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Quidding Is Underrated (Crosspost from Reddit)

stuartroelke

Titanium Teammate
Artist
I shared this experience on Reddit, but also wanted to post it here:

If someone had told me what quidding fresh leaves feels like—especially at a sub-hallucinatory dose comparable to 0.5g-2g of mushrooms—I would have put more effort into growing S. divinorum years ago. After washing the leaves, soak them briefly in a shot of hard alcohol, chew them for as long as possible, and then swallow the shot. About 15 to 30 minutes later, everything becomes indescribably beautiful. My partner and I had a deeply heartfelt conversation and then a fantastically fun night. 10/10, would recommend to anyone. The only downside is that it’s hard to remember the entire experience; it now feels very dreamlike.

EDIT:

I wanted to include this comment about my methods in case anyone was confused or wanted to better understand my approach:

I'm growing outdoors with manure, and rain water splashes mud up at the undergrowth. Rather than wasting the large, healthy, and potent leaves that develop early on (as these often die), I decided to wash them with water and briefly sterilize them in alcohol. This could lower my chances of getting extremely sick from living pathogens.

For some, this may seem like hypervigilance. Others may wonder why I wouldn't just dry the leaves afterward. However, alcohol—in addition to being a solvent—increases permeability and vasodilation in gum tissue (many of us have learned this from other quidding tutorials). Consequently, slowly chewing leaves with a bit of residual alcohol seems to increase potency, allowing the use of fewer leaves. I recommend holding it between your teeth for at least ten seconds between each chew.

At this point, one could argue that taking the shot is unnecessary and, as you mentioned, could "contaminate" the experience. However—just as alcohol extracts THC by stripping potent trichomes from leaf surfaces—I feel that said alcohol has become infused with more Salvinorin. It could be a placebo effect. Honestly, I don't know for sure.

Now, to the opinionated part of this methodology: I do not believe that one drink will significantly alter a psychedelic experience. Anyone who has combined alcohol with mushrooms or LSD will likely tell you that you can imbibe a dangerous amount because the effects of intoxication are lessened. Personally, I find that salvia has a similar ability to "sober" someone up.

Regarding my own philosophies, I often use entheogens outside of traditional contexts. I feel that plants are tools, and the sacrament lies in the decision to respect, research, grow, and ingest them with intent. For me, combining various substances has more to do with psychology and physical interaction than spirituality (i.e. don't mix Bupropion with MAOIs, you might need to take more mushrooms when on Escitalopram, THC is not recommended for those with specific mental disorders, &c).

My ultimate aim is to use less plant matter while achieving a comparable level of spiritual development.
 
I enjoy quidding as well. I've been growing salvia recognita and salvia glutinosa for extracts for tinctures but haven't gotten around to trying them yet
Please let me know how that goes! I did not know other species could potentially contain salvinorin.
 
I agree! Most people these days when they think of Salvia think of horror or brief intense confusion, because most Americans and other gringos are familiar with the smoked method.

Little do they know, they could have a much better time...
 
The best time to quid 2-3 fresh leaves is immediately after drinking Ayahuasca. The salvia will peak when the caapi hits and the interplay between the two is incredible. The DMT illuminates everything salvia brings to the table, but it's more comprehensible than smoked much in the way oral dmt is easier to navigate than smoked. It's slower and gives you more time to ask questions.

One time I was quidding in the dark, after drinking Ayahuasca. When I took the quid out to replace it with a new one, there were ?? shamans ?? around me. As I put the quid into my mouth, I could feel their fingers pushing all the leaves into my mouth, and then they blew a massive cloud of smoke into my face and disappeared. It was intensely real.

One of the things I've come to appreciate about salvia is her unique perspective, which I think in part comes from the way she grows. The plant can fall over and reroot itself upside down. It's a plant that does cartwheels. She can teach you to see a problem from any angle.

I spent a lot of time with Aya when I was searching for answers related to things with my health. This is the tl;dr synposis of a months long adventure, but I was repeatedly taken to a place with a switchboard that I think may have been representative of motor neuron function. I couldn't make sense of it until I got lucky, and was taken again to the same place, but on a journey where I had decided to quid. Salvia gave me a perceptive power where I was able to view the same thing, but from different angles, different areas, and from a distance. The switchboard was what I needed to protect, which was what Aya was telling me; but I couldn't see what was attacking the switchboard until I could zoom out and look around, which never ever happened until I bought salvia along for the journey.

Smoking salvia never made any sense to me. One time my head turned into a paper bag being crumbled and that was it.

Although I heard another person describe the smoked experience as exchanging consciousness with the object of focus. With that end communion being an objective, I understand how that specific ROA could fulfill that intention.

I find myself often wondering, if a plant can speak, literally, how would they speak? How do you break that language barrier? In the case of salvia, is it not an exchange of the viewer and the viewed, whether biologically alive or not?

Salvia is so deep and it kills me how little info there is about her, in comparison to so many other plants.

She also told me once that if I grew enough plants to cover my entire body and lie down in them (while quidding), they would take me to the underworld. I don't have the space for that many plants, but it's the reason I'm so interested in perfecting a method of sublingual lozenge making.
 
Have you tried Zebbie’s corn starch method? It’s something I intend to explore when my ayahuasca/anahuasca/vaporhuasca explorations are at a further stage, maybe in a year or two. Seems promising.

Maybe salvia-vaporhuasca is something worth exploring as well.
Hm, the next thing on my list would be to look into information regarding possible salvia e-juice formulations. Would these tend more in the direction of the smoked/vaped type experience, or the quidded? Has sal-a solubility in PG been tested?
 
I am working on a long term project of integrating Salvia absconditiflora into rue+phragmites brew. So far I have one successful experience of drinking them all as a single tea together, and the healing+afterglow was heavenly. To the brew, this sage adds another lens, bringing sensitivity to more subtle energies, be it in the form of insights or visions. Also, a magnificent heart opening. Other than that, once I tried eating a large amount of this sage after drinking rue. İt was crazy ecstatic throughout the whole body, made me dance uncontrollably.
 
Sage is a delicate connection to self, especially to emotions. And it is a wise teacher. DMT is intelligence and opening to the outer spirit world. DMT cleanses you by shaking up your psyche and energy body. Sage is like a switch automatically turning off your neuroses, a source of absolute contentment.
 
@dithyramb It's interesting to hear how others describe the difference in the nature of experiences. One thing I have noticed that is unique to salvia, the messages she sends are always pragmatic, often relevant to integrating in the real world, with a focus on the real world, and a slightly cynical tinge. I've never experienced the cynicism with any other plants, and if I need tough love, I feel like salvia is the one to ask.

One time when I drank Ayahuasca, I had a vision of the most beautiful society, where ancient wisdom fused with modern technology, plants and civilization became inseparable, and it looked like an Android Jones interpretation of cyberpunk NYC meets Ferngully. There was a huge emphasis on "this is what's possible if you distribute wealth, the whole world is enriched when you enrich the lives of society's poorest members."

Meanwhile, Salvia has told me things like late stage capitalism is like a rotten tree about to fall, and collapse is inevitable. But as long as I'm not in the direct path of the tree when it collapses, I'll be fine (so stay out of the way).

Also, do keep us posted on your work with Salvia absconditiflora! 😍

Edit to add: I do think there's also a point at which we (as in ourselves) are inseparable from our dialogue with plants :unsure:
 
Hi @ms_manic_minxx, salvia is very practical and pragmatic in my experience too, and what a contrast this is with aya and analogues which usually deliver grandiose visions and inspiration. İn the end Ayahuasca feeds the imagination and is more prone to being involved in delusions (mapacho is the required grounder/straightener for Ayahuasca according to amazonian tradition, and Ayahuasca is never used without mapacho traditionally). Salvia is concerned with immediate practical steps; it's very sober in comparison.

I'm not sure if in your post you implied that my interpretation of salvia is different from yours. I doubt it is. Of course there is the species factor, and absconditiflora I find warmer and more heart centered. İt creates a connection to animal spirits, and a remarkable empathic sense to everything. Once it made me feel like I was synchronously experiencing the same thoughts and emotions as my young toddler. İt is found in infinite abundance where I harvest it, and it seems to really be unlocked when combined with rue; and of course I use the rue that I harvest from the same land.

I've been experimenting with leaves of S. absconditiflora up to this year. This year I only harvested flowers which have proven themselves to be active, and when I get the conditions, I will be experimenting with them. I even suspect seeds to be active; this sage produces copious amounts of large seeds, in contrast with divinorum, but I am not clear if it would make sense for diterpenes to be produced in seeds. Anybody with knowledge in botany and phytochemistry feel free to chime in. Flowers might be "cleaner" than leaves according to my experiments thus far.
 
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Sorry, I kinda fell off the bandwagon and stopped getting notifications for a bit.

I'm very interested in people's experiences mixing salvia use with ayahuasca, as some art inspired by aya feels more like salvia to me.
I'll have to test that eventually.

As with most psychedelic compounds, salvia seems to be potentiated by marijuana and subdues the noticeable effects of drunkenness.

Today I want to try quidding with harmalas. The MAOI will not affect the metabolism, but I am curious if there is any noticeable synergy.

Eventually I want to test accessible CES1 inhibitors—like CBD, loperamide, and quercetin—to see if those substances might prevent salvinorin A (active) from metabolizing into salvinorin B (inactive). Ingesting blended leaves has a long history in Mazatec shamanism, but I personally did not feel anything from that method of administration (even when relying on lecithin to improve bioavailability).

I have high hopes for a combination of either loperamide or CBD with 2g of lecithin. Hopefully I will be able to test one of those combinations this weekend.
 
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