Why is so much alcohol necessary?

[CLT]

I was looking around for crude alcohol extractions but I saw that you need an incredible amount of alcohol for them, something like a liter for 100 gram cactus powder.. Why is this necessary?

I started with a kilo of fresh cactus and did was a vinegar boil repeated three times. I let that evaporate and now I have sticky slimy goo left. Does it make sense to do an alcohol extraction on the resin, and do I still need the same amount of alcohol?

 

[benzyme]

what would be the purpose of doing an alcohol extraction? a tincture?
there isn't an advantage to using alcohol over acidic water for an extraction

 

[dg]

I started with a kilo of fresh cactus and did was a vinegar boil repeated three times. I let that evaporate and now I have sticky slimy goo left. Does it make sense to do an alcohol extraction on the resin, and do I still need the same amount of alcohol?

no acid is needed during water extraction, the alkaloids are very water soluble in plant form

now that you have acidic tar, sure you could attempt to extract the tar w/ alcohol, but you'll still end up with tar.

i'd dissolve the goo in a minimum of basic water, adjust ph to 12-14, pull with toluene, salt with sulphuric acid via titration, and crash crystals from solution with mek or acetone
that or just eat the tar as-is

 

[Eliyahu]

what would be the purpose of doing an alcohol extraction? a tincture?
there isn't an advantage to using alcohol over acidic water for an extraction

Sure there is... If you use straight everclear or IPA then there is NO cactus slime to deal with.

 

[benzyme]

please explain this one to me, I'm still thinking in terms of extractions.

 

[mew]

The volume of alcohol is relevant to the type of alcohol and if there's water in it

 

[Eliyahu]

please explain this one to me, I'm still thinking in terms of extractions.

Well I do an isopropyl extraction on the cactus powder. Evap the iso and then from there I can basify the tar and get mescaline without ever dealing with the ever-expanding cactus slime monster green booger creature thing.

 

[mew]

Nice approach eliyahu, what's your yield like ?

 

[benzyme]

please explain this one to me, I'm still thinking in terms of extractions.

Well I do an isopropyl extraction on the cactus powder. Evap the iso and then from there I can basify the tar and get mescaline without ever dealing with the ever-expanding cactus slime monster green booger creature thing.

what advantage is there to extracting with IPA?
the base hydrolyzes plant cells (chemically lysing). you're basically hydrating the cells with an alcohol, then lysing with a base.

to deal with the slime, some people boil in dilute acid for several hours, I PC for half an hour to 40 mins. the cells are lysed and fall to the bottom of the containers, and the acidic phase is easily decanted off.


I've considered alcohol extractions in the past, but can't justify using that much solvent
for a crude extraction. aqueous phases seem to work well

 

[Eliyahu]

Oh ok ....maybe I just wasn't using enough acid im my H20...I always seemed to have serious boogerfication complications to the extreme.

 

[benzyme]

that sort of consistency implies swollen, intact plant cells.
an extensive cook in dilute acid, followed by some form of filtration (or decant, if it was pressure-cooked), leaves behind a semi-viscous liquid containing the alkaloids.

 

[mew]

mew will add a pc to his extraction gear. thanks benz