Acacia in the Bible

[BecometheOther]

if you want to deal in hard and fast facts good luck dealing with any of the entheogenic revelations

exp when dealing directly with spirituality as is the context of the OP

 

[pitubo]

like because us or the ancients understand what is what is instantly explodes and everyone understands? no.

Like what ancients?

i could tell you the truth right now (i cant) and you would not understand it

I could be telling you the truth too and you could not accept it.

 

[BecometheOther]

i empbrace wholeheartedly critical though. Im not a new ager who blindly accepts anything. I also despise regression and lack of acceptance of what already is obvious. bottom line. ancients made aya, period, here or there they made it. what does that mean? nothing. of course they did. we all live in direct interation with divine in some form or another. weather we accept it or not we are part of it

 

[BecometheOther]

so easy to think in terms of ourselves and our lifetime. we are but specks of dust. we know nothing

 

[pitubo]

if you want to deal in hard and fast facts good luck dealing with any of the entheogenic revelations

I'd like to do both, really. But to do so and remain sanely attached to reality, IMHO requires the ability to reflect on mere impulses of the senses and of the intellect. Without suspended judgment and diligence in seeking external validation from objective resources, one easily falls prey to emotionally charged delusions.

exp when dealing directly with spirituality as is the context of the OP

That's not what he said:

I just wanted to have a fun stoner conversation.... Some of you take things so freaking seriously! I say we all smoke a joint, relax, and have a good conversation .

 

[BecometheOther]

So he echoing pretty much what im saying? that things of revelance to be discussed here are attacked because of egos desire to be right or wrong? when if we were mystics we would know it is a foolish endevour to prove anyone right or wrong.? how about we all just subscribe to the rational western scientists theory of matter and deny everthing else.. Sounds dumb but i promis you it is pretty much exactly 100% what everyone here is doing and REEALLY REALLY selling ourselves short. THEY HAVE ACCESS TO RESOURCES AND EQUIPMENT. what they are held to is a reductionist self supporting theory. whereas i hope we are not

 

[BecometheOther]

and how clear of a picture of "reality" are you attachted to? pretty boastful to claim to be 100% in touch with the true reality, when you are a fickle human

 

[BecometheOther]

if you want to deal in hard and fast facts good luck dealing with any of the entheogenic revelations

I'd like to do both, really. But to do so and remain sanely attached to reality, IMHO requires the ability to reflect on mere impulses of the senses and of the intellect. Without suspended judgment and diligence in seeking external validation from objective resources, one easily falls prey to emotionally charged delusions.

exp when dealing directly with spirituality as is the context of the OP

That's not what he said:

I just wanted to have a fun stoner conversation.... Some of you take things so freaking seriously! I say we all smoke a joint, relax, and have a good conversation .

reality impies that you are right and i am wrong. Where in truth to claim knowledge of absolute reality is something no human can currentlyl claim to do

 

[BecometheOther]

and i dont claim to be in touch with absolute reality, any more than we all are, but to say that we know anything of it is incredibly arrogant. Can you tell me one thing you know to be true and 100% eternal in its truth?\

 

[pitubo]

and how clear of a picture of "reality" are you attachted to? pretty boastful to claim to be 100% in touch with the true reality, when you are a fickle human

Where did I state that? Please quote me on that verbatim or otherwise stop spouting nonsensical claims about what other people said or did. Alas already you don't feel the need to back up or retract earlier accusations, like I asked for earlier, so I am going to disengage from this "debate".

Be well.

 

[hug46]

Here is a copy of Benny Shanon's Biblicial Entheogen Hypothesis.

Benny Shanon is Professor of psychology at the Hebrew
University of Jerusalem (Israel). His main foci of research
are the phenomenology of human consciousness and the
philosophy of psychology. His publications include
The Representational and the Presentational
(1993) and The Antipodes of the Mind
(2002). At present, he is working on
a book devoted to a general psychological theory of human
consciousness. msshanon@mscc.huji.ac.il


Abstract
A speculative hypothesis is presented according to which
the ancient Israelite religion was associated with the use
of entheogens (mind-altering plants used in sacramental
contexts). The hypothesis is based on a new look at texts
of the Old Testament pertaining to the life of Moses. The
ideas entertained here were primarily based on the fact
that in the arid areas of the Sinai peninsula and Southern
Israel there grow two plants containing the same
psychoactive molecules found in the plants from which
the powerful Amazonian hallucinogenic brew Ayahuasca
is prepared. The two plants are species of Acacia tree and
the bush Peganum harmala. The hypothesis is corroborated
by comparative experiential-phenomenological
observations, linguistic considerations, exegesis of old
Jewish texts and other ancient Mideastern traditions,
anthropological lore, and ethnobotanical data.

 

[BecometheOther]

i would be glad to. please hold

 

[BecometheOther]

pitubo, was going to dig through this thread and quote you multiple times, but i literally do not have the time. I am engaged in affairs i find much more important. but it is clear througought the thread you sought to give answers and understanding where you have none. Cheers!

 

[BecometheOther]

UNDERSTANDING. being the key word. Like right after i said of course the ancients had knowledge of ayahuasca, what does it matter? You said what ancients? Well if not the ancient hebrews ( and of couurse they did) than for sure scientifically proven many other cultures did.... What exactly does that matter? My point was that of course they had access to this knowledge, to assume otherwise would be nieve. and even if they did... so do we.... what does it matter

 

[BecometheOther]

if you want to deal in hard and fast facts good luck dealing with any of the entheogenic revelations

You (Pitubo) I'd like to do both, really. But to do so and remain sanely attached to reality, IMHO requires the ability to reflect on mere impulses of the senses and of the intellect. Without suspended judgment and diligence in seeking external validation from objective resources, one easily falls prey to emotionally charged delusions.

 

[BecometheOther]

You did imply that it was you in touch with reality and that my perception of reality is flawed. When i consider myself extremely discerning and a seeker of the true truth. But of course you are the god on whats right or wrong

If im wrong, correct me but in saying that you seemed to imply that i was not discerning and not a seeker of truth

 

[pitubo]

BecometheOther, I am really finished for now arguing with you. You claim to not have the time to back up disputed earlier claims, yet you do appear to have the time to keep posting more claims. I take that as a lack of respect for the discussion and the other forum members.

Back to topic, this has been debated before on the forum, multiple times even. When I only searched for "moses" in the topic title, I found three threads already. The earliest, "Moses was on Aya" say scientists is remarkably down to earth, or at least half the participants are. I sometimes wish that the general level of critical discernment was always that high on the forum.

Here is a copy of Benny Shanon's Biblicial Entheogen Hypothesis.

Benny Shanon is Professor of psychology at the Hebrew
University of Jerusalem (Israel). His main foci of research
are the phenomenology of human consciousness and the
philosophy of psychology.
..[snipped by pitubo]..
The hypothesis is corroborated
by comparative experiential-phenomenological
observations, linguistic considerations, exegesis of old
Jewish texts and other ancient Mideastern traditions,
anthropological lore, and ethnobotanical data.

I note the absence of archaeological data and want to reiterate a comment that I made in an earlier "biblical ayahuasca" thread, in this posting in the "how Moses made ayahuasca?" thread:

What if Moses is as real as Santaclaus?

So, with the coming of the Zionists to Palestine, a frantic archeological search started. The country was combed for real, scientific proof that the Biblical story was not just a bunch of myths, but real honest-to-God history. (Pun intended.) Christian Zionists came even earlier.

There started a veritable attack on archeological sites. The upper layers of Ottoman and Mamelukes, Arabs and Crusaders, Byzantines and Romans and Greeks and Persians were uncovered and removed in order to lay bare the ancient layer of the Children of Israel and to prove the Bible right.

Huge efforts were made. David Ben-Gurion, a self-appointed Biblical scholar, led the effort. The Chief of Staff of the army, Yigael Yadin, the son of an archeologist, and himself a professional archeologist, searched ancient sites to prove that the Conquest of Canaan really happened. Alas, no proof.

When remnants of the bones of Bar Kochba’s fighters were discovered in Judean desert caves, they were buried on Ben-Gurion’s orders in a big military ceremony. The uncontested fact that Bar Kochba had caused perhaps the greatest catastrophe in Jewish history was glossed over.

And the result? Incredible as it sounds, four generations of devoted archeologists, with a burning conviction and huge resources, did produce exactly: Nothing.

Is this important? Yes and no. The Bible is not real history. It is a monumental religious and literary document, that has inspired untold millions throughout the centuries. It has formed the minds of many generations of Jews, Christians and Muslims.

But history is something else. History tells us what really happened. Archeology is a tool of history, an invaluable tool for the understanding of what took place. These are two different disciplines, and never the twain shall meet.

For the religious, the Bible is a matter of belief. For non-believers, the Hebrew Bible is a great work of art, perhaps the greatest of all. Archeology is something entirely different: a matter of sober, proven facts.

 

[Running Bear]

Whether it be a person tattling on someone for cheating on a test, A kiss a-- on the job, or someone that spends all their time reminding people of the attitude page, I view it as a sign of weakness. I don't see it as black and white because I've never seen him say anything positive about anything. Just the fact that he pulled up some links shows he lacks a social life. Show me some links of him being kind and positive to someone lol. If you have nothing good to say about the topic then why say anything at all? Don't you have anything better to do with your life? If the topic was out of place and didn't belong here don't you think a moderator would have done something about it? The only reason i said this was stoner talk was to shut pitubo up because I know what he does. It only makes me upset because I wanted this place to be different than other forms. I wanted to communicate with kind, like minded people that truly wanted to help each other. That's not what im seeing on the nexus forum . I've talked to some good people on chat but that's about it . I think there's a lot of people on this thing that dont actually use psychedelics, that use this thing due to lacking a social life. I tried to have his comment deleted but the moderator has something going on in his life and can't do it right now. If I ever post anything on the nexus again I'm just going to have his comments deleted.

 

[Running Bear]

A lot of people have theorized that the "burning bush" spoken about in Exodus was a DMT containing plant. It's an interesting theory, and one that I'm not sure has much evidence beyond the fact that the account kind of sounds like what happens during a DMT trip, but it's possible nonetheless.
As for the percentage of DMT in certain plants, that's something you can easily google. We usually expect people to do their own research before posting on the nexus - so in the future, make sure you do a google search or browse the nexus a little before asking a question.
But, to answer that question, about .5 to 1.5 percent

I've done many extracttons with plants including acacia confusa. There are many species of acacia and they all have different alkaloid profiles genius. No one knows what species of acacia it was in the bible so I wanted to hear other people's theories. You literally just became a full member and you're already playing babysitter, what's that say about you? I just love how you say we as if you've been a member for the past 10 years :lol: . I seriously wonder about people.

Calling someone 'genius' in snide remarks, and then personally attacking by referring to someone as 'babysitter', when indicunt offered his/her opinions/explanation, then further attacking his/her credibility because he/she's a new member?

Like I said brother, you're better than this. Stirring the pot like this in threads through blatant personal attack isn't what this website is about.

And I'm just coming at a place of concern for you, because these remarks are divisive and rude. These members are offering their opinions and thoughts, without the need to use direct personal attacks, yet it seems that you're unable to reply to their comments without getting hot-headed?

Be well

I personally talked to someone on chat that knows Indicunt in real life that said some disturbing things about him. If you was on chat that day you would feel differently. The next time you log on chat ask about him. Im not going to say who it was.

 

[○]

A lot of people have theorized that the "burning bush" spoken about in Exodus was a DMT containing plant. It's an interesting theory, and one that I'm not sure has much evidence beyond the fact that the account kind of sounds like what happens during a DMT trip, but it's possible nonetheless.
As for the percentage of DMT in certain plants, that's something you can easily google. We usually expect people to do their own research before posting on the nexus - so in the future, make sure you do a google search or browse the nexus a little before asking a question.
But, to answer that question, about .5 to 1.5 percent

I've done many extracttons with plants including acacia confusa. There are many species of acacia and they all have different alkaloid profiles genius. No one knows what species of acacia it was in the bible so I wanted to hear other people's theories. You literally just became a full member and you're already playing babysitter, what's that say about you? I just love how you say we as if you've been a member for the past 10 years :lol: . I seriously wonder about people.

Calling someone 'genius' in snide remarks, and then personally attacking by referring to someone as 'babysitter', when indicunt offered his/her opinions/explanation, then further attacking his/her credibility because he/she's a new member?

Like I said brother, you're better than this. Stirring the pot like this in threads through blatant personal attack isn't what this website is about.

And I'm just coming at a place of concern for you, because these remarks are divisive and rude. These members are offering their opinions and thoughts, without the need to use direct personal attacks, yet it seems that you're unable to reply to their comments without getting hot-headed?

Be well

I personally talked to someone on chat that knows Indicunt in real life that said some disturbing things about him. If you was on chat that day you would feel differently. The next time you log on chat ask about him. Im not going to say who it was.

Running Bear, this is irrelevant and is just inciting more drama, this is not the point of this discussion, and you continue to do this despite what was said to you, do you see what I'm saying?

What someone over an internet tells you, especially if you don't know this person that well [personally], this is only personal assumption. this need not be in this thread. Let's continue the discussion that was the purpose of this OP, no?

Be well