Messianic delusions

[smoalkiest]

One thing that really interests me about people who habitually use DMT and daily, apperently according to strassman people tend to develop delusions of grandeur. May lead credence to the Jesus state.

Proof of the messianic delusions is the story of Chris cantelmo. I'm sure y'all are aware but it was really sad he was telling people DMT cures brain cancer etc he was the messiah etc.

 

[Nydex]

From what I can tell, this isn't exclusive to DMT at all. Many people have lost the plot through mushrooms and LSD and a vast array of RCs and lesser-known substances. To me it seems the birth of these messianic delusions is much more related to one's predisposition, cultural framework, upbringing, and current mental state, than the substance of choice.

It is always sad though, that's a constant.

 

[smoalkiest]

I mean who's to say they are wrong though who knows if Jesus was right or even Chris cantelmo as sad as it is who knows if just Maaaybe they're right? Idk lmao

 

[northape]

What's the meaning behind this thread? Are you afraid of manic states, or maybe you're in one already?
For me, a few tablespoons of piracetam powder with coffee was readily producing manic states on demand. I had my fun with it, but the state is
quite delusional and fully unproductive long-term. You burn through tons of brain energy too, and it takes a while to return to a normal state afterwards.
Basically, it's not worth it. I do feel for those who went off the rails. Any substance could trigger a manic episode if you have a predisposition for it.
Madness is fun only in small doses. You can easily go past the threshold of no return. Breathe and be humble.

 

[Nydex]

Madness is fun only in small doses. You can easily go past the threshold of no return. Breathe and be humble.

100% this ^^^

 

[universecannon]

Well...I prefer those to the paranoid delusions

It's fascinating that some are more prone to this than others. And how long it lasts, how convinced they are, what triggers it etc. seem highly variable depending on the person and many factors.

Cannabis on the comeup of psychedelics appears to manifest this quite reliably for those susceptible, especially if they aren't daily smokers. Though I think anyone can experience it if the experience reaches certain thresholds of depth or intensity, and the ego hasn't been relaxed/put in its place sufficiently as it approaches annihilation.

 

[blig-blug]

This is a good quote by Alan Watts on the topic, even if a bit simplistic in its romantic characterization of India:

Jesus Christ knew he was God. So wake up and find out eventually who you really are. In our culture, of course, they’ll say you’re crazy and you’re blasphemous, and they’ll either put you in jail or in a nut house (which is pretty much the same thing). However if you wake up in India and tell your friends and relations, ‘My goodness, I’ve just discovered that I’m God,’ they’ll laugh and say, ‘Oh, congratulations, at last you found out.’

I think messianic delusions come from experiencing that one is much more than the consensus reality ego without realizing that may apply to everyone and everything else as well.

 

[eLeSDee]

I think it's an interesting topic. Anytime I read older threads about people using too hard and ritualisticlly, and others trying to help them...like one ended up ditching DMT altogether because of these delusional states that play with divinity(i think was what he sort of said).

I found a great video on YT of this cat named Joey, that talks deeply about the matter of entities and the matter of Angels/Demons. He has great gnostic talks on literature and I'd like to say he is up to speed with the psychedelic community but I really do not know.

Anyway, yes a sliver of this has happened to me a few times on LSD and Mushrooms, mostly paranoia of whatever, but some of the best LSD trips were difficult spiritual ones.

I also agree that chronic marijuana smokers are not prone to this as much as the casual user but definitely seems to be a culprit. When I was 15 or 16, most smoke sessions left me stuck in my head paranoid and now that I am much older this happens much less. I have to have my green!!

 

[northape]

The real issue with madness is whether you see your situation or are fully consumed by it. The second one is scary and is a true downfall, imo.
Psychedelics teach you about sanity, yet insanity is the other side of the coin. I've had a few times on medicine when I knew I could potentially screw my mind up for good.
It went beyond the common strong trip, when you think that this time you've done it for real. I just knew if I went into madness, it was going to stay.
How much of that was real I don't want to find out. Stay sane, stay safe, and be present.

 

[doubledog]

Imo lack of teachers and tradition is the main culprit.
If we had real live tradition, there would be somebody who would step in and bring some support and wisdom.

Phenomenon itself is pretty common, reaction (individual and social) is the problem.

 

[TheGreenPhantom]

Once upon a time in the Big Bad City, I preached the Gospel of the Cartoon People, entities from the 2nd Dimension who are slowly invading the minds of 3 dimensional beings, by coaxing their awareness to be consumed by 2-dimensional representations of their 3-dimensional worlds....

 

[TheGreenPhantom]

Beware of Daffy Duck, whose true name isn't "Daffy Duck," as he is known by a name incomprehensible to those of the 3rd Dimension.

...also... Cartoon Jeff...
He kinda looks like Fred from Scooby Doo... he's the one who lures you in...

 

[Jamie01]

It’s not that different from the people who want to fight over whether or not they are meeting plant spirits or if maybe synth psychedelics aren’t spiritual. It’s like that’s em what you got out of this? Really? That? How materialistic.

Everyone has a version of what went on but who cares? Did you feel love or not?

 

[rkba]

Madness. For me observed madness indicates changes in the core-perceptions. You have changed your cores to the point that reflecting realities have become crazy madness. The world is going nuts. Not me!

In my mind ones' reality is created by the core-perceptions.

Words can't describe them, theories can't explain them, ideologies can't tame them. But one can experience them.

Core-perceptions can only be experienced. And I think that they can be modified. I think that a shift in perception allows a different viewpoint on the experienced reality. This in turn can create a shift in a core-perception. The new 'found' viewpoint then changes the experienced reality. 'Old' reflections seem then 'out of place', sometimes even crazy.

I view madness and craziness as excellent indicators for shifting core-perceptions.

Realizing you're living in an insan-o-sylum is nothing to sneeze at. You may even start to see the light of the cave-exit.

My rudder in this turbulent river of crazyness is the Feel of Love.

May Love guide me to the caves' exit and whatever may lay behind it.

Feel the Love and Love the Feel. Proud to be nuts!