Sitter affected by the energy?

[entheogenadvocate]

Hello all,

Has anyone else had experiences where their sitter ended up feeling some affects from the DMT, due to the amount of energy and/or spirits released by opening a portal into hyperspace? My sitter was once overcome with emotion to the point of tears from being in the room while I was traveling. It was a pretty intense experience for him considering he had never done any psychedelics, and was simply there to ensure my safety.

I know James Oroc talks about an experience in his book Tryptamine Palace where his sitter was literally able to see the spirit from his trip (which happened to be the soul of James' friend that had just died in a car accident). I'm not a scientist, but I know some of you out there are. How would you begin to explain the transfer of energy?


Thank you in advance for your replies.

 

[eqt146]

[removed]

 

[Pet]

Well I've heard of a contact high, where one feels high when around high people. I've never heard of this with DMT though. I think it's more psychological or spiritual/energy-based in explanation though, it's not likely that your sitter was feeling direct effects from DMT. Were you exhibiting strong emotions or body language during your trip, something that could have triggered intense emotions or memories in those around you? Is your friend able to explain what he/she felt during the experience or what triggered that state of mind? I could imagine being in the presence of someone having such an intense experience could possibly cause me to feel very strong emotions as well, even if I'd never tried any psychedelics before.

 

[endlessness]

Yeah contact high does seem to happen often enough. Maybe there are several types of contact high and variables behind it? A few possibilities:

1- The people who claim to feel effects without taking anything are lying
2- " are tripping
3 " are unconsciously picking up on muscle tension/gestures/odor/etc and the brain might have some kind of natural 'consciousness/emotional synchronizing' mechanisms (could be an evolutionary advantage, to not waste cognitive effort on thinking how others are but just adjusting consciousness to those around through perception of non-verbal communication and signs')
4- " were in silence or in a comfortable space with someone else that had his/her consciousness changed, so this made the sitter think about self-introspection and this lead to letting go of emotional tensions which released an intense discharge, and intense life/emotional experiences in general can almost feel like tripping
5- Consciousness is some kind of field that is not encapsulated in our brain but rather spreads out over space (space-time?) and can affect at distance, through some kind of consciousness phase-harmonizing mechanism
6- It was a coincidence that they had a strong emotional experience while someone was tripping in the same place

Maybe there are other possible explanations we can think of?

 

[Pet]

Possibility #5 is a good one! I wanted to suggest this, but was afraid of sounding crazy . But if you think of us humans as not having concrete physical boundaries, then three people in one room for example are really just one mass of matter with variations in density and brain signals that give us the illusion of being separate masses. And if one brain were to resonate a certain way (eg. gamma brain waves), who's to say that this resonance doesn't resonate beyond the skull of one person, through the air, and into the brains of others, especially when one mind is altered by a chemical substance that may enable it to transmit or receive these "resonances" more thoroughly?

It's a bit far-fetched, but this theory would also explain how some people have telepathy or shared hallucinations while under the influence of certain entheogens.

 

[entheogenadvocate]

#5 is where I'm at with this one:d

 

[endlessness]

Yeah it can be interesting to think about philosophically. But my point is that there are several possibilities and unless we think of some tests to experiment, its impossible to know, and not of much benefit to believe a priori in one or the other imo.

Would be interesting to test if the same sitter gets the same contact-high every single time. And if not, why not? And if so, then maybe once trying to substitute DMT for some other product in the smoking apparatus without the sitter's knowledge, and see if sitter still claims effects or not (at least this would eliminate the lying possibility). Would be interesting too to get a brain-scan of contact-high people to see if it changes in relation to normal state, if it resembles tripping.

Another thing, if it is this consciousness field, it will raise more question than answers. For example, why do we not get drunk when around drunk people, or so on? Why can we not read people's minds or have access to their memory if all our consciousness is getting into a coherent state with another's? Why does contact high only happen at some points with certain people?

Just a few questions that come to mind...

 

[justine]

Yeah contact high does seem to happen often enough. Maybe there are several types of contact high and variables behind it? A few possibilities:

1- The people who claim to feel effects without taking anything are lying
2- " are tripping
3 " are unconsciously picking up on muscle tension/gestures/odor/etc and the brain might have some kind of natural 'consciousness/emotional synchronizing' mechanisms (could be an evolutionary advantage, to not waste cognitive effort on thinking how others are but just adjusting consciousness to those around through perception of non-verbal communication and signs')
4- " were in silence or in a comfortable space with someone else that had his/her consciousness changed, so this made the sitter think about self-introspection and this lead to letting go of emotional tensions which released an intense discharge, and intense life/emotional experiences in general can almost feel like tripping
5- Consciousness is some kind of field that is not encapsulated in our brain but rather spreads out over space (space-time?) and can affect at distance, through some kind of consciousness phase-harmonizing mechanism
6- It was a coincidence that they had a strong emotional experience while someone was tripping in the same place

Maybe there are other possible explanations we can think of?

Interesting proposition, it could be related to mirror neurons.

 

[Enoon]

Aside from thinking it's a mystery field of an energy we cannot measure or detect one could conjecture that transmissions of consciousness could still occur on a subliminal level - as suggested #3. This might not even be a real transmission but simply an input to the other person - he's hearing breathing patterns change, body temperature change, etc and these little changes could affect the way he feels - just like when a dog senses your fear, he gets tense - maybe when a human senses someone elses change in consciousness an inclination to a shift occurs as well. If one is receptive perhaps this can result in a noticeable effect.

That being said I once took pharma with someone else meditating in the room. He said that he felt very strange when I came up which he could tell by my breathing. Who knows what that means and what made it happen.

 

[entheogenadvocate]

Its going to be hard for me to do, because I really enjoy completing my rituals by myself because it allows me to really let go. However, I am planning to have a group ritual this weekend to usher some close friends into their first hyperspace experience. During this ritual, I will attempt to have such an intense experience that the energies/spirits/entities have a large enough portal to try to affect those around me. I will keep you guys updated on how it goes and what I find out or am able to repeat through multiple journeys.

 

[Pandora]

Within my limited personal field of observation and experience of the "contact high" phenomenon, it is real. I don't know the causative agency. The level of intoxication/impairment is typically less than that experienced by the person consuming the psychoactive material.

My husband gets contact highs all the time. He gets visuals if he hangs in my tripping room (while I'm tripping) for more than 10 minutes. He could hardly believe what happened to him the first time I tried LSDMT and he sat around smoking pot. He felt like he got taken or dragged along, especially into the DMT part.

My most recent experience was at a Further festival last year. I had been walking around, being social, admittedly smoking a lot of pot, when it suddenly dawned upon me that a.) everyone around me was tripping, b.) I was tripping but at a lower, extremely euphoric level and c.) I hadn't dosed anything stronger than B+ quality cannabis. By the time I met back up with my husband, he asked me if I had taken anything.

Using only my husband's and my own experiences as a guide, the phenomenon appears to be an EXTREME manifestation of super-in-tune empathy to me. Being a married couple for 22 years brings this on naturally for Nemo Amicus and I. Being old Deadheads and feeling very comfortable in festival mileaus can also.

It may also be a kind of "peer pressure" operating at less than conscious levels. I am reminded of the phenomenon of perfectly adjusted, high functioning people "acting crazy" if they spend extended visitation times in a locked-ward for active psychotics. You know, when with "crazies" act crazy, when with trippers, trip . . . something like that.

Just a few thoughts.

 

[entheogenadvocate]

Pandora... I like your vibe. I've seen your posts pop up multiple times now and they never cease to put a smile on my face. I hope you have a great day and on my next journey, I will attempt to send great vibes your way. Send me a message if you randomly enter a trance in the next few days and you dont know why:d

 

[kyrolima]

I seriously believe that we mirror the people around us.
So if somebody is tripping hard, our emotional system will react to that too.
It is called mirror neurons.

 

[sheepie]

There's a certain "releasing" feeling that happens when you detach from your ego. My mother is a psychologist and it happens with her and her clients sometimes. They would be complaining and complaining about how their life sucks, and then at one point, it all hits them. My mother says it feels like a lightness just fills the room (in terms of weight). Everything feels free. They're freedom is, in some way, contagious. I think states of consciousness communicate over some sort of... life energy exchange. We're all connected through consciousness. We can all affect each other. I've also read this in some spiritual books. IE: Remember Be Here Now by Ram Dass

 

[Valid&Clear]

The mind is very powerful. More often than not in placebo controlled trials the people receiving a sugar pill or whatever will show or feel "improvement", sometimes more than the drug being tested (I would assume this would be a discovery of a truly faulty drug)
yea that's not really related, just trying to point out your mind is capable of very powerful things. the question is how to control it?

3 " are unconsciously picking up on muscle tension/gestures/odor/etc and the brain might have some kind of natural 'consciousness/emotional synchronizing' mechanisms (could be an evolutionary advantage, to not waste cognitive effort on thinking how others are but just adjusting consciousness to those around through perception of non-verbal communication and signs')

What a tantalizing suggestion

 

[TheSelfBehindTheShadow]

This may sound cliche' but everything has it's own respective vibratory frequency in Hz. The state of being induced by smoking spice should be no exception. If your sitter was already in a somewhat similar mindset when you smoked it, it could be possible that your structural resonances were similar enough to play off of each other and made a "psychic chord" of sorts. This isn't the first I've heard of something like this happening. Once, my friends all blasted off in the downstairs of a house, and the people upstairs felt the energy so strongly that they had to go downstairs and comment.

Also it's been documented in neuroscience that when someone watches someone else do something, their neurons behave similarly as though they were actually experiencing it themselves. There's a video on TED about it, actually. Something like "The Empathic Society." I think

 

[Tigeress]

SWIM, has felt this too,
the dmt spirit actually got mad at she, for the person smoking it didnt respect it properly
Swim, has felt uncomfortable being a sitter ever since , only if the intent is pure will she be around.
it is very probable the sitter felt the crazy energy surging around.

 

[SpireCatalyst]

I understand the "good idea" behind a sitter but i feel i wouldnt have broken through on my first shot if another was there, my dog was with me the next and i almost felt as if i couldnt lead him behind, im sure theres more variables to breaking through that i am unaware of but maybe you guys could let me know what ur preferences are.?

 

[JackCastle]

I didn't read all the post so if someone already said this I apologize in advanced.
What I personally think is that our thoughts affect everyone and everything around us which can easily be proven with the new insights in conciseness science and quantum physics/mechanics. So with that being said I think since this person is having such a powerful experience his energy is transferring into the sitter kinda like the hundred monkey affect but probably will only have a powerful influence on people in close distance. And the only reason I say that is because I have heard of spiritual masters inviting people to learn there secrets of Taoism and Buddhism and supposedly what these people would do is sit and mediate with the master and at some point the master would raise his right palm and everyone in the room would have a profound spiritual/psychedelic experience, WILD STUFF MAN!

 

[SoundOfFire]

I too have experienced this phenomenon, both personally and with people around me while I was partaking. Whatever the underpinning science is behind it, I've found it works in just about any situation, not just partaking in spice. I've seen the same thing happen with just about every substance I've ever used, and with day to day situations as well. Take for example, the vibration a musician is carrying, and by extension of his or her performance, projecting to the listener. Indeed, this vibration doesn't even need to be heard.. ever -felt- the bassline or beat to a song and almost involuntarily started moving in time to it? Yes, the musician is using a physical means of producing a soundwave, but as we've seen pointed out, our brains are quite capable of affecting vibrational frequencies. This also goes the other way, a good musician works off the vibe of his or her audience after all, creating a symbiotic and generative energy exchange. As far as controlling or using this phenomenon for further exploration and understanding, I suggest sitting for someone you are at least very familiar with. During the lead up, experience and come-down, meditate on synergising your energy with that of the voyager for the period of the journey. I've done this on numerous occassions with spice, and though it never gives me full-blown effects, I always end up in that refreshed, euphoric mindstate that comes about from a spice voyage, and invariably feeling closer to the person who's journey I've shared in. One last thing, in relation to the mention of proximity of subjects made by Jack. I'm not sure if proximity is necessary, though likely plays a roll in the ease of transfer. What I mean is, I think large enough events (like gatherings of like minds/souls such as festivals) can trigger this phenomenon. There was one at the start of this year I was supposed to go to but couldn't make it. A bunch of my friends were there, and at nightfall on the first day, as I was preparing to go busking, I felt this sudden wave of euphoria and positive intention, and was reminded from nowhere that the festivities would just be getting into full swing. Not to mention I've had numerous occasions of apparent telepathy over massive distances with people very close to my heart. The human mind is indeed a very powerful thing, capable of many great wonders the likes of which I believe we are only just starting to glimpse. PS. Apologies for te wall of text, my enter key on tis laptop is shot. USB keyboard next time I'm near a shop that sells one methinks. Peace