it only generates friction when opinions are presented as facts ,
when i came to this forum , i too had to experience some friction due to not understanding this , however i realised my mistake and started boldly stating my opinions as opinions and not facts and things changed and members started apprecting my posts even if my opinions were totally against their opinion , only when i was trying to express my opinion as facts there was some friction

there is no hostility on this forum the way i see it
sometimes i have written total shit and i am not still banned from the forum (i guess the shit i wrote was a little funny ), this is a good sign i guess , if this forum was anything hostile , i would have been thrown out long back

i guess maybe my posts were of an idiot an year back when i came to the forum (check them out you'll be suprised or shocked ), however thanks to the attitude which i shared with the intelligent members of the forum i am still here , if the wise and the fool share the same attitude they can still be together

i mean some of us might be enlightened and some of us might be fools d me me me:d ) , but the attitude that we have in common holds us together , thats why i say attitude is all and its the best thing we have for our opinions might be different , still we have something in common :lol:

 

[RayOfLight]

Traveler, I agree with you. In the thread on abortion I apologized for not making my opening post in a more tasteful way.

Whenever I state something with no scientific proof I'll be sure to mention that its my opinion and hopefully I can go on discussing things I feel are important and at the same time not create conflict.'

thank you for your understanding .

 

[The Traveler]

Traveler, I agree with you. In the thread on abortion I apologized for not making my opening post in a more tasteful way.

Whenever I state something with no scientific proof I'll be sure to mention that its my opinion and hopefully I can go on discussing things I feel are important and at the same time not create conflict.'

thank you for your understanding .

Thank you RayOfLight.

I think in the future we will see many good threads and posts from you, anyone who is willing to learn can reach great hights.


Kind regards,

The Traveler

 

[dream_denizen]

Someone had PMed me earlier today and I will post most of my reply because I feel that his attitude allowed for me to share some "specifics."

"Anyway, you're on to something. You've generated an idea of usefulness. "...is this what you stand for!? and wwhat are you going to do about it?" This is EXACTLY how I feel. We have a great opportunity to expand awareness since this is such a tight knit community. So here's my proposition. A friend of mine and myself have been onto some really great discussions (aided by psychedelic experience) of quantum mechanics, string theory, alchemy, shamanism etc... We're collaborating our intelligence to push us both forward as universal thinkers. Yesterday, for instance, I shared with him some ideas from a book written in 1978? Called Stalking the Wild Pendulum. I was speaking of vibrational frequencies of atoms and he shared some knowledge of particle entanglement and voila! we now share an understanding of some really strange concept about space."

I couldn't push myself to post this in the Philosophy section because the idea is to combine it all. Understand everything you possibly can about what's happening atomically, cosmically, and everything in between. Isn't that what Stephen Hawking did?

 

[SnozzleBerry]

I'm so confused...help?

 

[a1pha]

 

[dream_denizen]

I'm trying to find people that are on the same page as me. I feel like there is work to be done (and it is, slowly) and it needs better direction. The direction can be influenced by people that have a similar understanding. Yes, these statements may sound vague, but it's the only way I can think of to "shake" the community's attention.

The only way I can work with you is if you work with me. In previous posts I've had trouble finding the right minds to work with, which is where my trouble with the attitudes come into play. The elitist view must go.

Come on folks, there is a great deal of brilliance within the nexus and with the right collective attitude there will be conclusions.

 

[SWIMfriend]

I'm trying to find people that are on the same page as me. I feel like there is work to be done (and it is, slowly) and it needs better direction. The direction can be influenced by people that have a similar understanding. Yes, these statements may sound vague, but it's the only way I can think of to "shake" the community's attention.

The only way I can work with you is if you work with me. In previous posts I've had trouble finding the right minds to work with, which is where my trouble with the attitudes come into play. The elitist view must go.

Come on folks, there is a great deal of brilliance within the nexus and with the right collective attitude there will be conclusions.

Sorry. There's just nothing in your post to respond to (except the unpleasant inference that there's something wrong with people who don't want to "work with you"--even if they don't know what it is you want them to work on!). You are incorrect to believe that vagueness will "shake the community's attention." You are saying NOTHING. Say SOMETHING, and you will perhaps get a response.

EDIT: And watching the vagueness in your posts INCREASE in the face of people telling you they don't know what point you're trying to make, I'm beginning to think that your real intention may be to troll.

 

[gibran2]

I'm trying to find people that are on the same page as me.

It would help if we knew what page you are on.

 

[Hyperdimensional Cuttlefish]

I'm trying to find people that are on the same page as me...The only way I can work with you is if you work with me. In previous posts I've had trouble finding the right minds to work with, which is where my trouble with the attitudes come into play. The elitist view must go.

This is precisely the mindset you decried in previous posts; you say the forum is too single minded, yet you state in this post that you are looking for those who think just like you. Any view that is not your own you brush off as elitist. Examine your views again brother, something needs work.

I would recommend a long introspective journey to resolve this cognitive dissonance. May you find enlightenment in yourself, regardless of the opinions of others. Peace.

 

[dream_denizen]

I'm trying to find people that are on the same page as me...The only way I can work with you is if you work with me. In previous posts I've had trouble finding the right minds to work with, which is where my trouble with the attitudes come into play. The elitist view must go.

This is precisely the mindset you decried in previous posts; you say the forum is too single minded, yet you state in this post that you are looking for those who think just like you. Any view that is not your own you brush off as elitist. Examine your views again brother, something needs work.

I would recommend a long introspective journey to resolve this cognitive dissonance. May you find enlightenment in yourself, regardless of the opinions of others. Peace.

Yessir, you're right. I'm looking for people who don't think like you. There is no dissonance coming from here either, only resonance, I'm only trying to resonate!

 

[distracted]

I feel as though I understand your point, not that I agree.

But do you just perceive that people are not being proactive enough on our spiritual evolution here on the forums? (Correct me if I'm wrong.)

If this is the case you must keep in mind that not everyone comes from the same perspective as you, and some may not even see development in unity (universal conscious n such) as relevant. Although I do and it's a large part of my existence, it is a faith based matter. And instead of a thread that criticizes, you can always start a new topic of your own for discussion of said topics.

Edit: I also like your idea of usefulness and finding a direction. It's what the world needs more of at this point, especially as I see more people waking up and beginning to question more. But if your going to make things focused a post like this isn't the best thing, make a post about what you believe to understand about the world, and the questions that are currently running through your mind so others can brainstorm right along with you. And of course make it clear that it's theoretical, because even if you have directly experienced it, there is still no proof. And it's purely faith-based. Remember there are lots of people who view psychedelics as being all in your head in this world, and not based in reality at all. But neither argument can be proved.

 

[Enoon]

dream_denizen,

from what I can gather from your posts (which isn't much, I'm sorry to say) you are interested in starting discussions within this community about a broad range of topics, trying to weave different topics together in new and creative ways to generate deeper understanding about the fabric of existence?
Not a bad goal, if that is what you're after (and there is quite a bit of guess work on my part to have reached this understanding of your posts). However just like everywhere, if you are interested in something specific you have to lay the foundation for it to start, unless it's already there. Hence, if you want to start this kind of a discussion, perhaps it would be best to start off with a slightly longer first post. There is a reason for example scientific publications always have an abstract a main body and a conclusion (it's to create the setting in which ideas can be communicated and understood) and though there is no need to be so structured here, it makes a big difference if you can give your thoughts some kind of structure and elaborations in order to to communicate them to us in the first place.

Because all of us are all over the place with our minds you will have to add things like motivation and just in general content. There have been really long threads here discussing various crazy and not-so-crazy theories, but we all have limited time available, so people are going to filter what threads are important to them and not.

In general I don't think there is a problem concerning your intent and what you want to discuss with respect to the views and actions of this community. We are interested and ready to engage in any meaningful discussion. However the content of your posts is very meagre and so it's impossible to spark the kind of responses that you desire. You must understand that people are not automatically on the same page when it comes to topics, but they may be very willing and excited to join a good discussion about just what you want to talk about, if only you could invite them properly by giving an introduction to the topic you wish to discuss.

As an idea you could for example introduce the topic(s) you want to discuss (general statements, summary). For further reading you can give a link to wikipedia or some other web-resource, but for the sake of communication I would say the best results will be given if you write your own brief summary of it too.
Then you can go into what questions interest you.
Elaborate on how far you've gotten with your own answers and musings, etc.

This way people will know what you actually want to talk about.

And don't be disappointed if not every post you make gets the resonance you desired. It's a matter of many factors here. sometimes it's just not the right time.

 

[blacklist666]

I propose we make a youtube links section where users can post tons of links to all these other well knowns like McKenna etc, as well as to mp3 files, and direct others to go do their information gathering, but bring back fresh ideas. It’s kind of like throwing out seeds & Getting apples. Perhaps if we had active parts of the forum working on tools of consciousness, and explain recommended ways of gathering data (like recording devices to record your words after a trip) (group tripping between kindred spirits and close intimate friends & alike) as well as a stockpile of material to help users level up their dimensional understanding, then the common levels of reference for users would advance.

I have a group of people I have been working with for some time, and we have our own language practically because we have refined smaller concepts into more refined ones. This way we use fewer words, but convey more. Perhaps Something could be offered (like moderator positions) to Nexians whom come up with good source books themselves containing useful cognitive data users could use to expand their base of awareness.

Make this an organized joint venture into mapping the creative "potentiative" ,-(Made up word, see? I'm good at this! j/k ) facets of the community and of our selves. Should I keep going?

 

[Enoon]

I propose we make a youtube links section where users can post tons of links to all these other well knowns like McKenna etc, as well as to mp3 files, and direct others to go do their information gathering, but bring back fresh ideas. It’s kind of like throwing out seeds & Getting apples. Perhaps if we had active parts of the forum working on tools of consciousness, and explain recommended ways of gathering data (like recording devices to record your words after a trip) (group tripping between kindred spirits and close intimate friends & alike) as well as a stockpile of material to help users level up their dimensional understanding, then the common levels of reference for users would advance.

Personally I'm more interested in what the people I interact with here have to say about things, than some McKenna or whoever else is out there. Certainly their information can inspire, but so can you, and anyone on this forum. We all have our experiences and our unique outlook on the world, our insights and musings, and it is with these that we can establish communication and develop new ideas together... gathering info is only the first step, then you go to arguing and finally you have to go to step 3 - synthesis/development of novel concepts (think of dialectics).

As for the other stuff you mentioned, can you give more concrete examples? Can you elaborate on an example, even if it's not something new - that you think counts as a tool of consciousness? What kind of material for help/understanding do you propose aside from the ongoing support members get from the living community?