[Report(s)] A warning to my fellow psychonauts regarding hyperspace entities (wall of text alert!)

[blig-blug]

I can make a drugs cocktail of MDMA, cocaine, crystal meth and heroine in the right proportion and give it to a naïve person who never took drugs. This person will feel an extreme extasy and empowerment, all problems will go away. The naïve person will feel like he is in heaven

Can you? What is the right proportion? That mix sounds like asking for trouble. Or are "MDMA, cocaine, crystal meth and heroin" just stand-in words for "drugs that I believe worthless but that will make anyone feel good"?

 

[northape]

@AstraLex
Oh my God, where to start here???
I'd advise you to look into the difference between faith and belief.

However, believing and knowing are two different concepts.

No kidding. True knowing transcends beliefs. Beliefs are mental and a form of conceptual bias.
Faith, on the other hand, accepts the unknown and leaps toward an unclear goal.

However, the question remains: what are those entities then? This question can only be answered through a belief. Most people on dmt-nexus who actually care to ask this question, usually come with one of the four answers I mentioned in my previous post.

For whom does the question remain? It looks like you need some answers.
Furthermore, it looks like you want to use these answers to “strengthen your belief system.”

No need to comment further. Try to have an open mind and stop preaching. You look like any other fundamentalist at this point.
He who has ears to hear, let him hear

 

[Exitwound]

I agree with the first part of your statement. God is everywhere and in everything. As one of the most important Orthodox Christian prayers to the Holy Spirit goes: “O Heavenly King, the Comforter, the Spirit of Truth, Who art everywhere and fillest all things; Treasury of Blessings, and Giver of Life - come and abide in us, and cleanse us from every impurity, and save our souls, O Good One.”

The second part of your statement is discussable. Void means a complete emptiness, “nothingness”, while I believe God to be the opposite – “the fullness” (for a lack of a better term). God is the only true living Being, while we (and entire universe) are no-thing (void, empty, non-existent) without Him.

Let me clarify, for me it has become a simple logic exercise, postulate that is so obvious, that it doesn't need any proof once you "feel" it.

There is no point of concept "void" in absence of observer. If something observes that there is "void" (absence of all things) then simultaneously there is no void, because there is also said observer, which made this observation.
So the void, gives birth to an observer, which is for me a "big bang". And thinker, thought and the process of thinking the though - all are born from the void. Because if there was only void, there would be it and nothing else (and we wouldn't be having this interesting discussion on the internet forums).
Since we have non-void situation as given (we are talking here after all), hence the observation is true.
Hope all that makes sense for the reader.

Michael, Gabriel, Raphael and Uriel are archangels in the Christian tradition also. Can you elaborate on how you (and your ancestors) see/saw them?

I've read the Bible at the young age, but it didn't give much sense. As a child I have viewed them no more than a fairy tales, with very questionable protagonists and decisions by them.
I have came back to the 4 archangels, actually through Magick teachings. These names are at a center of these teachings, which aren't that far from classical Christianity - I'd say that modern Magick teachings are amalgam of all that we try to know about the Divine and Unknown.
I was very skeptical about the whole shebang, but it helped me a lot to ground myself and to find protection.
LBRP was very helpful to establish ground and to feel safe. Maybe that's just psychology stuff, but I don't discern psychology and the Greater Picture these days.

In my opinion, God does not equal to His creation. Even though He is “everywhere and fillest all things”, He is also outside of His creation and no creature (be it angels, demons or humans) is a part of Him. He is like a writer of a book (with the book meaning the entire creation). Even though the writer writes every letter in a book, no letter is a part of the writer’s being.

I respectfully disagree. I think that God is the creation and everything we see, touch or experience is God. In our world, "what we do" and "what we are" might seem as a different things, but I think that this is part of illusion and nothing can be "not part of God", as nothing can exist outside of God by definition. I agree that certain actors inside God system can be given free will (there are degrees though) and All needs to be experienced. This is where we get "good" or "bad".
Seeing everything as a part of God, even the darkest and more twisted things, makes more sense to me. God might have bias towards "good" and might be helpful to think so, but I don't see any proof for that. I think, God just IS, and "good" or "bad" are mortal concepts.

By the way, how do you know that an experience is “heavenly” or “divine”? What is your standard to which you can compare that experience? For example, I can make a drugs cocktail of MDMA, cocaine, crystal meth and heroine in the right proportion and give it to a naïve person who never took drugs. This person will feel an extreme extasy and empowerment, all problems will go away. The naïve person will feel like he is in heaven. But is he? Or did I trick him? How would he tell the difference between a true heaven and a drugs induced extasy

That's a tough question - I don't know. We can only compare stuff we encounter in hyperspace to the material world feelings and that's where it stems from.
What I meant, is akin to when you see child's joy - you can often see that it is pure, without any back though, just enjoying the moment, without any doubt. I am relating to similar moments, where you just feel that this is it, "the love".
It probably was wrong of me to refer to non-ecstatic states as non-divine. They are actually also divine, but in non-materialistically-pleasing way, also by my definition, that everything is a part of God.

Maybe because the dark experiences were the real deal and the so called “divine” experiences were a trickery?

Maybe, who can say for sure? But I also don't think that God is biased towards the "bad", so I don't see how it is viable to dwell on such thoughts, unless you share the viewpoint, that we are shrouded by a "Demogorgon" and are living in a torturous dimension.
Even if that was a case, I think you can see past the shroud, because again - nothing can be outside of God by my viewpoint, we are all part of IT.

 

[mcgettums]

The only entity I've encountered on dmt was on an intense breakthrough that I had on a 50 mg dose that i did in one hit.

I closed my eyes and unlike most trips, where i feel encompassed by the dmt experience, i saw only darkness and in the distance moving towards me was a single rectangular frame containing the complex and colorful geometries I'm used to seeing. As the frame grew bigger, i tried to make out exactly what i was seeing but before i could focus... BOOM. I felt weightless and realized that i was in a very distant part of space. In front of me was a perfect sphere made of pure light, about an arm length away that was the size of a beach ball.

When i looked to the left of the light, i saw my eleven year old son's face and I thought to myself "wow, what a beautiful universe" I then noticed that the sphere reacted to this thought, with slight, spike-like protusions coming out of it briefly before becoming smooth again. Immediately looking back to the left, i noticed my son's face start to slowly fade away and i began to panic. I looked further towards the left, and i could see my wife (who was actually sitting next to me on our couch, also on a dmt trip) and she made a gesture to me to "go on" the same way that someone would if they were reminding an actor on stage that they had a line, rolling their hand in front of their chest. At this point i felt an incredible urgency to declare in words, how much i loved my children, and that if I was somehow successful in making the perfect, verbal declaration, everything in the entire universe would collapse back into a singularity as it was before the big bang occurred. If unsuccessful, my son would fade as if he had never existed at all. As i frantically began making these statements (which i was now actually yelling according to my wife) i noticed the sphere reacting with increasing intensity. At this point i realized that i had been tricked into this position by this thing in front of me, and that i had been preparing for that moment my entire life. After about a dozen failed attempts, i said "I love my beautiful children, more than everything that has ever or will ever exist in the entire univ..." at that exact moment, i felt my dog's cold, wet nose on my hand and my eyes sprung open. I had my head back and i was looking at our living room ceiling as it was being rendered from nothing, then i looked over at my wife, her eyes were as big as saucers "babe, you were yelling" to which i replied "please call my son up, i need to see him" she called to him and i heard his footsteps coming up the stairs which was an incredible relief, and when he appeared at the top i called him over and gave him the biggest hug and told him how much i loved him.

DMT is an incredible experience, and I'm pretty sure that my dog saved an entire universe.

 

[AstraLex]

Hey there,

Can you? What is the right proportion? That mix sounds like asking for trouble. Or are "MDMA, cocaine, crystal meth and heroin" just stand-in words for "drugs that I believe worthless but that will make anyone feel good"?

This “mix of drugs” was meant to imply that there are artificial ways of producing an experience that one could see as “mystical” and “divine” in the absence of a standard for this kind of experiences. Another example would be young people who could mistakenly see lust-based toxic relationship for a “true love”, simply because they have no standard – they have never experienced a true love before.

However, if you are curious, the mix of various drugs (including, but not limited to, MDMA, cocaine, crystal meth, 3-MMC, 4-MMC and Viagra) is heavily used in the Party and Play (chemsex) circuit. The participants report that this creates a heavenly experience and they indulge in orgies that can last for days. However, the ex-participants report that those “heavenly divine” experiences were largely an illusion.

I'd advise you to look into the difference between faith and belief.

I have looked this up. The Google AI said: “While the terms are often used interchangeably, faith and belief have distinct meanings. Belief is an intellectual acceptance of something as true, while faith is a deeper, more active trust and commitment that often involves action, even in the absence of complete proof.”

So, how does this prove or disprove my point that there are 4 main ways how people on dmt-nexus understand the nature of the entities?

True knowing transcends beliefs.

And how do you know that you have obtained a “true knowing”? How do you define a “true knowing”? How do you derive a so called “true knowing” from your personal, subjective experience?

Beliefs are mental and a form of conceptual bias. Faith, on the other hand, accepts the unknown and leaps toward an unclear goal.

Do you imply here that you have no beliefs whatsoever and always act purely on faith? Because this cannot be true according to Google AI: “All humans have beliefs. Beliefs are fundamental to how we understand and interact with the world, shaping our thoughts, actions, and interpretations of reality.”

Or do you imply that when considering the psychedelic experience you somehow disable your inherent ability to form beliefs and ride solely on faith? And what about the sober integration part, when your ego fully restores – do you think that you are still absolutely objective and no belief system you have obtained prior from books, articles, movies and podcasts interacts with how you interpret the psychedelic experience?

For whom does the question remain?

For literally everybody who is curious about the nature of DMT hyperspace and it’s inhabitants.

It looks like you need some answers.

Of course I do. I was, I am and I will always be a seeker. I am always looking for truth. This is the reason I have become a part of dmt-nexus community 15 years ago.

Furthermore, it looks like you want to use these answers to “strengthen your belief system.”

Updating the belief system is a more correct term. I am long past the age when I thought that I know the truth and have to defend my truth by al means necessary. Of course, I have my own faith, which is not a subject of change. I believe in God, for example, and it will remain so no matter what other people may say. However, the way I perceive God may, or may not, change based on my interaction with other human beings.

Try to have an open mind and stop preaching. You look like any other fundamentalist at this point.

Don’t you worry. I preach only in the church or Christian gatherings. Here, on dmt-nexus, I only share my experiences and opinions and listen to other people’s stories.

He who has ears to hear, let him hear

I couldn’t agree more!

So the void, gives birth to an observer, which is for me a "big bang". And thinker, thought and the process of thinking the though - all are born from the void.

Well, this is actually a concept I can’t wrap my mind around. Where does the void comes from in the first place? How does a formless nothingness form a singular thinker/observer? I mean, when I look at the micro or the macro cosmos, I see that it is exceptionally clever designed. How could a void do such a thing all of itself?

For me, it is much more convenient to think that there must be somebody/something with an intelligence, who is completely outside of the creation, who created the void, the big bang and the observer(s) in the first place.

LBRP was very helpful to establish ground and to feel safe.

Thank you for pointing out the Lesser Banishing Ritual of the Pentagram – it was new to me. Now I have looked up the meaning on Google and read some reports on Reddit from the people who practice it daily. Now I understand your connection to the archangels.

Well, if it works for you – who am I to judge? The practice of magick would not be suitable for me though. Not only because I have certain beliefs about the entities I may encounter, but because it lies outside of my interest. Magick, as I understand it, is all about creating your own reality or influencing the objective reality. I am primarily interested in what lies beyond the reality and the creation as a whole. I am looking for the source of everything - the Creator.

I think that God is the creation and everything we see, touch or experience is God. In our world, "what we do" and "what we are" might seem as a different things, but I think that this is part of illusion and nothing can be "not part of God", as nothing can exist outside of God by definition.

I think the “what we do” = “what we are” principle only applies to those parts of the creation, that do not have a free will. Like an atom of hydrogen. An atom of hydrogen is an atom of hydrogen and all it does, is being an atom of hydrogen. A human being is a human being, but what he/she does is all up to the person. Of course, the circumstances predetermine what a person will do in any given situation, but there is always this component of a free will, which brings an element of uncertainty, a superposition, in the otherwise deterministic universe.

By the way, let’s assume that God exists in a way that I described – as somebody/something completely outside of the creation. But the creation is a perfect representation of His innate nature. There is no other creation possible as it already contains every single possibility – infinite number of galaxies, stars, planets, parallel universes, other dimensions and what not. And it’s infinitely ever-expanding. How would you tell the difference between the creation and the Creator?

I think that the Big Bang points to that difference. The creation has a definite starting point: it all started 13.787±0.02 billion years ago. While the Creator has no starting point – He just is. At least for me it is a much more plausible explanation than the simple “the creation always existed” (which is not, see Big Bang) or “the creation created itself” (what was before the Big Bang then?). Bringing God into the equation, as somebody/something Who always was, the only One who actually exists, the Creator, solves the puzzle for me.

All needs to be experienced. This is where we get "good" or "bad". Seeing everything as a part of God, even the darkest and more twisted things, makes more sense to me. God might have bias towards "good" and might be helpful to think so, but I don't see any proof for that. I think, God just IS, and "good" or "bad" are mortal concepts.

Well, sure “good” and “bad” are moral (mortal) constructs. It becomes evident if we look at how the definition of “good” and “bad” changed over time. For example, how we view slavery, colonialism and war. But I think that God has a plan for the creation and for our part in the grand scheme of things in His beloved creation.

For instance, there was an extended period of time when it was “good” to go around, starting wars, murdering people just for the sake of it. It was also “good” to forcefully assimilate neighboring tribes, by killing all boys, men and women and enslaving all the girls. But now, we, as a humanity, have begun to outgrow this stage of the Grand Plan. Now we believe it to be immoral and thus “bad”. We are now in transition to the next stage so to speak. In Christian terminology the next stage is called the Kingdome of Heaven. What lies beyond that stage is unknown and most likely uncomprehensible for us now. Like a caterpillar can not understand how it is to be a butterfly and fly around.

What I meant, is akin to when you see child's joy - you can often see that it is pure, without any back though, just enjoying the moment, without any doubt. I am relating to similar moments, where you just feel that this is it, "the love".

I like this comparison, for I have a small child myself and can totally relate to purely enjoying the moment. However, I also see him change over time. There was a time when he truly and genuinely enjoyed opening the cupboards and breaking all the glasses and boards in it by smashing them to the ground. Now he has outgrown that phase and moved to his next stage. Now he enjoys riding on his kick scooter. I can imagine that this phase will end too at some point.

Can the same logic apply to the DMT entities “love”? Once thought to be pure and desirable and at some point one outgrows it and sees it more as an abusive and toxic relationship, based solely on lust?

At this point i realized that i had been tricked into this position by this thing in front of me, and that i had been preparing for that moment my entire life.

Quite a profound “do or die” moment you had there.

I'm pretty sure that my dog saved an entire universe.

I had a good laugh when I read this bottom line

Gods blessings!

 

[northape]

@AstraLex, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear” implies hearing with your Heart, in my opinion.
My original message was pointed at the character you created with a specific set of beliefs.
As long as you think that's all that you are, I can only do so much. I don't really have enough energy to argue or play games today.

In all honesty, I wish you all the best, much Love, and a peaceful and content life.
May Christ guide you Home. Amen

 

[blig-blug]

This “mix of drugs” was meant to imply that there are artificial ways of producing an experience that one could see as “mystical” and “divine” in the absence of a standard for this kind of experiences. Another example would be young people who could mistakenly see lust-based toxic relationship for a “true love”, simply because they have no standard – they have never experienced a true love before.

However, if you are curious, the mix of various drugs (including, but not limited to, MDMA, cocaine, crystal meth, 3-MMC, 4-MMC and Viagra) is heavily used in the Party and Play (chemsex) circuit. The participants report that this creates a heavenly experience and they indulge in orgies that can last for days. However, the ex-participants report that those “heavenly divine” experiences were largely an illusion.

I think it's a confusion of terms. The experience may be "heavenly" and "divine" in the sense of extremely pleasurable, but that has very little to do with any transcendence. And the same mix is also likely to produce extremely unpleasant experiences for other people or in different situations. Even with stimulants set and setting count. I personally tend to dislike stimulants, and that mix would likely induce a very bad experience in me.

Some people like stimulants, opioids etc too much. Some people are able to use them in a productive manner. And some other people can't handle them or don't want to. There's no mix of substances that can guarantee what you call "a divine experience" (that seems to just mean a very pleasurable experience) for every person in every situation. If you found a mix that gave you a lot of pleasure I'm happy for you, but it doesn't work the same for everyone. If you were "naive" and thought that pleasure somehow approached divinity but were later disappointed, I'm sorry. But none of that generalizes.

So, what's the point?

 

[blig-blug]

Where does the void comes from in the first place?

Where does God come from in the first place? Why can God be out of creation but a Void or whatever else one may propose can't? Quite arbitrary.

Choose different axioms, choose different rules, and you'll get a different result. It can be an entertaining exercise, but I don't think it'll lead to any truth. A lot of ink has been spilled on these questions over the ages, and in the end it hasn't made anything more clear. It has produced different sets of arguments to defend a posteriori certain views one already has accepted, though. That seems to lead people who buy into them to feeling more certain about these questions without actually getting closer to any truth. Fine if you like that, but as they said in the 60s, "not my trip".

 

[northape]

It's supposed to be good, but I haven't read it yet.

 

[s2cndchance]

as well as some others that seemed familiar or more generally archetypal but difficult to identify (cosmic serpents, dragons, chimeras, etc.).

How did I not read this trip report till now! This is awesome. I've had much a similar experience with insidiously nice, attractive, or grand entities, total posers in the end, but to strong effect.

And if you're still around, have you ever seen Kirin-like beings during your trips? Thanks.

Edit: there seems to be some skepticism as to the truthiness of the original poster? Well, in any case, though I never had encounters with so many simultaneously distinct, discernable and memorably unique types of beings as OP, my experience did follow the trend of beings using assumption, appearance, memory, and good feelings as tools to deceive. I can't speak for him but I'll vote that the concern is very real.