Tao of Rue Extraction Question

[CrawlingKing]

Sorry, I would post this in the Harmala subforum, but I dont seem to be able to post there.


Anyways, at the end of step 5, and beginning of step 6: The Tao of Rue Extraction - DMT-Nexus Wiki

...
Once your alks have settled, you want to decant as much of the basic liquid as possible.

After you have decanted, you want to add some hot vinegar and water to your alks to redissolve all of your alkaloids. Once everything is redissolved, filter out anything that won't dissolve. This is mostly plant matter and oils.

Step 6 - Manske
Once you have your freebase alks, redissolve them in a minimal amount of fresh, hot vinegar or as The Day Tripper pointed out, a fumaric acid solution. Day Trippers fumaric acid approach leads to chunkier crystals later. Vinegar will lead to needle like crystals as pictured to the right.

There are three ways you can perform the manske.
The first and the "official" way is:

...

I put the part Im confused about in bold and italics. Is that part just an overview of whats about to happen in step 6? And does adding some hot vinegar and water give me freebase alks?

I could probably find out by doing it and seeing where Im at at that part. But Im more of a read it 10-15 times, then try it kind of guy. Any incite would be appreciated.

 

[CrawlingKing]

And in regards to "Day Trippers fumaric acid approach"... How strong on a fumaric acid solution?

 

[MelCat]

When you add the lye in step 5, that gives you freebase alkaloids that are not soluble in water. That's why you're waiting for them to settle to the bottom, so you can decant the lye liquid off the top.

Once you've decanted (removed) the basic water (high ph water) your goodies are still at the bottom of the jar.

When you add vinegar and hot water to these alkaloids, they will become harmala acetates which is a salt form. When the alkaloids are in salt form, they are water soluble. So this means that they are in the solution and can be filtered. When you filter this solution, anything that gets left behind in the filter is unwanted plant material.

When you proceed to step 6, the manske, that will convert the alkaloids from harmala acetates to harmala hcl which is a different kind of harmala salt.

You alkaloids won't be freebase again until step 11.

Hope this helps and welcome to the Nexus.

 

[MelCat]

And in regards to "Day Trippers fumaric acid approach"... How strong on a fumaric acid solution?

I'm really not sure what ratio to recommend with fumaric acid approach. The more fumaric acid you use, the more lye you'll have to use later to neutralize the acid and freebase the molecules.

It's probably best to stick with vinegar until you're more comfortable with the extraction process.

 

[CrawlingKing]

Thank you for your detailed explanation and help. I will stick to the vinegar instead of fumaric acid for now. I guess I am just confused by the wording in the wiki page.

I believe step 6 should not start with "Once you have your freebase alks..." if the alks are not actually freebase anymore since the last part of step 5 had us add vinegar - which makes the alks harmala acetates as you stated earlier. Maybe the fumaric acid suggestion should just be moved to the end of step 5 as well?

I really appreciate the tek, and I may still be mistaken, so I hope Im not coming off as a jerk. Let me know what you think. I just want to make sure I got the right idea of what Im doing.

 

[MelCat]

No, you're not being a jerk at all. I agree that the wording is a little off for that particular section of the tek. I'm updating the wiki page now to help resolve any future confusion.

 

[CrawlingKing]

Cool, glad I could put some positive input here so early.

Also I will be making / using this vacuum filter to speed things up: Extremely Effective Homemade Vacuum Filter Tek [Tek-Pics] - Advanced/Enhanced chemistry - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus

 

[MelCat]

Awesome man, I hope you get a great yield and learn lots!