psilocybin
Rising Star
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official extraction help thread
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Journeymann
Rising Star
LucidLemonade's sunflower oil mescaline extraction - DMT-Nexus Wiki
I was curious, can I start this tek with and A/B vinegar boil then hit it with the lye and wind up with the same results of the tek?
In theroy I am working with 34g sanpedro cacti (dry) that has been vinegar boiled, filtered and reduced to 1 cup portions.
I like the tek just not sure if starting with an A/B acid boil changes the out come of the tek.
Thanks for your time folks!
misterpip
Rising Star
Hi everybody.
I've been using Coleman Liquid Fuel for extraction - not the USA version which turns things green (so I hear), the European flavour.
Anyway, I've a dish which has been sitting for about a week (I keep it pretty much covered with food wrap/cling film with the edges rolled back slightly to let some air in) & there are a few crystals at one end which seem to be sitting in little puddles of solvent (I assume). I have removed the film & have left the dish open to the air to speed up the evap in this, hopefully, last stage.
My question is: Is this kind of timescale normal? Am I being a little impatient wanting to harvest what's in there? I suppose I've waited this long, another day or two won't hurt. Thoughts anyone?
I've been using Coleman Liquid Fuel for extraction - not the USA version which turns things green (so I hear), the European flavour.
Anyway, I've a dish which has been sitting for about a week (I keep it pretty much covered with food wrap/cling film with the edges rolled back slightly to let some air in) & there are a few crystals at one end which seem to be sitting in little puddles of solvent (I assume). I have removed the film & have left the dish open to the air to speed up the evap in this, hopefully, last stage.
My question is: Is this kind of timescale normal? Am I being a little impatient wanting to harvest what's in there? I suppose I've waited this long, another day or two won't hurt. Thoughts anyone?
stationdragon
Rising Star
Hi everyone,
new here, first post.
I'm going to have quite a few questions regarding extraction I think because of holes in popular tek's and slight confusions, though I mostly get it.
Today though, I need to clear up a HUGE confusion. There's two main extractions I've been looking at, this one http://tribes.tribe.net/ethnobotany/thread/bddc25e3-aeca-418d-811b-a46bbbc5d603
and Volvin's Tek Vovin's tek - DMT-Nexus Wiki.
Both follow a similar path until something quite contradictory happens in the middle part, involving the naphtha. In the first one it says
"There should now be two layers visible in the jug, a lower dark one and a smaller clear one on top filling the neck of the jug. Use a glass turkey baster to suck up the top clear layer into a pint mason jar. Be careful not to suck up any of the lower brown/black layer into the mason jar. place the sealed mason jar in a FREEZER for 3 days to precipitate the crystals."
But Volvin's says pretty much the exact opposite "You should now have your extraction in a flask and the naphtha in the funnel. You can discard the naphtha and begin the process again."
Now who's right here? One says keep the naphtha and evaporate from the DMT crystals and the other says discard the naphtha and extract the crystals from the other (dark) remaining liquid.
Am I missing something here? Very confused.
I also have a few questions regarding ammonia wash and it's necessity, re-crystallization, among others but I'll leave them until later so this doesn't turn into a massive post.
Thanks for any help you can offer guys.
new here, first post.
I'm going to have quite a few questions regarding extraction I think because of holes in popular tek's and slight confusions, though I mostly get it.
Today though, I need to clear up a HUGE confusion. There's two main extractions I've been looking at, this one http://tribes.tribe.net/ethnobotany/thread/bddc25e3-aeca-418d-811b-a46bbbc5d603
and Volvin's Tek Vovin's tek - DMT-Nexus Wiki.
Both follow a similar path until something quite contradictory happens in the middle part, involving the naphtha. In the first one it says
"There should now be two layers visible in the jug, a lower dark one and a smaller clear one on top filling the neck of the jug. Use a glass turkey baster to suck up the top clear layer into a pint mason jar. Be careful not to suck up any of the lower brown/black layer into the mason jar. place the sealed mason jar in a FREEZER for 3 days to precipitate the crystals."
But Volvin's says pretty much the exact opposite "You should now have your extraction in a flask and the naphtha in the funnel. You can discard the naphtha and begin the process again."
Now who's right here? One says keep the naphtha and evaporate from the DMT crystals and the other says discard the naphtha and extract the crystals from the other (dark) remaining liquid.
Am I missing something here? Very confused.
I also have a few questions regarding ammonia wash and it's necessity, re-crystallization, among others but I'll leave them until later so this doesn't turn into a massive post.
Thanks for any help you can offer guys.
stationdragon
Rising Star
I just realized that the first one adds lye before the naphtha then removes the naphtha for evaporation where volvin's mixes and removes the naphtha before adding the lye. So I'm seeing what I was missing before but being no chemist I don't know what difference this makes or which is better for purity (and yes, it's purity I'm aiming for rather than yield)
stationdragon
Rising Star
Feel free to ignore my last couple of posts. I didn't want to be the newbie with the annoying question that's easily answered providing he just read on but that's exactly who I was. I've just read so much tonight and had so many conflicting things that I just couldn't take another contradiction to throw me off track again. I've found the one I'm happy with and I'm going to see how that fares.
Thanks anyway guys, I know you would have been here for me if needed.
Thanks anyway guys, I know you would have been here for me if needed.
Binary Drool
Rising Star
I've always made DMT freebase, but I hate freeze prepping so I always evaporate. I'm sick of wasting the solvent and waiting.. So I just started to salt with HCL. The first time I salted was recently on a San Pedro extraction, pic attached. Product came out great, but was eaten opposed to smoked.
Are DMT acetate/HCL and DMT freebase completely different? Can you smoke DMT acetate as you would freebase. or does the 'acetate' just mean is came from a acidic solution and 'freebase' mean it came from a basic solution.
The reason I ask is that I do dry Teks and use Ca(OH)2 to base.
I'd like to salt out with 50ml of HCL/water and evap that and be done, BUT if the spice must be in freebase form than since I would have a liquid (hcl soulution + DMT) I would base with maybe 10g of NaOH, then pull with 50ml of solvent and evap that.
Basically just trying to reduce the amount of solvent I have to evap. I do many pulls and end up with 500+ml solvent.
Would I lose product through these extra 2 steps? or can I just have a finished product from salting.
Are DMT acetate/HCL and DMT freebase completely different? Can you smoke DMT acetate as you would freebase. or does the 'acetate' just mean is came from a acidic solution and 'freebase' mean it came from a basic solution.
The reason I ask is that I do dry Teks and use Ca(OH)2 to base.
I'd like to salt out with 50ml of HCL/water and evap that and be done, BUT if the spice must be in freebase form than since I would have a liquid (hcl soulution + DMT) I would base with maybe 10g of NaOH, then pull with 50ml of solvent and evap that.
Basically just trying to reduce the amount of solvent I have to evap. I do many pulls and end up with 500+ml solvent.
Would I lose product through these extra 2 steps? or can I just have a finished product from salting.
Attachments
Binary Drool said:
but with freeze precipitation you keep the solvent afterwards and an reuse it.. after evap its gone..
Bewakening
Rising Star
Extraction 1: San Pedro Alkaloid Extraction For Dummies – Erowid
https://www.erowid.org/plants/cacti/cacti_chemistry2.shtml
Cactus: approx. 18” of 13cm diameter fresh Peruvian Torch.
Aqueous extraction with acidic water. Distilled white vinegar (what was on hand) to bring the ph down to about 4.
Then xylene to de-fat. I never noticed any fat layer in these steps except a few tiny drops of oil between layers, but the layers separated well other than that.
Basification with sodium hydroxide to a ph of around 10.
Extracted the free bases with xylene, then distilled white vinegar straight, to hopefully form some sort of alkaloid salts.
Used a little vinegar at a time but still went a bit overboard and the end result seemed to have too much vinegar because the ph was around 4. The vinegar was quite cloudy though so it seemed encouraging.
Evaporated in pyrex dish next to a fan. Ended up with nice clear crystals floating on a orange tinted oil (result of unsuccessful de-fatting?). I may have been able to get those crystals off the top before that oil dried. But, the whole thing ended up being scraped and mixed and dried thoroughly in a food dehydrator.
Ended up with a strange looking substance with nice crystals mixed with a waxy resin like san pedro tar.
Edible?
The pic quality isn't great, sry. The flash was washing it out then the ambient light wasn't great, tried a flashlight.
Extraction 2: http://andyb.netlsd.com/mesc_extraction.html
Cactus: what was left over from my previous two “tea” attempts, dried to powder. I should have weighed it at that stage, I know now. But using this stuff was kind of a practice run, and to see if perhaps the soaking in lye with xylene wold get any goodies left in there.
I do know it was around 9 lbs. altogether when it was fresh San Pedro. What that works out to in dried after being boiled once previously...
Using vinegar again to form salts, thinking vinegar is so weak, I went overboard and ended up with a slightly acidic cloudy solution.
Here's where I when awol on the directions though and tried adding a little baking soda to neutralize the ph.
I know, never toss together anything super dangerous that you don't fully understand. But, a little baking soda to neutralize vinegar water seemed harmless. I didn't make sodium acetate though did I?
When about neutral, it was into the pyrex pan for a day or so to fully evaporate. Ended up with a beautiful pan of sparkly crystals that were clear as ice in some places and sort of whitish in others, plus the yield was a lot more than expected at a just over 12 grams.
So, what got created here, anyone? Crystals have a ph of about 5 or 4.. They don't taste salty, maybe a tiny bit sour and bitter. What are they?
Edible?
P.S. Just so you guys know, I don't plan on doing this weird a/b extraction stuff with vinegar again. Next time I would get Citric or HCL I think. But, I'm even more leaning towards the food safe methods and the oil extraction method I just learned about here. Thanks for any input on my current experiments though. :thumb_up:
https://www.erowid.org/plants/cacti/cacti_chemistry2.shtml
Cactus: approx. 18” of 13cm diameter fresh Peruvian Torch.
Aqueous extraction with acidic water. Distilled white vinegar (what was on hand) to bring the ph down to about 4.
Then xylene to de-fat. I never noticed any fat layer in these steps except a few tiny drops of oil between layers, but the layers separated well other than that.
Basification with sodium hydroxide to a ph of around 10.
Extracted the free bases with xylene, then distilled white vinegar straight, to hopefully form some sort of alkaloid salts.
Used a little vinegar at a time but still went a bit overboard and the end result seemed to have too much vinegar because the ph was around 4. The vinegar was quite cloudy though so it seemed encouraging.
Evaporated in pyrex dish next to a fan. Ended up with nice clear crystals floating on a orange tinted oil (result of unsuccessful de-fatting?). I may have been able to get those crystals off the top before that oil dried. But, the whole thing ended up being scraped and mixed and dried thoroughly in a food dehydrator.
Ended up with a strange looking substance with nice crystals mixed with a waxy resin like san pedro tar.
Edible?
The pic quality isn't great, sry. The flash was washing it out then the ambient light wasn't great, tried a flashlight.
Extraction 2: http://andyb.netlsd.com/mesc_extraction.html
Cactus: what was left over from my previous two “tea” attempts, dried to powder. I should have weighed it at that stage, I know now. But using this stuff was kind of a practice run, and to see if perhaps the soaking in lye with xylene wold get any goodies left in there.
I do know it was around 9 lbs. altogether when it was fresh San Pedro. What that works out to in dried after being boiled once previously...
Using vinegar again to form salts, thinking vinegar is so weak, I went overboard and ended up with a slightly acidic cloudy solution.
Here's where I when awol on the directions though and tried adding a little baking soda to neutralize the ph.
I know, never toss together anything super dangerous that you don't fully understand. But, a little baking soda to neutralize vinegar water seemed harmless. I didn't make sodium acetate though did I?
When about neutral, it was into the pyrex pan for a day or so to fully evaporate. Ended up with a beautiful pan of sparkly crystals that were clear as ice in some places and sort of whitish in others, plus the yield was a lot more than expected at a just over 12 grams.
So, what got created here, anyone? Crystals have a ph of about 5 or 4.. They don't taste salty, maybe a tiny bit sour and bitter. What are they?
Edible?
P.S. Just so you guys know, I don't plan on doing this weird a/b extraction stuff with vinegar again. Next time I would get Citric or HCL I think. But, I'm even more leaning towards the food safe methods and the oil extraction method I just learned about here. Thanks for any input on my current experiments though. :thumb_up:
Bewakening
Rising Star
I just watched the first MIT Reaction Work-Up video. Very nice, thanks. It seems everything was done correctly (except that baking soda thing
). Apparently a sep funnel makes things much easier.
). Apparently a sep funnel makes things much easier.
Bewakening
Rising Star
Here is what is hopefully a better question.
The lye being the thing I'm most worried about in the methods I described carrying over, and I made absolutely sure none of that lye layer ever got into anything else and even discarded a little good stuff to make sure.
Plus, the final salt making part with vinegar ended up being a little too acidic in the end. So, doesn't that mean there couldn't possibly be any lye in the end results?
All the xylene is definitely gone so, whatever's left should be good, no?
My only other question is whether or not adding baking soda to the vinegar at the end to neutralize it could have done anything bad.
Thank you.
The lye being the thing I'm most worried about in the methods I described carrying over, and I made absolutely sure none of that lye layer ever got into anything else and even discarded a little good stuff to make sure.
Plus, the final salt making part with vinegar ended up being a little too acidic in the end. So, doesn't that mean there couldn't possibly be any lye in the end results?
All the xylene is definitely gone so, whatever's left should be good, no?
My only other question is whether or not adding baking soda to the vinegar at the end to neutralize it could have done anything bad.
Thank you.
Bewakening
Rising Star
Alright you slow mofos I'm just going to eat it and see what happens. As far as I know it's clean so... here I go.
Don't know if anyone here gives a frak but I might as well post my experiences just in case I die because I'm an idiot and y'all are busy.
yay. I'm excited. Makes me feel young again. Bottoms up. Bottles to the ground.
Don't know if anyone here gives a frak but I might as well post my experiences just in case I die because I'm an idiot and y'all are busy.
yay. I'm excited. Makes me feel young again. Bottoms up. Bottles to the ground.
Bewakening
Rising Star
this is now officially the "go f yourself" forum or maybe nobody's at the helm. Either way it's pretty lame so far.
Did you check your PM yet or are you too 'slow mofo' for that too?Bewakening said:
Also, we like people here to do their home work and check things for themselves before asking basic questions. So that this will not become a place where you are spoon-fed but where in the end you are able to help yourself.
We have a rather nice FAQ btw.
Kind regards,
The Traveler
Bewakening
Rising Star
pm? no, I've been trying to decypher Bob's message for ME
Bob, the bob, the bestest bob who whas ever a bob.
the waiting is fine you lovely bastards. I love you anyway
Bob, the bob, the bestest bob who whas ever a bob.
the waiting is fine you lovely bastards. I love you anyway
Bewakening
Rising Star
Bewakening said:
You fluffy one, like I havn't read that and the all the other stickies and most of the techs and still found you wanting to answer my basic questions about my acetic acid.
funky, but if you are here now finally maybe I won't leave forever and take my wisdom elsewhere. no pressure just stop being silly myself and be real already!
