Syrian Rue tea and a couple vape puffs

[The Sofa Traveler]

Maybe my interpretation is wrong, but this reads as an admission, especially, the phrasing "mission accomplished" is very telling. However, I do need to thank you for your overenthusiastic stance on harmala alkaloids. It is making me curious, and I want to see what all the fuss is about, so perhaps in the near future I will make isolated harmalas. So again, thank you.

Yes, mission accomplished because I aimed to share some elements in favor of extracts to balance your rather negative ones. Now it's done, I feel my mission is accomplished. I'm French and we often use the idiom "mission accomplie" to talk about things we have done. Don't overthink it, there is nothing to interpret.
Also, I realize I was lacking precision about my personal use of harmal : I advocate for harmal in any form, absolutely any, and love them all. That's why I said all approaches have their pros and cons and to each their own depending on their use and needs. No approach should be dismissed.
My tea years were memorable, and although I tend to prefer extracts nowadays, I don't dismiss tea and never will. If I favor extracts currently it's because they fit the most to my needs and current practices, which include introducing people to DMT and harmal combo, where dosage consistency/accuracy and nausea alleviating is important. I sometimes also enjoy having sublingual doses or smoke harmal infused herbs (mullein).
Don't force yourself to make extractions and use extracts if you don't feel so and don't need it. I never said one should have extracts over tea or whole seeds. To each their own depending on their needs (bis if not ter repetita).
All this clarified, I'm gonna leave this thread, because I think I said all I had to say. "Mission accomplie". I don't think continuing to interact would help OP further and lead to something more constructive, especially when I feel an underlying tension because of misinterpretations or overthinking. I feel like we're going around in circles a bit.

 

[JosBoaz]

Sounds like a political debate

I don't share this view, I think this is a healthy discussion between refined gentlemen whereby each of the participants eloquently broadcasts their views on this matter. This goes for the following members,
@The Sofa Traveler
@harmala_afficianado
@Panpsychic
@JosBoaz

 

[northape]

@harmala_afficianado
@Panpsychic
@JosBoaz

You three refined gentlemen eloquently broadcast your views in every thread. It's beyond bias at this point and closer to preaching. Hiding behind a polite, cold persona doesn't work on me either. What I see in this thread is pure dogma in colorful clothes. @The Sofa Traveler kindly explained his views, and you all kept interrogating him like it's a crime scene. Well done; go play among yourselves now

 

[The Sofa Traveler]

I couldn't leave this thread without a constructive outcome. For OP and also for @JosBoaz and @Panpsychic, who seem to struggle with Tao of Rue tek, here is another one with more concise writing and some personal insights : forget Tao of rue and forget the hassle of manske/HCL. Freebase will cover all of your uses (oral, sublingual, smoked, even snorted), it's the most versatile form and the one who requires the less work. Here is the tek I use for my extractions - thanks @CosmicLion, Nexus is missing you - that I tweaked as follows :

• No need to grind/powder seeds : it's just more hassle to filter (it's not an instruction from this tek but from Tao of Rue). Time saving.
• Other than vinegar (acetic acid) can be used instead, I always use citric acid and have a pH of 4-5 in sight. If you can't measure pH precisely it's not a problem, pH strips do the job, the most important is that the water is acidified enough. Not too much because it could create an emulsion when you add the base. Weigh/measure your acid and water amounts, so you don't have longer to check the pH for next extractions.
• Start from sodium carbonate (SC) rather than converting baking soda to SC. Time saving.
• Prefer SC over lye, it requires less caution, it's less expensive and doesn't affect the yield (this tek doesn't mention lye but Tao of Rue does). Risks and cautions saving.
• You can discard first gunk from tea by passing the brew through a cotton cloth if you don't want to wait hours for the gunk settling at the bottom of the bottle (that's what I do). Time saving.
• Saturated Sodium Carbonate Solution (SSCS in the tek) can be done with measured amounts using a ratio of 2g SC/1cl water. Heat slightly the water for faster dissolving.
• Repeating the refining crude extracts steps 2 times is enough. You won't get much purer harmalas from repeating the step more times. Time saving.
• After the refining steps done twice, pour distilled water over the harmalas in the coffee filter until the water color is no longer yellowish. This is not mentioned in the tek but it's what allows to stick to only 2 refining steps.
• Dry -> enjoy.

Over time, you'll find yourself adding your own tricks, adjusting brew simmering time, using more adequate amounts of SSCS and so on.

Doing so really doesn't require high commitment. As I said, most of the time taken by the extraction is decanting time. You can expect 5% average yield of nice clear tan freebase (see pic), with variations in yield depending on seeds alkaloids content. Sometimes you might have weak seeds with only 3-4% content and sometimes (rarely) exceptionally high content seeds with 6-8%.
You can get your final product in 2-4 days if you accelerate the drying steps using a heat source. I’m never in a rush because I plan ahead for the extraction; I don’t wait until my last dose to get started.
Doses wise : freebase requires lower amounts than HCL. Tracers land start from 200-250mg doses. 400mg doses are more challenging. Expect insane tracers and stroboscopic visuals, auditory distortions, hypnagogic states and difficulties to move. My usual dose for more or less daily use is 150mg (oral) or 60/70mg (sublingual). Oral dose can be taken in capsule, freebase will be converted to salts by stomach hydrochloric acid. For faster absorption, freebase can also beforehand be dissolved in a few lemon juice (harmalas citrate), add a few water and gulp down the hatch (my favored method, kicks in faster). For sublingual use I put the powder in a capsule, drill small holes in it with a syringe needle, give it a bean shape and put it under the tongue. All should have been absorbed in about 15mn. Powder can be smoked/vaporized as it is but tend to clog if you roll it in a joint. Infused herbs to be smoked/vaporized can be done with IPA.
Those aiming for harmine/harmaline separation will need precise pH meter. It implies yield loss and more time consuming. I prefer to stick to mixed harmine/harmaline freebase. Harmaline brings its own psychedelic touch to rue experience.

Hope this helps.

*End of transmission*

 

[Panpsychic]

My tea years were memorable, and although I tend to prefer extracts nowadays, I don't dismiss tea and never will. If I favor extracts currently it's because they fit the most to my needs and current practices, which include introducing people to DMT and harmal combo, where dosage consistency/accuracy and nausea alleviating is important. I sometimes also enjoy having sublingual doses or smoke harmal infused herbs (mullein).

I just want to comment again that, for dose consistency when introducing to others, tea is perfectly adequate. In any case it is more down to the individual how they respond but if you brewed some tea based on a set amount of seeds and then tested it for strength you will have a fairly accurate idea of how much is needed for a dose.

As to nausea - is this just due to taste, or can extracts also cause nausea? A good blend of the tea with another drink, for me this is usually non-alcholic Ginger ale or it can be something like cacao as suggested, cuts the taste and minimises nausea.

Then you also get the chance to serve it up in a more ritualistic format, which can aid with set and setting and is a nice aesthetic.

I couldn't resist to post this again on a thread about the tea because, Rue does not exist and nor has it just come to us in a vacuum.
For example using a Goblet - like the ancient tradition.

5000 year old Rue tea goblet from Jiroft

I couldn't leave this thread without a constructive outcome. For OP and also for @JosBoaz and @Panpsychic, who seem to struggle with Tao of Rue tek, here is another one with more concise writing and some personal insights : forget Tao of rue and forget the hassle of manske/HCL. Freebase will cover all of your uses (oral, sublingual, smoked, even snorted), it's the most versatile form and the one who requires the less work. Here is the tek I use for my extractions - thanks @CosmicLion, Nexus is missing you - that I tweaked as follows :

• No need to grind/powder seeds : it's just more hassle to filter (it's not an instruction from this tek but from Tao of Rue). Time saving.
• Other than vinegar (acetic acid) can be used instead, I always use citric acid and have a pH of 4-5 in sight. If you can't measure pH precisely it's not a problem, pH strips do the job, the most important is that the water is acidified enough. Not too much because it could create an emulsion when you add the base. Weigh/measure your acid and water amounts, so you don't have longer to check the pH for next extractions.
• Start from sodium carbonate (SC) rather than converting baking soda to SC. Time saving.
• Prefer SC over lye, it requires less caution, it's less expensive and doesn't affect the yield (this tek doesn't mention lye but Tao of Rue does). Risks and cautions saving.
• You can discard first gunk from tea by passing the brew through a cotton cloth if you don't want to wait hours for the gunk settling at the bottom of the bottle (that's what I do). Time saving.
• Saturated Sodium Carbonate Solution (SSCS in the tek) can be done with measured amounts using a ratio of 2g SC/1cl water. Heat slightly the water for faster dissolving.
• Repeating the refining crude extracts steps 2 times is enough. You won't get much purer harmalas from repeating the step more times. Time saving.
• After the refining steps done twice, pour distilled water over the harmalas in the coffee filter until the water color is no longer yellowish. This is not mentioned in the tek but it's what allows to stick to only 2 refining steps.
• Dry -> enjoy.

Over time, you'll find yourself adding your own tricks, adjusting brew simmering time, using more adequate amounts of SSCS and so on.

Doing so really doesn't require high commitment. As I said, most of the time taken by the extraction is decanting time. You can expect 5% average yield of nice clear tan freebase (see pic), with variations in yield depending on seeds alkaloids content. Sometimes you might have weak seeds with only 3-4% content and sometimes (rarely) exceptionally high content seeds with 6-8%.
You can get your final product in 2-4 days if you accelerate the drying steps using a heat source. I’m never in a rush because I plan ahead for the extraction; I don’t wait until my last dose to get started.
Doses wise : freebase requires lower amounts than HCL. Tracers land start from 200-250mg doses. 400mg doses are more challenging. Expect insane tracers and stroboscopic visuals, auditory distortions, hypnagogic states and difficulties to move. My usual dose for more or less daily use is 150mg (oral) or 60/70mg (sublingual). Oral dose can be taken in capsule, freebase will be converted to salts by stomach hydrochloric acid. For faster absorption, freebase can also beforehand be dissolved in a few lemon juice (harmalas citrate), add a few water and gulp down the hatch. For sublingual use I put the powder in a capsule, drill small holes in it with a syringe needle, give it a bean shape and put it under the tongue. All should have been absorbed in about 15mn. Powder can be smoked/vaporized as it is but tend to clog if you roll it in a joint. Infused herbs to be smoked/vaporized can be done with IPA.
Those aiming for harmine/harmaline separation will need precise pH meter. It implies yield loss and more time consuming. I prefer to stick to mixed harmine/harmaline freebase. Harmaline brings its own psychedelic touch to rue experience.

Hope this helps.

*End of transmission*

View attachment 111963

Thanks for this, if I consider to experiment with extracts in future you provided some good resources.

 

[The Sofa Traveler]

I just want to comment again that, for dose consistency when introducing to others, tea is perfectly adequate. In any case it is more down to the individual how they respond but if you brewed some tea based on a set amount of seeds and then tested it for strength you will have a fairly accurate idea of how much is needed for a dose.

As to nausea - is this just due to taste, or can extracts also cause nausea? A good blend of the tea with another drink, for me this is usually non-alcholhic Ginger ale or it can be something like cacao as suggested, cuts the taste and minimises nausea.

Then you also get the chance to serve it up in a more ritualistic format, which can aid with set and setting and is a nice aesthetic.

I couldn't resist to post this again on a thread about the tea because, Rue does not exist and nor has it just come to us in a vacuum.
For example using a Goblet - like the ancient tradition.

5000 year old Rue tea goblet from Ziroft
View attachment 111964
View attachment 111965



Thanks for this, if I consider to experiment with extracts in future you provided some good resources.

Please, stop trying to impose your views on me. I'm experienced enough with rue as well as DMT to know what I do and why I do how I do. I have a fair share of experience introducing people to rue in any form - including tea - and DMT medicine, as well as self practice with them, separately or together. Do you I do me.

To each their own depending on their needs (bis if not ter repetita).

And also :

*End of transmission*

This is the very last message from me in this thread.

 

[Panpsychic]

Please, stop trying to impose your views on me. I'm experienced enough with rue as well as DMT to know what I do and why I do how I do. I have a fair share of experience introducing people to rue in any form - including tea - and DMT medicine, as well as self practice with them, separately or together. Do you I do me.

And also :

This is the very last message from me in this thread.

Could you clarify what views exactly are trying to be 'imposed on you'? I guess not since you keep exiting the thread then coming back.

Just to be clear though, you made some exaggerated claims seemingly to endorse your use of extracts- such as the idea that tea becomes horrible to drink after a few days when in reality there is little to no change to the taste even after weeks in the fridge. These claims were refuted.

Likewise about dosage accuracy - it can be fairly consistent with tea from the same brew so isnt an issue with introducing to new people if you brew from the same batch and with the same amount of seeds. Obviously extraction will be more accurate but that isn't some big deterrent to administering the tea.

What strikes me is, joining this discussion about half way in, is how sensitive and touchy people seem to be here about having a little discussion. Somewhat ironic since this is a psychedelic discussion site, but
if all that work with psychedelics has left one overly reactive and sensitive to mild disagreements, perhaps there's a lot of work to do still, that's all I will say. Not a comment on you particularly just a general trend I have noticed with many posters on the site.