America is # 1!
All other countries can suck it.
All other countries can suck it.
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What are your thoughts on nationalism?
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Ice House wrote:
Congrats being born in the USA, a country (like the UK) built on the blood of innocents and slavery,
That maintains supremacy through illegal wars,
And that you were born in by complete fluke.
Well done.
Long may your domination and subjugation of the weak continue.
You are the best. Long may the poor of the world (and within your own country), indeed, suck it.
Congrats being born in the USA, a country (like the UK) built on the blood of innocents and slavery,
That maintains supremacy through illegal wars,
And that you were born in by complete fluke.
Well done.
Long may your domination and subjugation of the weak continue.
You are the best. Long may the poor of the world (and within your own country), indeed, suck it.
I find pride in the accomplishments I've achieved in life. Being born in a certain area that has been designated with a name by some men I've never met hardly seems fitting as an achievement. I am certainly grateful to be living where I am, but pride has nothing to do with it.
Lol..lighten up, jdubs ;]
Sorry, it was
A lot of other countries DO suck 'it', everyday. 'It' is big, made of money, and comes in the form of bombs, drones and expensive machine-guns. This happens because of the attitude that 'other countries can suck it.'
How brilliant and forward thinking this attitude is! I'm sure it will only lead to great things.
A lot of other countries DO suck 'it', everyday. 'It' is big, made of money, and comes in the form of bombs, drones and expensive machine-guns. This happens because of the attitude that 'other countries can suck it.'
How brilliant and forward thinking this attitude is! I'm sure it will only lead to great things.
USA huh?
Never heard of it.
I'm English... But tbh it's all about Kazakhstan.
No reason.
Never heard of it.
I'm English... But tbh it's all about Kazakhstan.
No reason.
jdubs said:
'twas only a joke :- P
:lol: I granted that possibility. Apologies everyone...
It's because being English, I lack a sense of humour. You know how us English are all uptight?
I also drink tea with a pinky finger extended, and have a picture of the Queen above my roaring fireplace. It goes well with my crumpets that I practically live on.
If I need the phone I go out to the local village and ask a local bobby where to find the nearest friendly red box.
I cycle of course, and wave at the friendly schoolteacher as I ride past.
Then I realise I am late for work (by looking at Big Ben) and grab my pork-pie hat and umbrella before calling a black cab which is driven by a friendly cock-eny, who entertains me with 'Doing The Lambeth Walk' in a charming accent.
At high-tea I have my cucumber sandwiches and more of the obligatory tea, before hurrying along to my croquet session.
Dinner-time is just spiffing. At 6:30 I love a nice bit of cod and chips, served to me by the local fishmaster Mr Dobbins, washed down with more tea or maybe for a treat some foreign-import 'Coca-Cola'.
Before bed I get in my pajamas and watch a spot of Mr. Bean before lights-out at 9:30 sharp.
Ahhhh England.
EDIT: I am not Anti-American in any way. It seems like a great country in many many ways. It was just the 'Every other country can suck it' attitude that I took exception with. Although I have now been informed it was a joke. The irony was lost on me.
It's because being English, I lack a sense of humour. You know how us English are all uptight?
I also drink tea with a pinky finger extended, and have a picture of the Queen above my roaring fireplace. It goes well with my crumpets that I practically live on.
If I need the phone I go out to the local village and ask a local bobby where to find the nearest friendly red box.
I cycle of course, and wave at the friendly schoolteacher as I ride past.
Then I realise I am late for work (by looking at Big Ben) and grab my pork-pie hat and umbrella before calling a black cab which is driven by a friendly cock-eny, who entertains me with 'Doing The Lambeth Walk' in a charming accent.
At high-tea I have my cucumber sandwiches and more of the obligatory tea, before hurrying along to my croquet session.
Dinner-time is just spiffing. At 6:30 I love a nice bit of cod and chips, served to me by the local fishmaster Mr Dobbins, washed down with more tea or maybe for a treat some foreign-import 'Coca-Cola'.
Before bed I get in my pajamas and watch a spot of Mr. Bean before lights-out at 9:30 sharp.
Ahhhh England.
EDIT: I am not Anti-American in any way. It seems like a great country in many many ways. It was just the 'Every other country can suck it' attitude that I took exception with. Although I have now been informed it was a joke. The irony was lost on me.
Imo, not at all...look at it historically. The atrocities committed by those who were/are proud to be part of "an oppressed, survivor nation" as it rises to power/exacts revenge/strives for "justice" in the name of nationalism are easily on par with "dominant" nations. Scalar par, perhaps...perhaps literally 'objective' par, in which case the argument could be made that their atrocities are 'worse' than proud/dominant nations.jdubs said:
Imo, nationalism begets oppression, period. Doesn't matter what identity a given nation has.
Snozzleberry wrote
That is a good point. So any nationalism instigates oppression, and then that oppression instigates a vicious cycle of revenge/oppression/revenge/oppression ad infinitum.
It's probably best to drop it then.
The media in this country shamelessly promotes and perpetuates it though. Not sure of anywhere else, but I guess it's the case elsewhere too. I would go as far to say that a vast proportion of people here are racist, and this racism arises from nationalism.
EDIT: By 'here' I mean the UK, not the Nexus.
That is a good point. So any nationalism instigates oppression, and then that oppression instigates a vicious cycle of revenge/oppression/revenge/oppression ad infinitum.
It's probably best to drop it then.
The media in this country shamelessly promotes and perpetuates it though. Not sure of anywhere else, but I guess it's the case elsewhere too. I would go as far to say that a vast proportion of people here are racist, and this racism arises from nationalism.
EDIT: By 'here' I mean the UK, not the Nexus.
One of the things i always find a bit odd, is when people are proud of their nations´ military achievements.
Considering the fact that almost any nation on earth has had some military victory´s over the coarse of history, annual military parades to celebrate the same victory´s of the past over and over again, do not make the boastfull claims of 'power' very credible. Who would be impressed these days, by parades of the macedonian army, to celebrate the victory´s of alexander the great?
If you only have military victory-parades, but not 'defeated-parades' or 'stalemate-parades', your nations boasting about it´s military power is not realy very credible.
Therefore i think that nations should keep an annual score about all the wars they´ve been involved in over the year. When the year has been succesfull in military terms...then you can have a victory parade. But when the year hasn´t been very succesfull, you should have a defeat-parade or a neutral-score-parade.
Otherwise, the boasts of vicory are not convincing: when i only tell you about the positive traits of character of josef stalin, he may seem to be a very nice guy...He appeared to have been a good gardener for instance...So when you don´t keep a proper score, no-one is going to take your claims of power and grandeur seriously: you can only realy win, when there´s something at stake..if you could also loose.
At the same time: when military win´s are something to be proud of, i assume that people who think like this, also must therefore have a deep and sincere respect for the enemy-forces that have been succesfull at their own expense: if you don´t have a deep apreciation for the military might of other people´s army´s, it doesn´t realy make much sense to expect people to apreciate yours.
For this reason, i think it would have been apropriate if for instance, all NATO-states would have had parades to mourn their defeat in afghanistan, and to celebrate and pay respect to the military might of the taliban, over the past few years.
A parade with tarred and feathered military vehicles, and soldiers carrying white flags, while a military band would play a taliban-hymne would probably do it. Instead of a fly-over, i think a group of people who´d carry parts of crashed planes and helicopters would be more apropriate for a good 'defeat-parade'.
Considering the fact that almost any nation on earth has had some military victory´s over the coarse of history, annual military parades to celebrate the same victory´s of the past over and over again, do not make the boastfull claims of 'power' very credible. Who would be impressed these days, by parades of the macedonian army, to celebrate the victory´s of alexander the great?
If you only have military victory-parades, but not 'defeated-parades' or 'stalemate-parades', your nations boasting about it´s military power is not realy very credible.
Therefore i think that nations should keep an annual score about all the wars they´ve been involved in over the year. When the year has been succesfull in military terms...then you can have a victory parade. But when the year hasn´t been very succesfull, you should have a defeat-parade or a neutral-score-parade.
Otherwise, the boasts of vicory are not convincing: when i only tell you about the positive traits of character of josef stalin, he may seem to be a very nice guy...He appeared to have been a good gardener for instance...So when you don´t keep a proper score, no-one is going to take your claims of power and grandeur seriously: you can only realy win, when there´s something at stake..if you could also loose.
At the same time: when military win´s are something to be proud of, i assume that people who think like this, also must therefore have a deep and sincere respect for the enemy-forces that have been succesfull at their own expense: if you don´t have a deep apreciation for the military might of other people´s army´s, it doesn´t realy make much sense to expect people to apreciate yours.
For this reason, i think it would have been apropriate if for instance, all NATO-states would have had parades to mourn their defeat in afghanistan, and to celebrate and pay respect to the military might of the taliban, over the past few years.
A parade with tarred and feathered military vehicles, and soldiers carrying white flags, while a military band would play a taliban-hymne would probably do it. Instead of a fly-over, i think a group of people who´d carry parts of crashed planes and helicopters would be more apropriate for a good 'defeat-parade'.
Unheimlich
Rising Star
I think that pride in tradition is good. If taken with the right attitude and open eyes. Through pride in tradition and heritage, and using open eyes and cognitive reasoning, I think that a form of patriotism is a great thing.
If you think that your country is great, but can not justify it logically - then you are dangerous.
If you think that your country is better than others, with no grounds firmly entrenched in the real world (no factual proof) then you are dangerous.
Americans - for this reason - are dangerous. This is a blanket statement, so obviously it doesn't mean all Americans.
Still, there is a reason that we are not the favorite of other countries... but then again I can't tell you how many drunk Americans I have seen in German bars shouting "We won bitches, deal with it!"
I am very proud of how America started, and what it could have been... which is why I am extremely disgusted and overtly heartbroken with what is is now. America is probably the saddest story in history... and it seems that it is hellbent on staying that way.
If you think that your country is great, but can not justify it logically - then you are dangerous.
If you think that your country is better than others, with no grounds firmly entrenched in the real world (no factual proof) then you are dangerous.
Americans - for this reason - are dangerous. This is a blanket statement, so obviously it doesn't mean all Americans.
Still, there is a reason that we are not the favorite of other countries... but then again I can't tell you how many drunk Americans I have seen in German bars shouting "We won bitches, deal with it!"
I am very proud of how America started, and what it could have been... which is why I am extremely disgusted and overtly heartbroken with what is is now. America is probably the saddest story in history... and it seems that it is hellbent on staying that way.
unansweredquestions
Rising Star
The state is a machine. As such, it (government and all that goes with it) often seems cold.
However, people are too quick to dismiss their nation's. Without them, we all wouldn't be sitting here discussing what we are, in the comfort of our own living space with a computor.
So, to a level; im proud of societies acomplishments and a vast majority of what the state has achieved. To that extent am I patriotic. Without it, and policies/policing we would be savage animals. (look to group mentality, riot behavior.)
However, i wouldn't ever push for nationalism or the like as it denotes an adoration; a love for state is never good-it leads to a lack of critique and complacency. We can't overlook the bad because of the good. If we do, there will be no progress.
instead, i admire what the people before me have done. But i look to improve on it just as drasticaly as they did.
In the words of Richard Dawkins, tradition is not your friend.
However, people are too quick to dismiss their nation's. Without them, we all wouldn't be sitting here discussing what we are, in the comfort of our own living space with a computor.
So, to a level; im proud of societies acomplishments and a vast majority of what the state has achieved. To that extent am I patriotic. Without it, and policies/policing we would be savage animals. (look to group mentality, riot behavior.)
However, i wouldn't ever push for nationalism or the like as it denotes an adoration; a love for state is never good-it leads to a lack of critique and complacency. We can't overlook the bad because of the good. If we do, there will be no progress.
instead, i admire what the people before me have done. But i look to improve on it just as drasticaly as they did.
In the words of Richard Dawkins, tradition is not your friend.
Yes...and imo, there would be a lot less suffering on this planet as well. We (privileged folks in industrial societies) are a small minority of the global populace. Why should we be thankful to the state that millions were/are denied basic human rights so that we can have comfortable living spaces, computers, etc?unansweredquestions said:
unansweredquestions
Rising Star
SnozzleBerry said:
Not thankful for the state because of the advantages we have (or disadvantages we help cause).
But even more simple than that. For example, a working police force. Sure, some people are corrupt, some laws we dont aggree with. But were relatively blessed in this respect. And much more; from health care to sewage systems.
I say be thankful for what we have and have gained, but as i said, keep a critical eye to identify what is wrogn and look to improve of what needs improving.
Mind you, i disagree we (the west) are 'denying' millions of people basic human rights. Thats a strongly suggestive and misleading term for whats going on. Theres a lot more involved in all these issues than us fat cats in our nice cosy homes taking from the poor starving 3rd worlders. Problems which everyone is a part of causing and everyone needs to work together to fix. from the rich banker, to the foriegn aid minster right down to the 3rd world farmer
I'm just going to say that we're going to have to agree to disagree, point to some facts and then bow out of this.unansweredquestions said:
The US has 5% of the global population and 25% of the global prison population. The US "imprisons a larger percentage of its black population than South Africa did at the height of apartheid." We have more people in jail than China...not per capita, but overall. This community lives in fear because of non-scientifically-based laws that have given the police an excuse to militarize to an insane degree and wage a war against us under all sorts of false pretexts.
Our police force in the US rose out of southern slave catcher gangs, the history is clearly established. Police do not protect you, that is not their purpose. Police are here to ensure that the apparati of the state and its benefactors (i.e., corporations and the socio-economic elite) function without interference from anyone. Please do not ask me to be thankful for the police. I find the idea abhorrent.
As to this:
We are living on stolen land drenched with the blood of genocide and slavery, our resources are stolen at gunpoint, our way of living is killing the planet...the list goes on and on. You may find it suggestive...I find it to be true.
Some food for thought (copy the image links if the text is too small for your screen, the hosted images are significantly larger than they appear):
