Indeed. Didnt care to look at all the photos before. They are such slow growers if you dont graft them. Guess it could be part of the explanation to its consistant high potency.
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The Average Cactus Mescaline Content Mega-Thread (post your yields!)
- Thread starter endlessness
- Start date
pete666
Esteemed member
I have acquired Lupita this year directly from Manuel(Green candy genetics), it was his suggestion next to few others. Tip was grafted to huge rootstock few weeks ago. I expect to have it ready for extraction by the end of next year (~1kg), so you will see the result here through next winter if all goes as planned.So, I found these results on reddit. Tbm clone b over 6%
I have some good clones but not the conditions to make any extracts. One clone I'd love to see analyzed is Aplantis/Green candy genetics Lupita Pachanoi. Probably the strongest one Ive tried out.
Great! Cant wait. It has quite unique appearence that made me wonder if it could be a natural cross with a species other than trichocereus. The many small black spines and wavy uncharacteristic shape. Dark blue green skin and blunt growth tips. Unfortunately I sold my few cuttings to a friend that I dont have any contact with anymore, back in 2017.
The only experience I had with it was with very little material shared with my girlfriend in 2016. Very very impressed. The most acute phase went on for 2 days I think with lots of after effect for 3 more days.
Hmm… thanks for the tip. I never thought of grafting my TBMs because of their fascinating form in their own right.
It's high time more of my PC pachs were put to work as grafting stock. Using this as a means of increasing the amount of TBM in my collection seems like a good place to continue, since my first peyote graft has been doing rather well.
There's another slow-grower in my collection which looks like a prime candidate for testing, so I'd best get grafting already - and save the rest of this discussion for the appropriate thread!
A grower on reddit showed that even grafted on pereskiopsis in a hydroponic setup with zero stress the TBM would yeild 1% HCL which is quite impressive. Many cacti own roots rarely break 1%. He also tested 'aging' for a few different periods and I believe 1 month 'aging' yielded 1.5% on these hydro pereskiopsis penis grafts.
doubledog
Titanium Teammate
I have extracted various TBMs, short section and long section types. Yield was consistently 3% of sulfate salt (range was 2.9 - 3.1%)
Unfortunately, they are extremely slow growers, at least in my conditions, in fact, two of them showed absolutely no signs of growth during one and half year.
Unfortunately, they are extremely slow growers, at least in my conditions, in fact, two of them showed absolutely no signs of growth during one and half year.
WizardsGarden
Esteemed member
Hey endlessness,
I was looking at the data for “Kate” in the table (the bridgesii that Urtica ran an extraction on). In the post that Urtica lists his results, he specifies that this cactus was 1.2% mescaline dry and 0.06% fresh. This should land it much higher on the table. Am I missing something? I just want to be sure I’m understanding the table correctly and how the data is being presented. Thank you for your work on this.
Here is the link to Urticas post.
Some cactus work...
I am so excited to get ahold of these TLC kits for research purposes. I have been growing a number of Trichocereus species for many years, with the intention of doing some chemical analysis someday. I also would love to figure out why it is the Trichocereus bridgesii is subjectively so much...
forum.dmt-nexus.me
Asking this as it may also be interesting for all to know about the tech of "aging". How did he do that?
Also, asking the community, what is your ecperience with taking cuttings and putting them in the dark for a few months to get them to hibernate and bulk up on alkaloids?
I have one experience of a single loph-button grown by a friend that was about 20 years old and was my absolute most intense experience with cacti ever. It was in january and it was certainly many strong hours I didnt count for. But I made them count, indeed.
pete666
Esteemed member
I have not conducted any tests, but stressing the cacti by cutting them and keeping them in the dark for a few months is part of my process. I remember someone testing it here on Nexus, and the result showed a huge increase - up to twofold.
Other tests I found on Reddit were negative in this regard, so it seems it may work sometimes and not others. Perhaps for already stressed cacti, the impact might be lower, while for cacti growing in ideal conditions, there may be more room for alkaloid increase. Genetics may also have an impact, as well as other factors.
However, as this step costs nothing, only requiring a bit of space for storage and patience, and the risk of losing any alkaloids is low, I don't see a reason to skip it.
He simply cut and allowed to stay in dark dry spot for a month since that is the common idea.
Cool temperatures may be preferable, if it's too warm sprouting and etiolation tend to occur more (although I can't say whether that specifically constitutes a problem).
pete666
Esteemed member
Are you aware of any tests, or is this based on your experience? I would say that low temperatures can inhibit processes occurring in plants that lead to alkaloid production.
You are right, etiolation is likely, and these white growths taste like cucumber.
I should clarify, anything approaching refrigeration would be too cold - "cool" as a term is obviously too vague. I was thinking more like 14 - 16°C, and definitely avoiding going below 12°C. I'll have to taste some of those white sprouts sometime - having left some specimens in a cool cellar and others in a warm conservatory I'm rather hoping that I managed to include pieces of the same clone in this unintentional experiment!
pete666
Esteemed member
I see, but still 14-16°C is quite low temperature, still in the dormancy temp zone. I rather use 20-23°C, but never tested what is better.
pete666
Esteemed member
My testing goes slower than I thought, but still is in a progress. Next 4 results :
1 - bridgesii, clone name : G6, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 2 months in darkess, 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,17%
2 - bridgesii, clone name : G2, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 5 months in darkness, 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,26% (last extraction of the same plant was 0,2%, so it is 30% increase just by longer stressing. Weight decrease by water loss was 6,5%)
3 - bridgesii, clone name : G4, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 2 months in darkness 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,12%
4 - peruvianus, clone name : #77, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 2 months in darkness 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,07%
1 - bridgesii, clone name : G6, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 2 months in darkess, 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,17%
2 - bridgesii, clone name : G2, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 5 months in darkness, 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,26% (last extraction of the same plant was 0,2%, so it is 30% increase just by longer stressing. Weight decrease by water loss was 6,5%)
3 - bridgesii, clone name : G4, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 2 months in darkness 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,12%
4 - peruvianus, clone name : #77, fresh cutting, whole(green tissue, white tissue, core, spines, waxy skin), 2 months in darkness 23C, extraction method : STB, form: HCl, all alkaloid result : 0,07%
tribo
Esteemed member
Aging in the dark is a simple and free way to increase potency. 2 cuttings of Eileen were dried immediately after being cut from the mother plant, another 2 were aged for 2 months in a dark box at room temperature before drying. Spines and cores were discarded prior to drying. Aged cuttings did not show any etoliation at the end of the aging period. A micro - scale basic ethanol extract was produced from both samples and analyzed with TLC. Plates were run with both samples spotted side by side, MeOH + NH4OH 95:5 as the eluent, and developed with iodine vapor. Darker and more intense spots from the aged sample were noted relative to the non-aged sample. However, this was a qualitative analysis and just demonstrates the proof of concept, albeit with one specific clone. Relative concentrations were not determined or estimated. In theory, one could make standardized solutions to estimate relative concentrations even on the micro - scale.
It seems plausible there may be diminishing returns from the aging process past a certain timeframe, i.e. aging for 2 months producing a 100% increase over baseline and aging for 3 months producing 110% increase, aging for 4 months producing 115% increase etc and aging for 6 months may not be any more effective than 4 months.
As well, specific clones may be more or less responsive to darkness aging, in terms of absolute response and how quickly the response is achieved.
I have a cactus that was sold to me as TPM. The cutting didn't grow for over a year and finally sprouted a new tip from the base.
As it has grown, I've noticed that it will grow a few inches and then start a new tip from somewhere on the plant.
So, I'm wondering if there is any specific place I should start a new cutting from. If I take a piece which no longer has a growing tip, will it also sit and not grow for a year or more before finding a new tip?
I think any picture(s) of the plant concerned would be helpful here. Also, do you mind if I move this question over to a cactus cultivation thread? Let's keep this thread focussed on yield analysis.
Of course not. Sorry about that. I'll get a pic.