99% Pure Theobromine

[benzyme]

It was my little brothers brain tumor which got me interested in science. I forget sometimes that everyone doesn't understand these things. I have been in the science game for a while and thus my life revolves around it. I do commonly try to explain things to freinds and family (non-science) and they rarely understand me. I am not trying to validate myself, I don't care at all. One thing SWIM has learned through psychedelics is that life is beutiful and that SWIM is content with who SWIM is. I no longer care at all what others think which I did care alot about in high school. Science is not complex its vocuablary can make it seem otherwise but once these things are learnt it is fairly easy to follow. Look up some of the words and you will get the gist. It is really all about building up from a foundation of some basic knowledge and vocab.
PEACE

it's called "esoterics"

similarly, I got into biochemistry because my sister has HIV.
I often have to "dumb it down" so others can understand it, but it's really not like that at all. those people haven't been educated in the same discipline, so I take it upon myself to explain it in terms so they may understand.
Not everyone likes to immerse themselves in reading manuscripts and rat studies. hell, it's my requirement too, but frankly, it's boring. besides...when's the last time you've ever read a conclusive study? I have yet to stumble upon one.
It's much easier and less alienating to relate theory to real world applications. it also keeps one more grounded; we both know science has enough politics and prick-waving as it is.

 

[Jorkest]

to SWIM theobromine was like taking a dry sponge(SWIM) and throwing it in a big tub of water(dmt/thh/harmaline)

his body soaked that stuff up like it was its job..as soon as it was in his stomach..he knew that he was about to lose control..it was a scary prospect..so he had to prepare his area for some deep journeying..

SWIM is very excited about using theobromine with much lower doses of maoi's and spice..his goal is to find a nice solid dose..using as little precious material(dmt and THH) as possible..he would like to get it to the 5mg range of dmt..and maybe 40mg-60mg range for thh..he may start with perhaps 60-150mg theobromine..he wants to play around with that number too and find the perfect spot..

once SWIM gets these numbers down..he going to look for other chemicals that can be added to the mix to potentiate it even more..he really wants to push the dosage down as far as possible..while still getting super powerful effects..

so if anybody knows of any other NATURAL chemicals that they think would potentiate pharmahuasca more SWIM would love to know about it

by the way..SWIM has been getting waves of tripping all day..fractalized vision..and interesting overlays..especially after eating and smoking weed

one thing he would like to mention is that..his body, brain, self, mind whatever...well they feel really good...he feels refreshed in a way...now if SWIM had taken WAY too much acid..he thinks he would have that.."your brain is shorting out" feeling..and its not very comfortable..

this was the deepest he has ever been taken..but the whole time it felt perfectly fine on the body...granted there would have been way too much maoi potentiation..but he almost feels that the DMT got absorbed first...like his body LOVES dmt..and was using it like the best food in the world...

one would think this would scare SWIM off for a bit..but in reality hes more excited than before about testing out this new combo..hes gonna take a few days off obviously..to get back to earth..but hes really excited about this

does anybody know if theobromine would enable the body to absorb DMT fast enough that the MAO system wouldnt have a chance to break it all down before entering the blood stream?

SWIM would like another way of creating the smoked experience..without the smoked method..this could be a nice breakthrough for the DMT community..being able to have smoked breakthroughs(*short experiences*) without the mess of smoking it..

 

[Nanaki]

Is theobromine the cheapest cost of all of them? If it ends up taking 200-300mg of Theobromine to push down to 5mg of DMT, will that be worth it? Or are we needing to get the theobromine down to 100mg to make a difference?

I'd be all for using the least DMT as possible. 15mg is enough for a breakthrough for SWIM just by itself. With THH, it might be pushed down to 10mg or possibly even 5mg. He will try sometime tomorrow with what's left in the pipe. Might be 5mg. It's enough to smell the DMT but not sure how much. With 15mg of THH, this will add enough so that that in the pipe has a good effect. 15mg of each blows him away. If he added theobromine, that would be even more.


So does theobromine change how focused one is during the journey. Will one be as clear headed as with THH? SWIM doesn't want to waste what little DMT he has remaining before he gets to make more.

 

[psychonaut]

does anybody know if theobromine would enable the body to absorb DMT fast enough that the MAO system wouldnt have a chance to break it all down before entering the blood stream?

Sadly, MAO breaks down DMT just as fast as you can eat it, so I don't think you could speed up absorption enough(it would need to be several hundred times at least).
from DMT - The Spirit Moleule
'Szara swallowed ever-increasing doses of DMT, but felt nothing. He
tried taking up to one full gram"

 

[Jorkest]

ok..well then we will have to rely on maois for now

 

[prottel]

but the whole time it felt perfectly fine on the body...granted there would have been way too much MAOI potentiation..

I doubt it. Would think you would feel much more in the body if that were the case

 

[polytrip]

Acolon_5 had an aya recipe with chaliponga, mate and cat's claw as additives.
Chaliponga as an aya additive means that the dose of DMT is increased, but there's 5-MeO* and 5-HO* in it two as well as some tryptoline of wich 69ron thinks it's the mysterious jungle spice.
Needles to say that chali is kind of a powerfull additive.
Mate has probably some of the effects theobromine has, though i can't compare the two, since i haven't tried theobromine yet.

I've tried all kinds of admixture's for different reasons like helping to remember,to relax or just as potentiator;Mushrooms, cocoa, cannabis, gingko, hydrocotyle, ginger, mate, cat's claw, kola, rhodolia, LSA amd i probably forget to mention some.
Of all of these, the LSA is the only thing i regret having mixed with my brews since it gave me a headache on the come-down.

When i try adding something new, i always start with a low dose unless i know of other people succesfully having tried the admixture before.
I'm gonna give this theobromine a try. But i suspect it to be similar to other potentiators. Under the right circumstances and with the right amounts, oral DMT can be just surprisingly strong.

 

[Jorkest]

but the whole time it felt perfectly fine on the body...granted there would have been way too much MAOI potentiation..

I doubt it. Would think you would feel much more in the body if that were the case

what he means is that..this didnt feel damaging at all..he didnt feel like it was hurting him in anyway..its good that he got the maoi's out as quickly as possible though..because he thinks if he hadnt..it might not have turned out so good..he could still walk fine..even if he didnt know what walking was..

this was one of the most rewarding experiences hes ever had..he almost would like to try to get back to that space..but get the dosage right so that he wont have too much maois..and wont have the need to try and eject anything..now that he knows he can go that far and come back fairly ok...he wants to get say 50mg thh HCL...and maybe 30-40mg dmt..and perhaps try that with a predose of maybe 100mg of theobromine..hes not sure of the dosage though for the theo..

he is thinking about trying the dmt/theo/thh combo on new years...but perhaps not in a large dose..he may try to find the lower end of the spectrum for that...because hes gonna be around people..and doesnt really want to be completely gone

we will see though

 

[prottel]

but get the dosage right so that he wont have too much maois..and wont have the need to try and eject anything..now that he knows he can go that far and come back fairly ok

If you had too much maois, I doubt you would be able to walk, or if you were able to, it would be a very drunken feeling. I know when people get to much of it, they may barely be able to crawl to the toilet, with the puke bucket in one hand, dragging their way across the floor :lol:

Of course, it could be debated what is too much maoi. It is generally known to be good for healing to use larger amounts of it. But if you prefer shorter experiences, instead of 4+ hours, lower amounts of MAOI might be in order.

he is thinking about trying the dmt/theo/thh combo on new years...but perhaps not in a large dose..he may try to find the lower end of the spectrum for that...because hes gonna be around people..and doesnt really want to be completely gone

Looking forward to the report.

 

[prottel]

Here is a report from a friend of SWIM regarding caapi doses:

5 % caapi = Microdosing: no noticeable effects

10 % caapi = Microdosing: barely noticeable effects, almost no MAO inhibition, not enough for dreaming with additives

25 % caapi = Weak dose: fully mobile, partial MAO inhibition, enough to be able to dream with additives, short length of dream with additives (approx. 1-3 hours)

50 % caapi = Medium dose: can move around with effort, tremors, complete MAO inhibition, average length of dreams with additives (approx. 4 hours)

75 % caapi = Very strong effect: immobility, slight or no pain in inner organs, long dreams with additives (approx. 4 – 8 hours)

100 % caapi = Extreme effect: immobility, pain in inner organs which lingers the next day. Very long dreams with additives (can occasionally be up to 12 hours.)

 

[Garulfo]

Not read that much about theobromine,it is very toxic to dogs and cats because they do not have the right enzyme to 'digest it' (don't remember the good word).

Why Is Chocolate So Bad for Dogs?

Dogs may beg for cocoa goodness, but eating chocolate products can be toxic and even fatal, for your furry friends.

vetmedicine.about.com

by the way..SWIM has been getting waves of tripping all day..fractalized vision..

The half life of theobromine seems quite long (7 hours ?)

Would it be possible that some people have more or less of the appropriate enzymes and therefore handle somehow well a given amount of theobromine ? My friend know by experience that he has very few enzymes for digesting DXM :x
300 mg seems not that much but my friend know for sure that his stomach would not enjoy it.
Althought I agree with Ron that speculating with theorical datas is useless, it would be interresting for people to know that they 'may' experiment some hard time with that substance and must be very cautious with doses.

and interesting overlays..especially after eating and smoking weed

Oh well, weed is well known to 'reactivate' body memories.

 

[Jorkest]

If you had too much maois, I doubt you would be able to walk, or if you were able to, it would be a very drunken feeling. I know when people get to much of it, they may barely be able to crawl to the toilet, with the puke bucket in one hand, dragging their way across the floor Laughing

now that you mention that drunk feeling..that most certainly was present when he went on the walk out in the cold..he was kinda staggering..this was about 5-10minutes after ingesting the second cocktail...

 

[prottel]

It may be that theobromine easily potentiates dmt, but the maois need a higher dose of theobromine to potentiate it. That seems to have been the case with caapi. Have seen several warnings to not drink large amounts of coffee, green tea, mate etc. before taking ayahuasca. Normal amounts does not seem to matter that much. Might also be different from person to person.

 

[rellik]

hey dagger. in your previous post, what do the percentages of cappi corrispond to? i.e. 50% of the brew? 50% of max considered doasge?

hot chocolate and dark chocolate bars have significant effects on SWIM's experiences something in them definately potentiates cappi + fumarate doses as well as smoked DMT doses.
adding piperine (bioperine) to the mix further potentiated the effects when a cup of hot chocolate was ingested during SWIM's last low dose oral journey. SWIM felt incredibly lucid and much more talkative in a beneficial way than compared to his normal quiet self.

SWIM needs to look into some pure theobromine

 

[Jorkest]

well when SWIM tried cacao with THH..there was some definite potentiation..he doesnt remember what the dose was..but it was there...he feels it does potentiate it..but not as much as with dmt

 

[prottel]

hey dagger. in your previous post, what do the percentages of cappi corrispond to? i.e. 50% of the brew? 50% of max considered doasge?

It does not really correspond with any dose. You have to feel for it yourself. I would guess that with average strength caapi at 50 gram, it might correspond to about 25-40%. If you got really strong caapi, 50 gram could correspond to 100%

hot chocolate and dark chocolate bars have significant effects on SWIM's experiences something in them definately potentiates cappi + fumarate doses as well as smoked DMT doses.
adding piperine (bioperine) to the mix further potentiated the effects when a cup of hot chocolate was ingested during SWIM's last low dose oral journey.

How much would you say it potentiated the experience? When during the experience did you drink the chocolate?

 

[polytrip]

If you had too much maois, I doubt you would be able to walk, or if you were able to, it would be a very drunken feeling. I know when people get to much of it, they may barely be able to crawl to the toilet, with the puke bucket in one hand, dragging their way across the floor Laughing

now that you mention that drunk feeling..that most certainly was present when he went on the walk out in the cold..he was kinda staggering..this was about 5-10minutes after ingesting the second cocktail...

Short distances indeed can become quite adventurous journeys.

 

[acolon_5]

I was quite interested in the theoretical side of this thread, but it kinda went away.

I am most interested because if we know WHY these things are happening we may be able to find other chemicals that will work in a similar way. Just because some of us (myself included) don't quite follow these types of discussions does not mean it does not have a place on this forum!

For what it is worth my Theobromine experiements:

~300mg alone. Stimulation, pleasant. Milder than caffien, or at least less side effects. Lasted about 3-4 hours

~200mg theobromine with JWH-018 Stimulation and stoned feeling....no potentiation of vaporized cannibinoid noticed

~300mg theobromine with MJ - Again, no potentiation of vaporized cannibinoid, more stimulation than with 200mgs

~100mgs Theobromine (oral) 10mg THH HCL (rectal) Slight stimulation, increased THH effects (slight CEV's), much more euphoria, mood was fantastic most of the day.

I plan on trying higher doses theobromine and 10mgs THH as well as lower doses of theobromine with higher doses of THH.

The effects from theobromine seem to kick in within 3 minutes, even with food on my stomach. I am quite surprised at how quick it works. I have not tried over 300mgs of theobromine. I find that 300mgs is about all the stimulation that I want or can handle.

EDIT: 200mgs Theobromine and 20mgs THH (sublingually) Started off with a very pleasant feeling. This feeling grew and grew and then abruptly stopped. My mood changed from happy and euphoric to angry, upset, and mildly violent. This is highly unusual for me even in the worst of moods. There was no situational event to trigger such an emotional responce. Not sure what happened, but it was not good. Within 2 hours this feeling passed and I was back to my usual self. I may try again with this combination later to see if it was the combo or something else.

 

['Coatl]

Whats the dosage in Mg for 100% pure theobromine?

Whats the dosage for a 22% "full specturm" Cacao extract?

 

[Jorkest]

the dose that 'they' recommended with the pure theo was 300mg

and here is some more info...SWIM just remembered that when he took his thh/harmaline/dmt fumarate combo..he had food in his stomach...which..when he normally takes that combo with food..it has a very reduced effect..this did not seem to matter with the Theobromine