Ethanspice
Rising Star
Hello I was just wondering if anyone had any experiences with LSH I cant seem to find much on it any input would be appreciated.
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LSH experiences/info
- Thread starter Ethanspice
- Start date
flickedbic
Rising Star
I guess what may be forming is LST (Lysergic Acid Tetraethylamide) rather than LSH* but I'm no chem whiz.
Doing CWE then adding acetaldehyde in a cold environment with plenty of agitation has yielded some exeptional experiences. Really amped up the euhoria and about cancelled the sedation. Slight increase in visual effect and an electric body feel. These changes seem commonplace in those whom successfully experiment with the combination.
A better source of acetaldehyde might be White or Sherry wine (they should smell like apples; as acetaldehyde does). These could be great choices to use for overnight hydro-alcoholic extractions. Cold-brewed coffee is also an acetaldehyde source; vasodialating and adding good energy to boot!
The Cinnemaldehyde combo is even more of an obvious change. The peaks is at 15 minutes; but it lasts as long. Much stonger vids; true OEV are possible at what would otherwise be a normal dose. It is about twice as potent. Be safe.
*http://herbs.maxforum.org/2012/10/17/we-were-wrong-about-lsh/#post7
Doing CWE then adding acetaldehyde in a cold environment with plenty of agitation has yielded some exeptional experiences. Really amped up the euhoria and about cancelled the sedation. Slight increase in visual effect and an electric body feel. These changes seem commonplace in those whom successfully experiment with the combination.
A better source of acetaldehyde might be White or Sherry wine (they should smell like apples; as acetaldehyde does). These could be great choices to use for overnight hydro-alcoholic extractions. Cold-brewed coffee is also an acetaldehyde source; vasodialating and adding good energy to boot!
The Cinnemaldehyde combo is even more of an obvious change. The peaks is at 15 minutes; but it lasts as long. Much stonger vids; true OEV are possible at what would otherwise be a normal dose. It is about twice as potent. Be safe.
*http://herbs.maxforum.org/2012/10/17/we-were-wrong-about-lsh/#post7
Ethanspice
Rising Star
That's interesting I will have to try this sometime thanks for your input:grin: anyone else have any info?
a tetraethylamine definitely doesn't exist (Nitrogen doesn't have 5 valence electrons),
and there's no evidence to suggest other adducts form with the addition of various essential
oils given the typical reaction conditions posted.
this isn't some neat redox reaction with a simple small molecule, people are talking about an addition reaction to a chiral molecule with a stereocenter that readily isomerizes.
and there's no evidence to suggest other adducts form with the addition of various essential
oils given the typical reaction conditions posted.
this isn't some neat redox reaction with a simple small molecule, people are talking about an addition reaction to a chiral molecule with a stereocenter that readily isomerizes.
Ethanspice
Rising Star
benzyme Do you think it is possible that the acetaldehyde may be reacting with the other ergot alkaloids present in the seeds.
it's not probable that the acetaldehyde present, if any, is reacting with anything because the reaction equilibrium favors LSA formation.
I've mentioned this several times (pardon me if this is the first time you've read it),
but for some reason, people who don't comprehend the concept seem to think faith makes the
reaction occur, and they are convinced that they really make LSH rather than a minty LSA cocktail.
*edit* on a side note, I've also mentioned that it's plausible that another pharmacological effect is occurring with these essential oils being consumed.
I've mentioned this several times (pardon me if this is the first time you've read it),
but for some reason, people who don't comprehend the concept seem to think faith makes the
reaction occur, and they are convinced that they really make LSH rather than a minty LSA cocktail.
*edit* on a side note, I've also mentioned that it's plausible that another pharmacological effect is occurring with these essential oils being consumed.
Ethanspice
Rising Star
That may be true but that doesn't explain why people are describing better experiences with this so called "LSH" You seem to be experienced with with chemistry what do you think is causing this. It may be placebo but I haven't tried this so I wouldn't know. flickedbic do you think it is possible that what you experienced was placebo.
I just told you, in the edit.
people report synergistic effects all the time, consuming various foods/drugs
that alter the quality of mushroom and mescaline experiences. I see no reason the same could
not apply to LSA.
people report synergistic effects all the time, consuming various foods/drugs
that alter the quality of mushroom and mescaline experiences. I see no reason the same could
not apply to LSA.
Ethanspice
Rising Star
That's a good point thanks benzyme. Well whatever it is, it seems to work from what i hear so I will try this for myself and get back to you. I think that this may be a good alternative to LSD It may not be the same thing but hey Its natural.
it's definitely intriguing, methinks, and you get peace of mind because you pretty much know what you are consuming. keep experimenting. 
Ethanspice
Rising Star
I definitely will, I will get back you when I get some results. Let me know if you find any info on the subject.
Ethanspice
Rising Star
Ok so i came up with some interesting results. I first tryed the LSH extraction with white whine like flickedbic described and I had a overall better experience more euphoria ect. And it defiantly wasn't placebo. Then I tryed drinking the white whine and taking the LSA at different times and It worked with that method which means that benzyme was most likely right about the acetaldehyde having a synergistic effect with the LSA.
benzyme said:
You couldn't be more wrong!
After experimenting with aldehydes, I have determined that aldehydes are able to bind to nitrogen atoms with only a single bond available. This means that LSH does not form from the reaction of LSA and acetaldehyde. A molecule much closer to LSD is formed.
We thought LSC looked something like this:
In reality what will form is something like this:
Therefore, the reaction between LSA and acetaldehyde would not produce LSH:
It would produce LST [Lysergic Acid Tetraethylamide]:
Which has just three more carbon atoms than LSD:
The nitrogen with the single methyl group can be replaced by aldehydes. Mesembrine, mitragynine, and rhynchophylline have only single bonds available for their nitrogens, and mesembrine has a methyl group covering up its only nitrogen. All three of those molecules can be reacted with aldehydes to produce molecules with modified pharacokinetics. Therefore LST would result from the reaction of acetaldehyde and LSA; not LSH.
im sorry but your'e wrong :thumb_up:
Bilbo92 said:
So first off your nomenclature is wrong. Tetraethylamide does indeed imply 5 bonds to a tetravalent nitrogen like benzyme imagines. What you have shown is diethylamide..... The other two nitrogens which you have ethyl groups on are tertiary amines and are thus not amides... So it's not tetraethyl amide.
Secondly, can you show any sort of NMR evidence for the second LSC adduct you propose above? The reason I ask is the first cinnaminaldehyde addition you show in structure one is quite unstable and in the presence of water would easily undergo amide hydrolysis thus making it very unlikely that the second adduct would form.
Believe me, I want this to be true as much as everyone else, but unless someone can show the presence of these species via NMR then I'm inclined to agree with Benzyme... and I'm usually the guy saying everything doesn't require a publication..
BTW I also agree with Benzyme that it could be a favorable drug-drug interaction going on..
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