• Members of the previous forum can retrieve their temporary password here, (login and check your PM).

Vaping with e-cig juice

Migrated topic.
Really interested in this but I'm struggling with the final conclusion, I own a variable temp amd watt eleaf Istick. looking for a decent tank I guess a high flow isub would work well but not sure of the best liquid to use and temp. Currently using Vg for my low nicotine vaping habit.
 
furhenden said:
I use a REO Grand bottom feeder mech mod, with a twisted pair coil wrapped over a stainless steel mesh wick, at about .8 ohms.
Click to expand...

:? My knowledge surrounding the e-liquid electronics and mechanical set-ups are limited, at least, in comparison to the more avid vape-artist.:!:

I feel lucky that I can even remootely picture wth you are referring to.

I have a Sigelei 150w box mod, that I used for a little while. I have seen people use the 'older' mechanical mods. And I know a few individuals who are well versed, knowledgeable and enthusiastically involved in this market.8)

For me, with the intent of getting a dose of nicotine, this a complicated, convoluted process that requires upkeep and expansive knowledge and is seemingly just as $$ as buying cigs. ..so I choose to be dumbfounded by the technicalities of mods and coils and to not familiarize myself with the jargon.

But.. dmt suspended in an oil? I smell a new tech/sticky.

First off, furhenden, your posts on this topic seem to have been the most helpful in approaching a reliable method of vaporizing dmt FB suspended in PG (seems it may be more appropriate over VG as we begin to expand this topic). I appreciate your optimism and reports on experience.

From my limited knowledge, (and previous experience) I automatically presumed the 'tank' methods of vaporization would prove to be insufficient for our purposes. One issue, for example, arises in the necessity of keeping a tank relatively full as to not burn your coils. This seemed to be a recurrent problem.:thumb_dow

Offhand, I believe you may be right that a completely (or highly) saturated composition is overkill. By any means, this can always be tweaked.

Where I start to lose focus in this thread is on the topic of equipment. Everyone has their own preference. But for sole intent purposes, how should we approach choosing a 'vape' as our ROA?
 
first of all, do NOT use a juice with any nicotine; it is a bad mixture taken at the same time. vaping nicotine separately, before or after is great. something about the synergy of nicotine and spice being vaped simultaneously does not make a nice trip. from personal experience i share this. the entities were NOT happy.

using a sub ohm tank is the way to go for sure. vaping a .5ohm coil with as little as 40 watts will work extremely well. again, this is what i use and it is phenomenal. you raise a good point: you do not want the level of juice to drop below the feed holes of the coil unit, so my suggestion (and my practice) is to use a smaller tank (max 3ml, 2ml if you can find it) so that the tank is always full enough to prevent a dry/burnt hit. unless you have such an abundance of spice that you can mix 4-5ml of juice at a proper concentration, i think smaller tanks are the best.

also, you can use a juice (remember 0% nicotine) that has as much as 60% VG. using a juice that is primarily PG will be very harsh and the liquid is thinner and does not produce much vapor; this is why "cloud chasers" prefer more VG in their liquid. 50/50 is pretty good, but 60/40 VG/PG is best. warm the liquid in a small water bath and slowly let it dissolve. it will eventually. once it does, you are golden.

last bit of advice: for some reason, this ROA absorbs in the lungs a bit more slowly. don't just chain vape - take a draw, wait maybe 15 seconds (holding it deep in your lungs while counting, of course) until you do the next. you will know when you are getting to the place you desire. if you huff too fast, you'll easily inhale 40-50mg before you know it.

for sub-ohm spicing, a 1:6 ratio is best, for example, 250mg spice to 1.5ml, or any multiple of that.

if you are interested in specific types of tanks/mods etc, search my posts...i've been quite elaborate on the brands i prefer.

hope that helps! happy liftoff!
 
😁 Though id chime in real quick. I recently upgraded from a Kangertech subbox mini starter kit to a Cuboid 200W mod with temperature control and smart coil tech. and a Playboy Vixen subohm (down to .1ohm) tank. Just ganna say, with higher VG juices the clouds are astonishing. Flavor is crisp, and very very nice compared to all the previous tanks and atomizers I have used.

and I have tried the Spice Ejuice and it doesn't work to well for me (I believe this is due to me still getting the hang of extractions tho).
 
I personally am equipped with a Snowwolf 200 watt Box-mod. Has temp control, as long as im using TC wires (nickel,ni200,titanium, etc). I also have a Anarchist/ARIA phenotype-L 22mm RDA, bt far THEE best atty(ATOMIZER) I've owned. (Cost me $65, but was well worth it) the middle golden post broke on mine, user error, was cranking the atty off, I accidentally over tightened, I put a screw driver between two posts and started to crank (worst idea ever, did NOT fully think it through) post then broke. Anyways my point behind this story is that the company was well-beyond helpful, and send me a new post kit for me, along with an updated O ring kit.. The originals were a little loose... I also have a 30mm Temple RDA, big ol bastard, and was a clone... Only 12 dollars.. Well worth it compared to the original price of $67.. If I look into a RDA, and the price is ridiculous, but the product is well known and high quality, I always check the clone first, and more-so I read reviews. The temple checked out and ive had it ever since
I would think a box mod would accommodate the nature of DMT as a substance, especially when it comes down to the direct control over temperature, and not compromising the substance, or leaving it vulnerable to burning to a crisp, etc.
Anyways, before I got this box mod I was rocking a Tesla Mech Mod and a Tobh 4 post atty.. Which I busted off two posts to make it a solid two post, with a lot more room for builds.
Next atty im getting is a tank. A tfv4. You can rebuild the deck. Its a 5 star item.

OKAY, NOW THAT I WENT ON A SMALL TANGENT, I CAN RETURN TO THE MAIN DISCUSSION.
I had a half g of DMT and decided to give it a go, in my mech mod, cause I get urine tests randomly for work, and for my hourly wages, I glady give up smoking weed.. Ive got my whole life ahead of me to go back to smoking. Theres a time and a place for everything. ANYWAY, I think I didnt have a high enough concentration of dmt-->>VG... I did get effects but they were rather light.

I Plan to give this another go, I have had almost a full G of DMT sitting around the past six months or so, and have not touched it. Im a recovering drug addict and have been working on my recovery, and my life.. Over the past 6 months ive had 2 relapses with an exception of the entire past week. I take a urine test for Suboxone each month (I barely take much at all.. But when I do take 8mg a day, its it's rather easy to keep my life straight, and I do really well.. However I decrease to like a half a day, and then the pthers somehow help me fund living expenses.
So I cannot smoke weed cause of the UA from doctors.. Which sucks cause I would much rather relapse on weed, rather than IV coke and heroin/morphine.
I figure a DMT could do me some good. And im planning on kicking it to the curb tomorrow... However its easy to justify use, and I get very apathetic in active use, where my thinking goes to "fuck it maybe that next one will just kill you, then you dont have to worry about etc etc etc...
I believe it's time to call for my spirit guide. Although I never have truly had a break through.. But recently have read, and decided to try a different way.. Take a hit of a concentrated liquid dose of DMT/VG (maybe PG, haven't fully decided) idk why I would add PG, I personally am not a fan, and don't mix into my house juices (finally starting up a brand, almost finished my startup line of signature flavors)...
Anyway, I'm going to take a hit, hold it in... Release.. And then get comfortable.. Keep eyes open, keep my breaths big and in sync... Then when im ready take a hit.. Hold in... Release... I guess in my past I had this idea that this process was supposed to happen fast and be rushed. Not only did I find this rushing cause me to have a spike of anxiety and discomfort, but I never have had a full breakthrough. I read elsewhere to take it slow.. And if with someone else, like a significant other, to hold hands, laugh, look at eachother.. Envelop yourself in reality, as it slowly reverts to a cosmic state... I probably will be alone.. But I still will take slow.. And eventually it shouldnt matter if eyes are open or closed, I will be in full blown hallucinations... Blast off...
We shall see. But due to my prior experience, I assume and predict with some minor dose adjustments, that I shall have a solid experience... And am happy I have an alternative to smoking on weed (which I wish I could) and alot smoother alternative than smoking out of a glass stem or a lightbulb or any of that nasty shit. I probably will add one of my signature mixes into the DMTjuice, but not any nicotine... I will keep that seperate, for afterward.
I cant wait to do a follow up on here when all is said and done! Love you all, and if anyone has any additional suggestions to enhance or add to the experience, I suppose I'm open to hearing them. All ears :)

Maybe I should have started a seperate thread lol
 
So this thread is pretty long and I had an idea at work which people have tried in this thread already I am sure.

Instead of getting the DMT to dissolve in PG or VG, or anything actually, I opened up my RDA (AKA Dripper) and I placed some DMT crystals onto the coil itsels, pressed the button and it vaporized relatively quickly and I sniffed a lil bit of the vape and I could get that DMT smell.

So then I scooped up a bit more, my cheapy scale was unable to tell me how much really.
I placed it on top of the coils and then since my dripper was dry, I had to wet the wick so I dropped a bit of 0mg juice onto the coil / cotton and then I decided to try it out. So I pressed the fire button a lil to try and get it melted so that when I start sucking I won't be inhaling the crystals.

Then I went for a 1st hit and took it slowly so that the vapor was warmer and more of it. I got quite a DMT taste and it was really warm however still easy enough to hold in without coughing. Held it in for quite a while then exhaled and took a few more hits until the cotton was dry.
I came up pretty quickly as expected and that small amount did a lot more for me this time compared to what I would have been able to achieve in a Wooden Vapor Genie. Very easy method for me to vape it.

I am now really keen to give it a go this weekend, or some weekend, with a larger dose of DMT... Perhaps I need to build some larger coils for more surface area to stack the DMT on top of.


I used a dual coil build, 0.3ohm at 35W for what it is worth. I was thinking of playing around with temperature control but I think this method works fine.
 
hey - good research!

i see both pitfalls and advantages in this method:

advantage: easy to dose; can be precise about how much is being vaporized.
disadvantage - really easy to burn the spice if the coil goes super-hot quickly.

this is why with the "buffer" of the eliquid with spice dissolved, burning is easy to avoid. however it is almost impossible to accurately dose when vaping spice-infused juice. you just hit it 'till ya' can't :d

you didn't mention the gauge wire you used; i would suspect the lower gauge wire would be better - 22g - even 20g....takes a long time for those to get red-hot and the vaporization would be slower and easier to control

let us know how it goes!

safe travels,
 
Hi,
But, with the method that PsyCLown used, if one build a bigger surface and ohm coil and low the wattage a lot more, it's less easy to burn the spice or not ?
I think it's a perfect method and more easy to dose....then with temp regulated battery, i never used but i suppose that the battery stop when the coils reach the temperature setted, is still easy to burn the spice ?
 
xa said:
Hi,
But, with the method that PsyCLown used, if one build a bigger surface and ohm coil and low the wattage a lot more, it's less easy to burn the spice or not ?
I think it's a perfect method and more easy to dose....then with temp regulated battery, i never used but i suppose that the battery stop when the coils reach the temperature setted, is still easy to burn the spice ?
Click to expand...

Temp Control on mods does not actually have a sensor, it uses algorithms to determine / estimate the temperature of the wire. So it is not always 100% accurate, however it might help prevent the temp from going toooo high. My mod starts with temp control at 100C, I just need to get some wire which supports temp control on my mod as I only have some Kanthal at the moment.

I am actually not too sure what gauge kanthal I have at the moment, I would need to check. Got it from a friend so do not have the packaging.

I will play around a bit more and with some higher amounts of DMT and provide feedback as I try out a few more things.
 
Alright, so I thought I would give this thread a slight bump and add some more info.

So last night I decided to try my e-cig vape and DMT again. WOW! Worked BEAUTIFULLY!

Since my last update I got a few different types of temp control wire, as I plan on building my own coils and making use of a dripper tank (RDA) to vape the DMT.

At first I got some Titanium but I thought that having spaced coils wouldn't work too well. Then I got some SS316 (Stainless Steel 316) wire which is safe to use in both normal wattage mode as well as temperature control.
So with the SS316 wire I was able to build coils which were not spaced and then get them glowing to check for hot spots and make sure that both coils heat up evenly and at the same time, from the centre outwards, then once that was done I wicked it with cotton and got the wicks wet with normal e-juice (0mg nicotine) and then put my mod into temp control mode and tested it, all worked well although hardly any vapor at 100C, so I bumped up the temp a bit to around 180C I think.
For those who are interested, it was 12 wraps of 24g SS316L with an internal diameter of 2.5mm which came to 0.18 ohm on my Eleaf iStick Pico.

I then started to scoop up some DMT and placed it directly on the coils, which were hot enough for the DMT to melt and turn into liquid yet not hot enough for it to vaporize (well, I did not see any vapor and it worked amazingly well). Remember that it had been around a minute or more after testing it at 180C, so it had time to cool down but was still warm it seemed.

So the fact that the warm coils melted the DMT helped me get a significant dose in there. It basically just got soaked up by the cotton I assume (which was wet with e-juice).
Then time for blast off. I left it at around 180C and pressed the fire button, waited a second then started to inhale slowly and I could taste the DMT as well. Kept going until I could no longer take in anymore and then I kept it in my lungs for as long as I could and then exhaled.

I did this about 3 times, before increasing the temperature to around 220C - 240C and then I took more hits and held them in. Boy oh boy, the room I was in looked out of this world. The OEV's I had some unlike anything I had ever had before, it was by far the most visual (open eye) trip I had ever had!


I feel as if the higher temp of around 220-240C worked better, I would even say you could bump it up more and it would be fine as this morning I put it into wattage mode, got no DMT taste yet I certainly got some effects still and this was after my friend had taken my vape and used it for a few more hits without adding more DMT!


One thing I noticed straight away was how much smoother and less harsh the DMT was compared to when I used the vapor genie. I will without a doubt continue to use my e-cig vape for DMT and keep my Wooden Vapor Genie for other stuff.

I reckon I will be purchasing a RDA tank specifically for DMT, I think something larger than 22mm will be great (so 24 or 25mm) and then if it had glass, that would look wicked too!
The reason I would want a larger RDA is for a larger build area so that I can build larger coils as larger coils = more surface area to put the DMT on.

So that is that, this if the best method that I have personally tried when it comes to vaping DMT, I am sure it would be the most consistent as well. Unfortunately I did not have my scale with me so I had to eye ball the dose I took.


EDIT: With regards to how the temperature control works, from what I understand, is basically the vape (mod / mod box / whatever you wanna call it) will monitor the resistance and as the wire increases in heat the resistance will change and then it uses algorithms to determine what temperature the wire is currently at and whether to send more power through the coil or not.

Keep in mind that Titanium and Nickel (Ni200) can both be dangerous / bad for your health if you use them in wattage mode. Stainless Steel is safe in wattage mode and can be used for temp control too.
 
Thanks to the people who have experimented and posted with this already and posted the results! :thumb_up:

I have used 100mg in 3ml of juice that gave me threshold effects after a few puffs.
 
I've been working with medical cannabis extracts in e-liquid media lately. I think there may be some lateral use for it here.

I'm trying to develop my own concentrate suspension system. Several are sold commercially for consumers to mix up their own e-liquid from a concentrate (like ejmix). The price tag is around 25-35 USD for 30ml of mix. The cost to make this mix, as I figure, is somewhere around 0.45 USD for 30ml (you'll have to buy/mix more, but one go should last you well beyond your need).

My current recipe:

Djinn Gin, v3 (15ml)

3ml . . . PEG-200
2.5ml. . .PEG-400
5.5ml. . .PG
1.5ml. . .VG (optional)
2.5ml. . .FLAV (optional)

The key here are the Polyethylene Glycols (PEG-XXX, AKA Carbowax). The number represents the length of the carbon chain in the molecule, and therefore its molecular weight (wikipedia). They act as a solvent far better than Propylene Glycol (PG) and also lower the viscosity of the overall mixture (will wick better in tank systems). The PG is there as the main carrier liquid because (1) it's relatively low viscosity (2) it carries flavor really well (3) it's cheap. The Vegetable Glycerine (VG) creates body and thickness in the vapor, resulting in a more "smoke like" feel, and more visible vapor. And finally, flavoring, because I like flavors. If you don't care about flavoring, or additional vapor production, drop the VG and FLAV and add 4ml to PG. Working with concentrates, I add my wax/hash to a shot glass, cover with Djinn Gin and pop in a hot water bath (or microwave 5-10 sec. if i'm feelin lazy), and mix until it's consistent (usually around10 minutes just to be thorough), draw into my syringe, attach the syringe filter (45 micron), and filter into my clean dropper bottle.

All of these things can be purchased from amazon or ebay or something. You'll want a glass jar with a dripper, a mixing syringe (10-12ml) and maybe a syringe filter. (I haven't tried just yet with spice, but it's superb for filtering lingering solids from cannabis e-liquid.) Personally, I got my PEGs and filter from ebay, and the rest from my favorite vape supply site.

I've achieved 1g/1ml ratios before for THC concentrates and it felt like I had room to dissolve more, but the viscosity was still too high (I'm trying to make concentrates that work WELL in pen-style/cartomizer devices), so this is my third revision of the mix. I'm running a 50g ACRB tek right now to see if I can make cartomizer friendly liquid spice. Will report back this weekend sometime on its efficacy.

CAVEATS:

There is controversy in the vaping community concerning the use of PEGs in e-liquid. The primary arguments are (1) that PEG is antifreeze (the same argument is used against vaping generally on account that PG is also used as antifreeze)- what is not mentioned here is that Polyethylene Glycol is *sometimes* used in some antifreeze because it is less toxic (virtually non-toxic in humans) than it's sister Ethylene Glycol when ingested (moderately toxic to humans) and its cousin Diethylene Glycol (outright poisonous to humans); and (2) it is a petrochemical- well, so is PG. Sometimes. And that goes for both. PEG and PG are petrochemicals, but both can be synthesized from bio-organic, non-petro sources. They cost a little more, but if that's important to you, then it's worth the extra I suppose.

There is also some real potential, though, for having PEG that is contaminated with either ethylene or diethylene glycol. It has happened. The solution for this is simpler than you might think, though. Don't order PEG, or anything else you will eat or inhale, from Chinese factories. These (as far as I can tell, isolated) cases of contaminated PEG were from Chinese chem factories that reused containers for the manufacture of PEG, EG and DiEG without proper sanitation and sterilization between productions. So think before you buy. I will usually go to TexLab Supply for my chem needs, but Simple Chem makes bio-sourced PEG, and they are USA based.

PROTIPS:

The filter goes a long way towards standardizing the liquid, but it still needs to sit for a few days before it's really blended well. I imagine the same will apply for high concentrations of spice.

Flavoring with concentrates is tricky. My extracts are terpene rich and cannot simply be overpowered by a flavoring. The flavor can be worked WITH, though, which is something I have to keep in mind when making flavor profiles for Djinn Gin. Spice has an ... unique aroma/flavor, so again I think this will apply.

Once this works in a cig-a-like, gas station piece of crap "e-cig" and not just in "expensive" vape setups with technical hands-on involvement, there's no turning back.
 
ducdevil said:
first of all, do NOT use a juice with any nicotine; it is a bad mixture taken at the same time. vaping nicotine separately, before or after is great. something about the synergy of nicotine and spice being vaped simultaneously does not make a nice trip. from personal experience i share this. the entities were NOT happy.

using a sub ohm tank is the way to go for sure. vaping a .5ohm coil with as little as 40 watts will work extremely well. again, this is what i use and it is phenomenal. you raise a good point: you do not want the level of juice to drop below the feed holes of the coil unit, so my suggestion (and my practice) is to use a smaller tank (max 3ml, 2ml if you can find it) so that the tank is always full enough to prevent a dry/burnt hit. unless you have such an abundance of spice that you can mix 4-5ml of juice at a proper concentration, i think smaller tanks are the best.

also, you can use a juice (remember 0% nicotine) that has as much as 60% VG. using a juice that is primarily PG will be very harsh and the liquid is thinner and does not produce much vapor; this is why "cloud chasers" prefer more VG in their liquid. 50/50 is pretty good, but 60/40 VG/PG is best. warm the liquid in a small water bath and slowly let it dissolve. it will eventually. once it does, you are golden.

last bit of advice: for some reason, this ROA absorbs in the lungs a bit more slowly. don't just chain vape - take a draw, wait maybe 15 seconds (holding it deep in your lungs while counting, of course) until you do the next. you will know when you are getting to the place you desire. if you huff too fast, you'll easily inhale 40-50mg before you know it.

for sub-ohm spicing, a 1:6 ratio is best, for example, 250mg spice to 1.5ml, or any multiple of that.

if you are interested in specific types of tanks/mods etc, search my posts...i've been quite elaborate on the brands i prefer.

hope that helps! happy liftoff!
Click to expand...
Hi, I've been reading your posts all over this site trying to figure this out, even though I am a real vape-noob. I'd rather not spend too much money on this, so I found two vapes I think might work and are pretty cheap (and are available for purchase in my area).
Is there anything about these two that would make them not suitable for this thing? Also, is one of them better or worse than the other?
 
Tanks are probably the wrong way to go. They offer no advantage and a large amount of mechanical loss of dmt.

I suggest a dripper. You just drip some dmt oil onto a cotton wick, slide the cover on, and vape it up. Much less loss, less dmt left behind in the wick, amd it personally makes whatever you're vsping feel more potent imho.

I use the griffin tsunami. Any idiot can make coils for it. The cost of this, some coil wire, amd cotton is still cheaper than a decent tank and will last your entire lifespan for dmt use.
 
Horizon_Bloom said:
I've been working with medical cannabis extracts in e-liquid media lately. I think there may be some lateral use for it here.

I'm trying to develop my own concentrate suspension system. Several are sold commercially for consumers to mix up their own e-liquid from a concentrate (like ejmix). The price tag is around 25-35 USD for 30ml of mix. The cost to make this mix, as I figure, is somewhere around 0.45 USD for 30ml (you'll have to buy/mix more, but one go should last you well beyond your need).

My current recipe:

Djinn Gin, v3 (15ml)

3ml . . . PEG-200
2.5ml. . .PEG-400
5.5ml. . .PG
1.5ml. . .VG (optional)
2.5ml. . .FLAV (optional)

The key here are the Polyethylene Glycols (PEG-XXX, AKA Carbowax). The number represents the length of the carbon chain in the molecule, and therefore its molecular weight (wikipedia). They act as a solvent far better than Propylene Glycol (PG) and also lower the viscosity of the overall mixture (will wick better in tank systems). The PG is there as the main carrier liquid because (1) it's relatively low viscosity (2) it carries flavor really well (3) it's cheap. The Vegetable Glycerine (VG) creates body and thickness in the vapor, resulting in a more "smoke like" feel, and more visible vapor. And finally, flavoring, because I like flavors. If you don't care about flavoring, or additional vapor production, drop the VG and FLAV and add 4ml to PG. Working with concentrates, I add my wax/hash to a shot glass, cover with Djinn Gin and pop in a hot water bath (or microwave 5-10 sec. if i'm feelin lazy), and mix until it's consistent (usually around10 minutes just to be thorough), draw into my syringe, attach the syringe filter (45 micron), and filter into my clean dropper bottle.

All of these things can be purchased from amazon or ebay or something. You'll want a glass jar with a dripper, a mixing syringe (10-12ml) and maybe a syringe filter. (I haven't tried just yet with spice, but it's superb for filtering lingering solids from cannabis e-liquid.) Personally, I got my PEGs and filter from ebay, and the rest from my favorite vape supply site.

I've achieved 1g/1ml ratios before for THC concentrates and it felt like I had room to dissolve more, but the viscosity was still too high (I'm trying to make concentrates that work WELL in pen-style/cartomizer devices), so this is my third revision of the mix. I'm running a 50g ACRB tek right now to see if I can make cartomizer friendly liquid spice. Will report back this weekend sometime on its efficacy.

CAVEATS:

There is controversy in the vaping community concerning the use of PEGs in e-liquid. The primary arguments are (1) that PEG is antifreeze (the same argument is used against vaping generally on account that PG is also used as antifreeze)- what is not mentioned here is that Polyethylene Glycol is *sometimes* used in some antifreeze because it is less toxic (virtually non-toxic in humans) than it's sister Ethylene Glycol when ingested (moderately toxic to humans) and its cousin Diethylene Glycol (outright poisonous to humans); and (2) it is a petrochemical- well, so is PG. Sometimes. And that goes for both. PEG and PG are petrochemicals, but both can be synthesized from bio-organic, non-petro sources. They cost a little more, but if that's important to you, then it's worth the extra I suppose.

There is also some real potential, though, for having PEG that is contaminated with either ethylene or diethylene glycol. It has happened. The solution for this is simpler than you might think, though. Don't order PEG, or anything else you will eat or inhale, from Chinese factories. These (as far as I can tell, isolated) cases of contaminated PEG were from Chinese chem factories that reused containers for the manufacture of PEG, EG and DiEG without proper sanitation and sterilization between productions. So think before you buy. I will usually go to TexLab Supply for my chem needs, but Simple Chem makes bio-sourced PEG, and they are USA based.

PROTIPS:

The filter goes a long way towards standardizing the liquid, but it still needs to sit for a few days before it's really blended well. I imagine the same will apply for high concentrations of spice.

Flavoring with concentrates is tricky. My extracts are terpene rich and cannot simply be overpowered by a flavoring. The flavor can be worked WITH, though, which is something I have to keep in mind when making flavor profiles for Djinn Gin. Spice has an ... unique aroma/flavor, so again I think this will apply.

Once this works in a cig-a-like, gas station piece of crap "e-cig" and not just in "expensive" vape setups with technical hands-on involvement, there's no turning back.
Click to expand...

I use a rotor-stator and a variac to homogenize my liquids. It's also fsntastic for the extractions as well. Terpines can be isolated, but I ;refer simple flavors for cannabis vape juice. 8-10% fa mango is incredible for c-juice extracts in tank devices. I made a peaches n cream that is quite good as well.
 
Horizon_Bloom said:
I've been working with medical cannabis extracts in e-liquid media lately. I think there may be some lateral use for it here.

I'm trying to develop my own concentrate suspension system. Several are sold commercially for consumers to mix up their own e-liquid from a concentrate (like ejmix). The price tag is around 25-35 USD for 30ml of mix. The cost to make this mix, as I figure, is somewhere around 0.45 USD for 30ml (you'll have to buy/mix more, but one go should last you well beyond your need).

My current recipe:

Djinn Gin, v3 (15ml)

3ml . . . PEG-200
2.5ml. . .PEG-400
5.5ml. . .PG
1.5ml. . .VG (optional)
2.5ml. . .FLAV (optional)

The key here are the Polyethylene Glycols (PEG-XXX, AKA Carbowax). The number represents the length of the carbon chain in the molecule, and therefore its molecular weight (wikipedia). They act as a solvent far better than Propylene Glycol (PG) and also lower the viscosity of the overall mixture (will wick better in tank systems). The PG is there as the main carrier liquid because (1) it's relatively low viscosity (2) it carries flavor really well (3) it's cheap. The Vegetable Glycerine (VG) creates body and thickness in the vapor, resulting in a more "smoke like" feel, and more visible vapor. And finally, flavoring, because I like flavors. If you don't care about flavoring, or additional vapor production, drop the VG and FLAV and add 4ml to PG. Working with concentrates, I add my wax/hash to a shot glass, cover with Djinn Gin and pop in a hot water bath (or microwave 5-10 sec. if i'm feelin lazy), and mix until it's consistent (usually around10 minutes just to be thorough), draw into my syringe, attach the syringe filter (45 micron), and filter into my clean dropper bottle.

All of these things can be purchased from amazon or ebay or something. You'll want a glass jar with a dripper, a mixing syringe (10-12ml) and maybe a syringe filter. (I haven't tried just yet with spice, but it's superb for filtering lingering solids from cannabis e-liquid.) Personally, I got my PEGs and filter from ebay, and the rest from my favorite vape supply site.

I've achieved 1g/1ml ratios before for THC concentrates and it felt like I had room to dissolve more, but the viscosity was still too high (I'm trying to make concentrates that work WELL in pen-style/cartomizer devices), so this is my third revision of the mix. I'm running a 50g ACRB tek right now to see if I can make cartomizer friendly liquid spice. Will report back this weekend sometime on its efficacy.

CAVEATS:

There is controversy in the vaping community concerning the use of PEGs in e-liquid. The primary arguments are (1) that PEG is antifreeze (the same argument is used against vaping generally on account that PG is also used as antifreeze)- what is not mentioned here is that Polyethylene Glycol is *sometimes* used in some antifreeze because it is less toxic (virtually non-toxic in humans) than it's sister Ethylene Glycol when ingested (moderately toxic to humans) and its cousin Diethylene Glycol (outright poisonous to humans); and (2) it is a petrochemical- well, so is PG. Sometimes. And that goes for both. PEG and PG are petrochemicals, but both can be synthesized from bio-organic, non-petro sources. They cost a little more, but if that's important to you, then it's worth the extra I suppose.

There is also some real potential, though, for having PEG that is contaminated with either ethylene or diethylene glycol. It has happened. The solution for this is simpler than you might think, though. Don't order PEG, or anything else you will eat or inhale, from Chinese factories. These (as far as I can tell, isolated) cases of contaminated PEG were from Chinese chem factories that reused containers for the manufacture of PEG, EG and DiEG without proper sanitation and sterilization between productions. So think before you buy. I will usually go to TexLab Supply for my chem needs, but Simple Chem makes bio-sourced PEG, and they are USA based.

PROTIPS:

The filter goes a long way towards standardizing the liquid, but it still needs to sit for a few days before it's really blended well. I imagine the same will apply for high concentrations of spice.

Flavoring with concentrates is tricky. My extracts are terpene rich and cannot simply be overpowered by a flavoring. The flavor can be worked WITH, though, which is something I have to keep in mind when making flavor profiles for Djinn Gin. Spice has an ... unique aroma/flavor, so again I think this will apply.

Once this works in a cig-a-like, gas station piece of crap "e-cig" and not just in "expensive" vape setups with technical hands-on involvement, there's no turning back.
Click to expand...

I use a rotor-stator and a variac to homogenize my liquids. It's also fsntastic for the extractions as well. Terpines can be isolated, but I ;refer simple flavors for cannabis vape juice. 8-10% fa mango is incredible for c-juice extracts in tank devices. I made a peaches n cream that is quite good as well.

Pg is 'propylene glycol', which has nothing to do with 'ethylene glycol'. Your post need some serious fact checking, as it spreading more harmful misinformation than fact as it stands.
 
xa said:
Hi,
But, with the method that PsyCLown used, if one build a bigger surface and ohm coil and low the wattage a lot more, it's less easy to burn the spice or not ?
I think it's a perfect method and more easy to dose....then with temp regulated battery, i never used but i suppose that the battery stop when the coils reach the temperature setted, is still easy to burn the spice ?
Click to expand...

It really depends. In a tank, it could gunk up on the coils. on rda, with properly wicked coils it would be hard. You could vape dlmost every damn drop out of those things amd worst case scenario maybe burn your cotton. But you'd get a very warm 'dry hit' before that happens.
 
1ce said:
xa said:
Hi,
But, with the method that PsyCLown used, if one build a bigger surface and ohm coil and low the wattage a lot more, it's less easy to burn the spice or not ?
I think it's a perfect method and more easy to dose....then with temp regulated battery, i never used but i suppose that the battery stop when the coils reach the temperature setted, is still easy to burn the spice ?
Click to expand...

It really depends. In a tank, it could gunk up on the coils. on rda, with properly wicked coils it would be hard. You could vape dlmost every damn drop out of those things amd worst case scenario maybe burn your cotton. But you'd get a very warm 'dry hit' before that happens.
Click to expand...

In my experience, tank atomizers with a two-coil deck (and temperature control) work pretty painless for dmt.

I add 1g spice, 1ml propylene glycol and two drops of vegetable glycerin, then heat it for 5-8 seconds in the microwave and mix it thoroughly. That mixture stay fluid above 20⁰C and travels easily up the wick, no visible build-up of product after spending 8ml of spice-juice. If the juice get cold, thick and cloudy it's not a problem, it will heat up after a couple of small hits and get slightly more viscous than pure propylene glycol.

I would like to add emphasis on using a latest generation box mod, preferably with temperature control or at the very leat with adjustable wattage. The new mods got heaps of safety mechanisms to avoid burnt wick, dry hits, coil damage etc.
 
Back
Top Bottom