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Psychedelic drugs and addiction.
- Thread starter Opiyum
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cellux said:
Absolutely NOT...NO...NO...NO!!!!
Anyone telling you that, has never been involved with heroin & is full of shit!!
Or trying to sell some to you!
The only thing I could possibly call a spiritual benefit having to do with heroin is the fact that it takes every atom of strength you may have in you to really get away from that shit, once you are under in!!!
By the time you are honestly over that stuff, you will know the true depth of the horrible things you are capable of doing...And the true strength & determination you have within you as well!!
(But that second part only comes if you are actually able to get out from under it!! Most addicts do not.)
Now those are some good things to know about yourself, but there are a million & one better ways to go about learning them!!!!
And if I could trade not know those things about myself, for never have been addicted to heroin for 8 years...I wouldn't waste a 1/4 of second to decide to take them both away!
Anyone wondering what is so great about the effects of heroin, that people become so heavily addicted, the answer is NOTHING!!!
It's just another downer, like vicodin & codeine etc...
They are all the same damn thing...opiates.
The reason people get so hopelessly wrapped up in opiates is because they replace the natural "pain killers" (opiates) that your body makes, with an overload of artificial opiates.
When you do this for a number of days in a row, your body then stops making the natural opiates! Trying to regulate that body's overloaded opiate levels.
At that point, if you stop taking the heroin, or whatever other opiate you are using, you body has none of the regular pain killers in it, that it needs to be normal & you go into a horrible physical & mental withdraw where your body has to re-learn how to produce the natural opiates again.
This can last anywhere from 3-days, to over 3-months, depending on how long you have been using the artificial opiates & how much you've been using. You really dig your own grave with this shit!!
Opiate withdraw is the worst physical pain I've ever been in!! It is a throbbing, vibrating pain that comes from deep inside of your bones & muscles. It's always there, but also comes it heavier burst sometimes.
This is accompanied by flu-like symptoms as well...cold sweats, restless legs, muscle spasms, vomiting, diarrhea, runny nose, leaky eyes...basically you feel like you are falling apart physically.
Plus you are going through severe mental depression, with a "what's the F'n point of going through all this?" tone!! It's is so hard to get through the first few days of this & that is why people end up strung out for years in a row.
No one wants to be a junkie & every one that I know is quitting...tomorrow!
But it's just so damn easy to end all of that suffering, with just a little bit of dope. Three months later, you try again.
So it's not that heroin is some great, amazing, mind opening drug. Quite the opposite actually!
It's just another a narcotic drug, that moves into your body & replaces natural chemicals that you are supposed to be regularly producing, in order to think & feel...normal!!
Once a person is addicted to opiates, you don't even get high from them anymore, you just get to go back to feeling normal, instead of being physically sick & emotionally depressed!
You get addicted to not being sick!!
The "high" (if you can call it that) is going from feeling like your dieing...to feeling sort of normal, so you can function again...and go get more dope, so you don't get sick like that again.
It is a horrible cycle to get stuck in!!
Please, please, please stay away from opiates!!
They are only there to make money for the people producing them!
Keep this in mind:
Heroin is a product that guarantees the consumer is going to come back & buy more...every time!!
WS
Agree with almost every word ^
It's not a fun place to be. It changes you for the worse...people, relationships, life in general, none of it matters when you are deep in an opiate addiction. The ONLY thing that matters anymore is making sure you don't get sick from w/d's. It's a horrid place to be.
That being said I do know of a few people who use it recreationally without the addiction, but they only use it every few months. I only know 2 people who have done this and NOT gotten hooked.
Generally I advise people to stay away from opiates if they can help it.
It's not a fun place to be. It changes you for the worse...people, relationships, life in general, none of it matters when you are deep in an opiate addiction. The ONLY thing that matters anymore is making sure you don't get sick from w/d's. It's a horrid place to be.
That being said I do know of a few people who use it recreationally without the addiction, but they only use it every few months. I only know 2 people who have done this and NOT gotten hooked.
Generally I advise people to stay away from opiates if they can help it.
Yea, that is true, I didn't mean it to sound like you try it once & you or going through all of that.
Although that is one of the ways a lot of people get hooked, because you try it once & you don't get addicted, so next weekend you do it again, but this time you do it 2 days in a row & your still fine. Then the next week it a bit more & before you know it you are getting sick if you don't have the shit to put into you body. Yuck!
I remember not being able to go out with friends, because I knew if I was gone from the house too long, I wouldn't be able to fix & I'd get all fucked up.
Man I do not miss that shit at all!!
WS
Although that is one of the ways a lot of people get hooked, because you try it once & you don't get addicted, so next weekend you do it again, but this time you do it 2 days in a row & your still fine. Then the next week it a bit more & before you know it you are getting sick if you don't have the shit to put into you body. Yuck!
I remember not being able to go out with friends, because I knew if I was gone from the house too long, I wouldn't be able to fix & I'd get all fucked up.
Man I do not miss that shit at all!!
WS
warrensaged said:
^ this is exactly how it got me. I did it once and felt sick as hell for a few hours...was like, yeah, not for me. A week later I tried just a tad and felt great...so I did it again the next day and felt wonderful! Two weeks after that I was a full blown addict. I don't miss it at all either. Good freaking riddens! Though I do have nostalgic moments at times, but then I remember that the bad times seriously outweighed the few good times I had.
This is a topic that brings up a lot of conflicting thoughts and emotions for me. I am a recovering alcoholic/heroin addict as well, and having spent a very significant amount of time engaged in both active addiction and recovery (achieved through similar means; i.e. in/out-patient rehabs, group/private therapy, 12-step programs, etc.), it's not always an easy thing for me to reconcile an ongoing relationship with psychedelics. On the one hand, DMT has challenged my notions about the overall nature of (my) addiction (along with just about everything else) - and this I consider a good thing. On the other hand, my fascination (or some might say my preoccupation or obsession) with the experience, as well as the clandestine and compartmentalized manner in which I have integrated it into my life, is arguably not so healthy. I've written about this elsewhere on the forum, so I won't go into detail, but I was 12 years clean before I made the attempt to reconnect, and though I don't think of myself as "clean" in the present, I'm (in most respects) pretty okay with it.
My advice to you, however, would be to tread very lightly right now. Early recovery is an extremely delicate time, and one that requires a very dilligent and single-minded effort. It's very easy to remove the drug and simply replace it with something else with which to fill that hole (such as, for example, psychedelics... or gambling... or hookers... or pursuit of material things... or anything else which might provide a bit of temporary distraction). But addictions don't just happen in a vacuum, and they are often (I believe) a symptom or by-product of a greater spiritual malaise. Now, there is a world of difference between heroin and DMT. And though heroin addiction is a shitty endless grind, it's a very easy place to return to. The high doesn't provoke or confront you in any way - it's just vegetable warmth and serenity. Eventually, of course, it steals everything you've got, but that's not always an adequate deterrent. DMT, on the other hand, is never easy or passive. It's confrontational in the extreme, and extreme in all it's limitless and contradictory facets. The danger is always (especially so early in recovery) that you will, in a moment of weakness or resignation, seek refuge in the familiar. Another concern (for me, at least) is that the DMT experience, while beautiful and extraordinary, can be extremely isolating - and isolation is not a great ally in anyone's fight for recovery.
The 12-step world (although instrumental in saving and reclaiming my life) was just never a comfortable fit for me. It's too black and white, too rigid in its dogma, too narrow in many respects - and the one thing I've learned from DMT is that there is no black and white... with anything. There is no one correct answer to anything you seek. Beware of anyone telling you otherwise.
My advice to you, however, would be to tread very lightly right now. Early recovery is an extremely delicate time, and one that requires a very dilligent and single-minded effort. It's very easy to remove the drug and simply replace it with something else with which to fill that hole (such as, for example, psychedelics... or gambling... or hookers... or pursuit of material things... or anything else which might provide a bit of temporary distraction). But addictions don't just happen in a vacuum, and they are often (I believe) a symptom or by-product of a greater spiritual malaise. Now, there is a world of difference between heroin and DMT. And though heroin addiction is a shitty endless grind, it's a very easy place to return to. The high doesn't provoke or confront you in any way - it's just vegetable warmth and serenity. Eventually, of course, it steals everything you've got, but that's not always an adequate deterrent. DMT, on the other hand, is never easy or passive. It's confrontational in the extreme, and extreme in all it's limitless and contradictory facets. The danger is always (especially so early in recovery) that you will, in a moment of weakness or resignation, seek refuge in the familiar. Another concern (for me, at least) is that the DMT experience, while beautiful and extraordinary, can be extremely isolating - and isolation is not a great ally in anyone's fight for recovery.
The 12-step world (although instrumental in saving and reclaiming my life) was just never a comfortable fit for me. It's too black and white, too rigid in its dogma, too narrow in many respects - and the one thing I've learned from DMT is that there is no black and white... with anything. There is no one correct answer to anything you seek. Beware of anyone telling you otherwise.
Thank you all for great reply's.
Good to get a warning about Ketamine. I tried it for the first time in some warehouse party in London early this summer. I only had a little but had always been very curious about it. I really liked it and how spaced I felt.
Since then I've always been on my way to buy some and do it properly. I can get my hands on some good K but now I'm a bit scared I might get hooked. 'Cause I know what things I get hooked on and Ketamine could easily bee on of those things.
And Heroin too. I've never tried it but have also been very curious and if offered I would probably have taken it but now I'm not so sure. I've had quite high doses of Tramadol so I can imagine what way it takes you.
I have tendencies to get addicted to substances. I always have to be careful not to bullshit myself into doing stuff. I used to drink heavily and smoke pot every day from dusk till dawn and abuse speed.
But psychedelics helped me get myself on track. Mostly shrooms, I love them. And DMT came later in my life and it's just starting it's lessons for me. I'm extracting some now and shroom season is starting where I live now so I'll be having some magical combos soon
Praise the Nexus for it's awesome members
I like it here
But psychedelics have never been a problem
Good to get a warning about Ketamine. I tried it for the first time in some warehouse party in London early this summer. I only had a little but had always been very curious about it. I really liked it and how spaced I felt.
Since then I've always been on my way to buy some and do it properly. I can get my hands on some good K but now I'm a bit scared I might get hooked. 'Cause I know what things I get hooked on and Ketamine could easily bee on of those things.
And Heroin too. I've never tried it but have also been very curious and if offered I would probably have taken it but now I'm not so sure. I've had quite high doses of Tramadol so I can imagine what way it takes you.
I have tendencies to get addicted to substances. I always have to be careful not to bullshit myself into doing stuff. I used to drink heavily and smoke pot every day from dusk till dawn and abuse speed.
But psychedelics helped me get myself on track. Mostly shrooms, I love them. And DMT came later in my life and it's just starting it's lessons for me. I'm extracting some now and shroom season is starting where I live now so I'll be having some magical combos soon
Praise the Nexus for it's awesome members
I like it here
But psychedelics have never been a problem
Be carefull with ketamine, its a substance you can easily take very regularly. Though its fairly safe as a one off, with frequent use it starts getting messy. Aswell as turning you into a zombie, it rots your bladder, liver, and fucks your nose up. It can also cause nightmares and sleep paralysis, which can be very unpleasant and starts to screw with your thoughts and concentration.
I stopped using it as i began to see other people getting messed up. But it is far too popular in the UK recently.
I stopped using it as i began to see other people getting messed up. But it is far too popular in the UK recently.
DMTripper said:
Anyone who knows this about himself should seriously stay away from opiates in general, but specifically heroin would be a real bad idea!!!
You are not missing anything at all by having never tried it!!
Cheers!
WS
Thank's for your posts. They were really valuable to me. I know you guy's have the experience to share your knowledge. Not just anyone could have reached me and told me to stay out of K and H. Well society tells you to stay the fuck out of all these things but I fortunately haven't always listened to society but I listen to people like the good people here
I'm already 33 years old but heroin has never crossed my path. Fortunately not because I can get a bit extreme and I I've delt with addiction so it would probably have gone quite bad. But it could always happen some day that someone offers me to chase the dragon or something that "harmless" and this thread will keep me away if that happens some day.
Yeah the nexus is a good place
p.s. hehe I just find it kind of weird that you guy's here can really affect my doings 'cause not even my mom was ever able to guide me from doing stupid things hahahah
p.p.s And I was very close to go get me some K. Been thinking about it lately. And how you describe the effects and what it does to you is a good warning. Ketamine is obviously something I could loose myself in and I sooo can't afford to mess up my life now. I have a wonderful wife that's very understanding but doesn't use anything herself and I have a wonderful daughter of 20 months that needs her dad to be ok in the head.
I consider myself very lucky to be where I am today. Nothing is more important to me than not to fuck my life up again. It was messy when I was younger, well kind of until I met my wife.
I'm already 33 years old but heroin has never crossed my path. Fortunately not because I can get a bit extreme and I I've delt with addiction so it would probably have gone quite bad. But it could always happen some day that someone offers me to chase the dragon or something that "harmless" and this thread will keep me away if that happens some day.
Yeah the nexus is a good place
p.s. hehe I just find it kind of weird that you guy's here can really affect my doings 'cause not even my mom was ever able to guide me from doing stupid things
hahahahp.p.s And I was very close to go get me some K. Been thinking about it lately. And how you describe the effects and what it does to you is a good warning. Ketamine is obviously something I could loose myself in and I sooo can't afford to mess up my life now. I have a wonderful wife that's very understanding but doesn't use anything herself and I have a wonderful daughter of 20 months that needs her dad to be ok in the head.
I consider myself very lucky to be where I am today. Nothing is more important to me than not to fuck my life up again. It was messy when I was younger, well kind of until I met my wife.
explorer83
Rising Star
DMTripper said:Thank's for your posts. They were really valuable to me. I know you guy's have the experience to share your knowledge. Not just anyone could have reached me and told me to stay out of K and H. Well society tells you to stay the fuck out of all these things but I fortunately haven't always listened to society but I listen to people like the good people here
I'm already 33 years old but heroin has never crossed my path. Fortunately not because I can get a bit extreme and I I've delt with addiction so it would probably have gone quite bad. But it could always happen some day that someone offers me to chase the dragon or something that "harmless" and this thread will keep me away if that happens some day.
Yeah the nexus is a good place
p.s. hehe I just find it kind of weird that you guy's here can really affect my doings 'cause not even my mom was ever able to guide me from doing stupid things
p.p.s And I was very close to go get me some K. Been thinking about it lately. And how you describe the effects and what it does to you is a good warning. Ketamine is obviously something I could loose myself in and I sooo can't afford to mess up my life now. I have a wonderful wife that's very understanding but doesn't use anything herself and I have a wonderful daughter of 20 months that needs her dad to be ok in the head.
I consider myself very lucky to be where I am today. Nothing is more important to me than not to fuck my life up again. It was messy when I was younger, well kind of until I met my wife.
I have experiemnted with Ketamine and other potentially addictive chemicals in moderation and haven't had any serious issues myself, but you are correct to stay away from them if you have an addictive personality. Sounds like you have too many good things going on to risk it.
The fact that you listen to people here and not in real life(including people who love you) helps to prove that people who are understanding, open, and have gone through what you have can do a much better job at influencing people's behavior for the better than the average person/means. This is of particular interest to me as I am working on a Master's of Public Health.
Went on a camping trip this weekend. Myself and a friend canoed 14 miles down river till we reached an island which is where we camped for the night. The next day was another 14 mile trip back to the car.
I brought some DMT freebase for my friend who has been very interested in trying it. We agreed a month ago that this trip would make for the perfect setting in which to take ones first trip.
I myself decided to partake too.
I took my first hit around noon on the first day while still in the canoe going down river. The water was very still and I layed back in the canoe so falling in the water wasn't a big concern, not to mention this river was only 3 foot deep. I took a very small hit. I didn't want a full blown experience and certainly didn't want to break through on the canoe. It was quite amazing to say the least. The sharpness and crispness of the trees and clouds was overwhelming. It was great because the whole time we were moving so the scenery was changing constantly but the whole time there was a large hill a few hundred yard down river that dominated the view. All in all it was beautiful.
Once night fell and we had a fire going my friend decided it was time. He had trouble with the smoke. His first hit was waaaay too small and after 60 seconds it was clear he didn't get much of anything from it so we tried again. This time he got a slightly bigger hit but still wasn't enough. He didn't get any closed eye visuals but did experience a good deal of the physical effects. He noticed the sharpness it the environment that I had talked about and enjoyed the electricity that he felt flowing through his arms.
He said that it was the only drug he has ever done that after wards made him actually feel better. Like a new man. No hangover, No cracked out/weak feeling. Instead he felt revitalized.
I too took another hit after he had come down and the experience I had while sitting in front of that fire was amazing. I couldn't tell where my body ended and the physical world around me began including the fire. The fire seemed to radiate through everything around me, including me. I didn't have much on me so two low doses were all I could partake in but they were perfect.
DMT is a beautiful drug and I now know that it is something I will only use on occasions like this one.
Prior to these two doses I had a nightmarish experience in my apartment. I was in a somewhat bad place when I used it and wasn't ready to let go and I payed the price for this.
I love how different the experience can be from a low dose to a high. It's like two different drugs in one.
I have only had one real "breakthrough" experience and that was when I used the DMT Fumarate. I have never been able to with smoking being the ROA.
This past weekend was a great example of sober fun. Even without the DMT this weekend was a huge eye opener for me.
Life is beautiful.
I brought some DMT freebase for my friend who has been very interested in trying it. We agreed a month ago that this trip would make for the perfect setting in which to take ones first trip.
I myself decided to partake too.
I took my first hit around noon on the first day while still in the canoe going down river. The water was very still and I layed back in the canoe so falling in the water wasn't a big concern, not to mention this river was only 3 foot deep. I took a very small hit. I didn't want a full blown experience and certainly didn't want to break through on the canoe. It was quite amazing to say the least. The sharpness and crispness of the trees and clouds was overwhelming. It was great because the whole time we were moving so the scenery was changing constantly but the whole time there was a large hill a few hundred yard down river that dominated the view. All in all it was beautiful.
Once night fell and we had a fire going my friend decided it was time. He had trouble with the smoke. His first hit was waaaay too small and after 60 seconds it was clear he didn't get much of anything from it so we tried again. This time he got a slightly bigger hit but still wasn't enough. He didn't get any closed eye visuals but did experience a good deal of the physical effects. He noticed the sharpness it the environment that I had talked about and enjoyed the electricity that he felt flowing through his arms.
He said that it was the only drug he has ever done that after wards made him actually feel better. Like a new man. No hangover, No cracked out/weak feeling. Instead he felt revitalized.
I too took another hit after he had come down and the experience I had while sitting in front of that fire was amazing. I couldn't tell where my body ended and the physical world around me began including the fire. The fire seemed to radiate through everything around me, including me. I didn't have much on me so two low doses were all I could partake in but they were perfect.
DMT is a beautiful drug and I now know that it is something I will only use on occasions like this one.
Prior to these two doses I had a nightmarish experience in my apartment. I was in a somewhat bad place when I used it and wasn't ready to let go and I payed the price for this.
I love how different the experience can be from a low dose to a high. It's like two different drugs in one.
I have only had one real "breakthrough" experience and that was when I used the DMT Fumarate. I have never been able to with smoking being the ROA.
This past weekend was a great example of sober fun. Even without the DMT this weekend was a huge eye opener for me.
Life is beautiful.
explorer83
Rising Star
That sounds like a great experience and that things are going better for you, Opiyum. That's a trip(no pun intended) that I would have loved to gone on as well. There's nothing better than the wilderness, a good friend, and a psychedelic to remind you of your roots and what matters in this world.
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